Gear loudout for Belial?

[Roma]

I plan on taking storm shield+thunder hammer so he can duel and LOS-protect his non-storm shield squad.

Yet I very often see people taking sword+bolter instead.

 

Which do oyu personally think is better?

[Spaniard]

Personally i find the sword and stormbolter alot more reliable, since i always find myself having him accompany a somewhat shoot and cc unit.

[Disruptor_fe404]

Not long ago, I thought storm bolter and sword were optimal, since I didn't want to waste his 5+ precision shooting.

 

But someone has pointed out to me that he can eat high-AP shooting weapons with his 3++ (and FNP, in my case) and pawn off the failed saves via LO,S! onto a random Terminator around him. Which I think may be worth giving up the (admittedly lacklustre) 5+ precision with a storm bolter.

[Chaplain Lucifer]

In 5th ed.TH&SS was the best loadot for him.. Nowadays, he has an iron halo which makes his ini5 attacks with a very lethal sword the best loadout.

[shabbadoo]

^This.^  The sword and stormbolter with extra precision awesomeness is generally the best load-out.  If you need some punch, put a TH & SS Terminator or two a unit Belial will join, and let Belial's job be to thin the enemy ranks.

[shortysl]

In 5th ed.TH&SS was the best loadot for him.. Nowadays, he has an iron halo which makes his ini5 attacks with a very lethal sword the best loadout.

I tend to prefer the sword too; being able to hurt Monstrous Creatures before they strike, or the occasional Power Fist wielding model (that isn't another Terminator) is just too useful, although I don't tend to find Precision Shot on a Storm Bolter that good to be honest.

[Roma]

The sword is ap3 right? thats pretty weak. Just not good enough imo.

[elphilo]

In 5th ed.TH&SS was the best loadot for him.. Nowadays, he has an iron halo which makes his ini5 attacks with a very lethal sword the best loadout.

 

 

^This.^  The sword and stormbolter with extra precision awesomeness is generally the best load-out.  If you need some punch, put a TH & SS Terminator or two a unit Belial will join, and let Belial's job be to thin the enemy ranks.

This is what I do and I haven't looked back.

The sword is ap3 right? thats pretty weak. Just not good enough imo.

While you're right that its only AP3, the general thinking is, now that Belial doesn't have to sacrifice his Initiative to gain a decent invulnerable save, you shouldn't. As a Marine player your highest initiative model will be your HQ. And its a shame to waste it to increase his invulnerable and AP by only 1. While that AP is a big deal, the invulnerable not so much. Plus if you load his squad with some power fists/TH&SS then you'll be covered with your AP2 needs.

[Fenric]

I will magnetize it and try both but I feel the sword and stormbolter is more flexible and more fun. The entire squad hit's with str 8 ap2 basically so nice to have someone that hits faster and has a really good and cool sword. Big chance of killing 3 marines per round with him before anyone else hits. Only thing he will be worse at is challanges vs melee (monsters) and soaking if you want to do that but since you are in a squad with only 1 wound each the allocating isn't worth that much.  I will just get it on a standard terminator instead to soak a bit of heavy shooting and have Belial kill of a heavy weapon or powerfist single wound champion instead and then thin them out at Ini 5.

 

Also you must surely allocate the wounds before you take the save and not after a failed save from Belial!?

[Roma]

Hmmm some good points. Ill play test and see what happens I guess.

[Drunkspleen]

Not long ago, I thought storm bolter and sword were optimal, since I didn't want to waste his 5+ precision shooting.

 

But someone has pointed out to me that he can eat high-AP shooting weapons with his 3++ (and FNP, in my case) and pawn off the failed saves via LO,S! onto a random Terminator around him. Which I think may be worth giving up the (admittedly lacklustre) 5+ precision with a storm bolter.

 

Do note, that unless your whole unit has 3++ saves from Storm Shields, you are meant to use the mixed armour saves rules if a high AP shot comes in, which includes rolling Look Out Sir before you roll for saves.

 

You can't take the save on Belial's 3++ then shrug it off onto a normal 5++ model.

[shortysl]

The sword is ap3 right? thats pretty weak. Just not good enough imo.

It is, hence my comment about engaging non-Terminator models with him. To be fair, I also wouldn't call AP3 weak either; while I grant that there are a lot of Space Marine players out there, AP3 is sufficient to defeat the armour of anything but the most powerful of models in the game.

[Disruptor_fe404]

Do note, that unless your whole unit has 3++ saves from Storm Shields, you are meant to use the mixed armour saves rules if a high AP shot comes in, which includes rolling Look Out Sir before you roll for saves.

 

You can't take the save on Belial's 3++ then shrug it off onto a normal 5++ model.

 

Is that so? Then it appears that some lied to me. Time to hunt them down and extract the truth.

[[TA]Typher]

I can see the benefit from both loadouts. I usually don't use the sword/SB option just because he doesn't have eternal warrior and the extra invuln point helps. As mainly a DW player Belial is almost always my warlord. Protecting him helps. Also the fact that he can double out most other warlords is a bigdeal. Watching the enemy warlord crumble to the ground just because he failed 1 save is priceless.

 

Overall I guess it would matter on who you played against. The Sword would do better against a few of the armies, but I think the hammer is consistently better.

 

 

I should try his sword one of these days just to do it.

[Brother Darklight]

The sword is ap3 right? thats pretty weak. Just not good enough imo.

Fleshbane and mastercrafted ap3... That's not so weak, I'd say 

[elphilo]

 

 

Do note, that unless your whole unit has 3++ saves from Storm Shields, you are meant to use the mixed armour saves rules if a high AP shot comes in, which includes rolling Look Out Sir before you roll for saves.

 

You can't take the save on Belial's 3++ then shrug it off onto a normal 5++ model.

 

Is that so? Then it appears that some lied to me. Time to hunt them down and extract the truth.

 

 

Yep. All Look Out Sir rolls are done BEFORE the save is actually rolled.

[IndigoJack]

For reference to LOS!, you're going to need to check the BYB FAQ since it was errata'd from what the rulebook says.

 

As far as his weapons loadout goes, I prefer the SoS these days. Echoing what others have said, Fleshbane is a fantastic rule, and he hits most things on a 3+ at I5. Is he going to be great at taking out other powerhouse HQs? Unfortunately no (which makes me angry about his warlord trait >.<), but he's still going to put a serious hurt on most things in the game.

[Brother Amarel]

 

Not long ago, I thought storm bolter and sword were optimal, since I didn't want to waste his 5+ precision shooting.

 

But someone has pointed out to me that he can eat high-AP shooting weapons with his 3++ (and FNP, in my case) and pawn off the failed saves via LO,S! onto a random Terminator around him. Which I think may be worth giving up the (admittedly lacklustre) 5+ precision with a storm bolter.

 

Do note, that unless your whole unit has 3++ saves from Storm Shields, you are meant to use the mixed armour saves rules if a high AP shot comes in, which includes rolling Look Out Sir before you roll for saves.

 

You can't take the save on Belial's 3++ then shrug it off onto a normal 5++ model.

 

Not in 6th - you use majority Toughness, but Save individually. Look Out Sir is declared on wound allocation, before Saves are made, though.

[Balthamal]

Just my quick 2p for the comments regarding the sword only being Ap3. AP3 at I5 w/ wounds on 2+ regardless is quite frankly awesome. And the simple solution to an AP3 weapon is don't throw it in against 2+ units

[Brother-Sergeant Bohemond]

SS/SB is the best combo as it makes use of all his rules

[Dark_Dell]

For all the nay Sayers th/as reigns supreme as my Beliel and interrogator Chaplin tabled 2 purifier squads a riflemen dread and a gk termy squad in 3 assault phases it was the most epic thing I have ever seen in a 9-0 win in a 2k dw vs gk

[facmanpob]

I'd say SB/SS, and keep him with a Command Squad.....if a 2+ armoured character challenges him, accept the challenge with the Champion, who will swing his S6 AP2 halberd at I4, while Belial goes to town on the rest of the squad. :)

[Hinti]

I'd say SB/SS, and keep him with a Command Squad.....if a 2+ armoured character challenges him, accept the challenge with the Champion, who will swing his S6 AP2 halberd at I4, while Belial goes to town on the rest of the squad.

Oh wow thats mean........ :)

I like it!!!

[jeremy1391]

Yup!