Do you think arjac is worth his points?

[Jarl Kjaran Coldheart]

 

You can use the pack leader as challenge fodder for a IC though...

I don't see how he gives more cc power than 10 gh+motw

Never underestimate the power of intimidation. Arjac is a beast individually; even if your GH pack can drop more dice overall, the few dice Arjac drops will most definitely devastate the target, and your opponent will fear and respect him ever more from it.

 

There's alot of truth to this statement.

 

My Raven Guard (codex marines) are always lead by vanilla Captain, who I've given a name and backstory to. I often ask my opponents "should I do something smart or awesome" when fielding him...and always go with the awesome anyways.

Now Shadow Captain Bran Collins attracts way more heat then a vanilla captain is worth, often letting more arrange other units to take objectives -and win the game- for me. His 4 CC attacks shouldnt have them much of an effect on the game, but the pysch out he brings has swayed more then a few games to my favor.

 

WLK

[Roma]

Problem with challenges is: arjac is forced to fight any puny sergeant if they call a challenge. Next turn he only has three attacks.

 

That said, I can see he has his uses

 

Or if failbaddon decides to challenge, arjac has to accept, and now abby pummels an expensive character instead of a puny sergeant.

[Grey Mage]

Aye, though its an expensive character with a 3++ and a good chance at ripping old abbies head off if he gets to swing.

[Roma]

Two wounds are his undoing. Why not 3 Phil, why!?

[skeletoro]

He may be outclassed by Abaddon, but though I haven't done the calcs, I don't think he's completely out of the game. And how many more points does Abaddon cost? If he's 50% more expensive, that's a big deal. He NEEDS to have the advantage to justify his points cost :D

[Marshal Wilhelm]

When I first started playing 5th, which was at 1500 pts, I had a list with both the Emperor's Champion and a Castellan [who I quickly bumped up to a Marshal -> a good looking Marshal. In fact, the most handsome Marshal ever to grace the field of battle!!!]

Both of these ICs were without a squad. I soon learnt the error of my ways.

 

When I started interacting with the internet, I saw that people weren't taking that second IC. The reason was, in a bang for buck sense, your standard grunt offers far more oomph. Admittedly with a larger area footprint, which has its own pros and cons. But still, in terms of effect, the lowies had it over the highups.

 

I sent Marshal Wilhelm back to the Battle Barge, where he was obviously being super amazing whilst looking super handsome, and the power of my lists went up. I really started clobbering my brother's Orks, especially with the sounder pieces of advice here on B&C, YTTH and 3++ is the new black.

 

This was why Rune Priests are so boss. Cheap [so not taking away too many points from grunts] offering psychic protection and having an Auto cannon.

 

:D

[Kassill]

Arjac is slimmed IC/monster killer. Think WW2 Tank Destroyers, they smoke heavy armor like a hot knife through butter but don't take hits as well as other tanks. But even that analogy is off considering he's 2+/3++ and 2 (?) wounds. To call him weak would be to call Chuck Norris girly.

 

Just point him at their characters/monsters/walkers and let him go. Best fit for him would probably be a ten strong GH squad. And if you've got the points I've found he works rather well with a Wolf Priest granting Oath of War>Preferred Enemy (blank).

Just don't waste your time clobbering grunts, leave them for your Grey Hunter packs etc. If you want to better maneuver him towards selected targets, I've found a Crusader to be a perfect bus for him. But this does start to get a little expensive. Especially if you loose the Crusader first turn.... (Blast you Eldar scum!!!!) But even in that game he did great slogging towards them and clobbering some wraiths and walkers. And he does even better when his bus can get him there in the thick of it!

What I'm saying is, I've never had him just drop dead like a rock without doing anything. With the right maneuvering and easy dice rolls (come on, 3+ to hit, 2+ to wound, anything more they'd just re write his rules to auto kill in base contact, no rolls needed) he will always perform above and beyond his points cost. In fact, I'd be willing to bet 8-9/10 he does more damage points wise than that same Grey Hunter pack in the end. (And I love Grey Hunter packs so that's hard for me to admit.)

[SW1]

Let's get to the most important issue ... If you're painting Wolves for the ETL then he's definitely worth the points!!!

[Roma]

I already have a scratchbuilt version, im gonna have to run him for points as i don't have another 10 GH.

 

Hopefully some unforeseen use shall spring up.

 

Let me get this straight though, if a challenge is issued, arjac CANNOT let a pack leader fight?

 

And contro, a pack leader can't issue a challenge if arjac can?

[dswanick]

Let me get this straight though, if a challenge is issued, arjac CANNOT let a pack leader fight?

And contro, a pack leader can't issue a challenge if arjac can?

If Arjac is in a unit, he is the pack leader. Except for Long Fangs, in which case - correct, he must be in any challenges.

[Roma]

thanks

[skeletoro]

dswanick, why are long fangs different? All I can think of off the top of my head is that they have a squad leader. Are they characters? Hmm. Didn't realize.

[Dam13n]

Every time I've seen Arjac used, the person using him has boasted long and loud about how great he is. He's then died without accomplishing much. A couple of units emptying boltguns (and special weapons) into him and his unit and they're all gone.

 

That does mean that he draws firepower, but for 188pts I could have 2 TA Lone Wolves with Storm Shields and Chainfists, and they'll soak up fire equally well, if not better thanks to FNP.

[Kassill]

Every time I've seen Arjac used, the person using him has boasted long and loud about how great he is. He's then died without accomplishing much. A couple of units emptying boltguns (and special weapons) into him and his unit and they're all gone.

 

That does mean that he draws firepower, but for 188pts I could have 2 TA Lone Wolves with Storm Shields and Chainfists, and they'll soak up fire equally well, if not better thanks to FNP.

 

 

That's bound to happen whenever anyone talks up anything. My buddies Vindicare Assassin, the almighty assassin with his great rifle, has yet to do a single thing in all the games we've played so far.

 

Also, I played a tournament late last year in which I was fooling around with Njal. Second or third game, another SW player rolls up into the store and spots Njal in his pack, quietly slogging up the flank while my army keeps most of his force occupied. Well, after about 3 or 4 times of him walking over going "What spell did Njal roll up?!?! Is he destroying souls!" (Obvious over dramatization, as I cant recall his exact words) my opponent proceeds to shoot a good bit of his army towards the unit he'd so far not paid much attention to and goodbye Njal.

 

I've learned so far as a wolf, it's in our nature to boast, but boast carefully.

[Ghostwolfalpha]

As with any expensive and powerful unit, the value is in your ability to get it where it needs to be. If arjac fits your playstyle and can be used to his full effect (Hunting armour and heavy hitters) then go for it. If you play mech or gunline, you should probably invest elsewhere unless you use landraiders. If you drop pod a lot or play very aggressive, he sounds like he might be your man.

 

I have seen him do unbelievable things on the field of battle, and I have also seen him fall to a hellturky vector strike. Granted he only had one wound left and was alone. (Battlecannon...)

 

I have come to love him in a unit with a SotH Wolf Priest. Just watch your opponent move everything to the center of the board. Priceless.

[dswanick]

dswanick, why are long fangs different? All I can think of off the top of my head is that they have a squad leader. Are they characters? Hmm. Didn't realize.

Because, of all the units a wolf guard can be a part of, only the Long Fangs pack has an in-built Character(the Squad Leader).

[Rune Priest Jbickb]

 

 

dswanick, why are long fangs different? All I can think of off the top of my head is that they have a squad leader. Are they characters? Hmm. Didn't realize.

Because, of all the units a wolf guard can be a part of, only the Long Fangs pack has an in-built Character(the Squad Leader).

Where does it say the squad leader is a character? Near as I can tell in the codex he is s marine like any one else, no character rules.

[dswanick]

 

 

 

 

dswanick, why are long fangs different? All I can think of off the top of my head is that they have a squad leader. Are they characters? Hmm. Didn't realize.

Because, of all the units a wolf guard can be a part of, only the Long Fangs pack has an in-built Character(the Squad Leader).

 

 

Where does it say the squad leader is a character? Near as I can tell in the codex he is s marine like any one else, no character rules.

 

 

BRB, pg.135.

[skeletoro]

Good to know! Though I guess it won't often come up given that they're heavy support.

[dswanick]

Good to know! Though I guess it won't often come up given that they're heavy support.

Funny, my Long Fangs are always getting stuck in. Maybe it has something to do with their being 2X Plasma Cannons, 2X Heavy Bolters, the Squad Leader, and a Razorback which charges up the middle in support of two of my Grey Hunter packs to claim the mid-field...

[Rune Priest Jbickb]

Thanks for that page. Not sure y its not in the codex though.

[Grey Mage]

Thanks for that page. Not sure y its not in the codex though.

Did you play 5th edition? Nothing in there about characters was needed.

[Rune Priest Jbickb]

I barely played 5th, I got my start just before the release of sixth and my rules knowledge in 5th was pretty limited. Now that makes sense :)