Advice for starting Iron Warriors...

[d3m01iti0n]

Hey guys, been interested in starting a new army lately.  Ive scored and painted a bunch of Nids, but my eye keeps creeping back to CSM.  Definitely want to go with Iron Warriors, but Ive got some questions before I go full bore:

 

1) What is a good all-around loadout for a standard Tac squad?  I have a box Ive never put together and Id like to get started on it very soon to warm up and get my motivation up.

 

2) Im going to score a Warsmith (HQ) soon.  Anybody use him as a Chaos Lord stand in, and does his WYSIWYG loadout translate well into usable gear?

 

3) Anybody proxy Thunderfire Cannons for Forgefiends?  Im not big on daemons, unless its a huge, subjugated centerpiece.

 

4) Can CSM survive without Heldrakes?  I want to be fluffy and not look like every other heretic out there.  If theyre pretty much mandatory I suppose I could custom up a Stormtalon or a FW Chaos flier to stand in.

 

I want to gunline and crack open defenses like eggs.  Vindicators and artillery are my goals.  Any comments are appreciated!

[Ironwithout]

Welcome to the Iron warriors. My experience is minimal but I will help as little I can.

 

1. I think it depends on the role but for my self I like units of 10 with x2 Plasma guns in a Rhino. ( Rhino's are a contested subject as they are so easy to pop now )

 

2. If you want a Chaos Lord why not just use one? Warsmiths and Warpsmiths are 2 different things. Warpsmith in the codex is a Chaos Techmarine ( being simple about it ) A Warsmith in the Iron Warriors are the leaders of the Grand company's and are more akin to Chaos Lords anyway.

 

3.with some conversion work I love this Idea but what have you got against Daemon Engines. They are extremely fluffy for Iron Warriors? If you have a different opinion hereI would genuinely love to hear it.

 

4. Same question as above on daemon engines? In regards to Helldrakes believe me when I say there are a lot of haters on this unit. To put it simply it is an amazing unit for its point cost and I personally run 2 at 2000 points. Is there a reason you don't want to use the unit?

 

I'm sure some of the other guys can help more and will be along shortly.

[d3m01iti0n]

1) Sounds good.  Going to get started tonight :)

 

2) Im talking about the Warsmith.  The IW themed guy with the power claw, not the Techmarine.  I do love that guy too, but I would prefer to bring the Warsmith.  Hes got the look, and Im sure I could use the Claw as a Mace, since it seems to be a good choice.

 

3) My only experience of IW is from the omnibus.  If I remember correctly they were using artillery guns with daemons bound within them.  Not walking monster guns.  Thats pretty much it for my thinking.  Artillery with some spikey bits.  Honsou seemed to dislike possesion but was quick to enslave it to his needs.  I like :cuss chaos marines, not mutated daemons in armor.

 

4) Oh I know theyre awesome, I just dont care for the look.  I would just use a stand in model.

 

Once again, just in for ideas and advice.  I love the fluff and want to bring something badass to the table.

[Ironwithout]

All fair points. I won't comment on the Lord as I rarely use them but yes the Warsmith model would work but not sure about the loadout. If you wan't to go without Daemon engines then awesome. All I want to say is you better post pics of the conversions lol!

 

May be worth using some Guard allies. You could get Vindicators from our codex and then some basilisks or whatever is good from theres. (not sure havent used guard before)

 

Best of luck!

 

Edit - poor spelling

[DominikB]

Lord either on bike or with assault equipped squad with Aura for 5++

and either

-MoK AoBF (insane amout of attacks) 

-MoN Claw Fist or Claw Brand (could pass off as extra bionics tbh one of the best load outs especially on bike as T6!)

-MoS 2 Claw or Brand Claw I6 is a bomb, i run with Lucius and it so useful in those challenges 

I know he has claw and some sort of bolter standard, you could try making that brand and claw being a lightning claw?

 

To throw it out there with undivided armies from what Ive heard Huron may be worth a try, U could convert the warsmith to have his equip. Id defo be cool with that.

 

CSM id go 2xMG claw MB on champ rest CCW instead of bolter and rhino or 2xPG bolters and same champ

 

Rhinos are worth it imho the 18" last turn dash to an onjective is priceless and if you have enough distractions (I run 2rhinos hellchicken and oblits at 750 points) they'll live. Also If something wouldve destroyed them in 6th it wouldve in 5th too, especially at low points!

Hope this helps!

[darknightdrako]

This is what I usually bring and is more of a fluff list.

 

 

ChaosLord + MoN + PF + Sigil + LC

PlagueMarines x 7 + 2xPlasma/Fist + Rhino/Havoc

PlagueMarines x 7 + 2xPlasma/Fist + Rhino/Havoc

PlagueMarines x 7 + 2xMelta/Fist + Rhino/Havoc

Defiler + AC + HF

Predator + AC + 2xLC-Sponsons

Predator + AC + 2xLC-Sponsons

 

Company Command x 5 + MoOrdnace + M-Bomb

Veterans x 10

Basilisk + HeavyFlamer

 

Aeigis/Quad

 

1750 total

[nurglez]

You could always make some sort of tracked servitor with multiple weapons as a forgefiend.

 

Heldrakes are rather good, though I only use one even though I have two. You can do alright without them but they are a rather good unit that like oblit's people will recommend you do use.

 

For a normal squad I find it quite fluffy to go with 10 marines, melta, combi melta and lascannon/autocannon, and an aegis with quad gun. dual plasma is recommended, as mentioned above people are split over rhinos (I like them, and you can easily reserve them or outflank via Huron to avoid them giving up first blood easily). As in most marine armies melta is better on fast moving platforms, but I quite like them in transports.

 

A few squads of plague marines can be useful too, but I am nurgle biased, and do require a nurgle lord.

 

The warpsmith (if that is the model you are getting, chaos techmarine) would probably need some converting to make a chaos lord, as it is very distinctly a warpsmith. Like a techmarine is very much a techmarine.

[Rain]

Why not just get the Warsmith model instead of the Warpsmith? You can easily swap out his claw arm for pretty much any CC weapon and though the combi-melta is kind of silly, it at least looks neat what with the Iron Warriors insignia on it and all and isn't too many points. As for proxying a thunderfire as a FF that's really really stretching it. I mean not only is a walker nothing like a--gun thing but FF's have 2 or 3 guns and a very different size and footprint from a TF, to the point that I'd consider it straight up cheating as it's much easier to hide a TF.

That said, maybe you could get away with a converted dread or something, but really you should probably just use the FF model, it's not *too* terrible, especially relative to some of the crimes against eyes committed by the Warp Talons or the Dark Apostle who can't stop making this face . As for Heldrakes, the main thing about them is that they don't really require much thought to use, they are fast, hard to kill, and just move around plopping down flamer templates. You don't really have to worry about positioning, cover, or planning future move distances, you just move it within 12 inches and barf fire on people. So I don't know, but I can't really square how they are considered such a key lynchpin of the army, sure they are useful, and will probably do something even if you have your pet monkey moving them, but with just 1 baleflamer they tend to not actually kill all that much unless they get real lucky.

[Chaeron]

This is what I usually bring and is more of a fluff list.

 

 

ChaosLord + MoN + PF + Sigil + LC

PlagueMarines x 7 + 2xPlasma/Fist + Rhino/Havoc

PlagueMarines x 7 + 2xPlasma/Fist + Rhino/Havoc

PlagueMarines x 7 + 2xMelta/Fist + Rhino/Havoc

Defiler + AC + HF

Predator + AC + 2xLC-Sponsons

Predator + AC + 2xLC-Sponsons

 

Company Command x 5 + MoOrdnace + M-Bomb

Veterans x 10

Basilisk + HeavyFlamer

 

Aeigis/Quad

 

1750 total

 

A fluff list of Death Guard? :P

[nurglez]

Why not just get the Warsmith model instead of the Warpsmith? You can easily swap out his claw arm for pretty much any CC weapon and though the combi-melta is kind of silly, it at least looks neat what with the Iron Warriors insignia on it and all and isn't too many points. As for proxying a thunderfire as a FF that's really really stretching it. I mean not only is a walker nothing like a--gun thing but FF's have 2 or 3 guns and a very different size and footprint from a TF, to the point that I'd consider it straight up cheating as it's much easier to hide a TF.

That said, maybe you could get away with a converted dread or something, but really you should probably just use the FF model, it's not *too* terrible, especially relative to some of the crimes against eyes committed by the Warp Talons or the Dark Apostle who can't stop making this face . As for Heldrakes, the main thing about them is that they don't really require much thought to use, they are fast, hard to kill, and just move around plopping down flamer templates. You don't really have to worry about positioning, cover, or planning future move distances, you just move it within 12 inches and barf fire on people. So I don't know, but I can't really square how they are considered such a key lynchpin of the army, sure they are useful, and will probably do something even if you have your pet monkey moving them, but with just 1 baleflamer they tend to not actually kill all that much unless they get real lucky.

Heldrakes require a little work to use to their best ability, you will rarely want to skim with them, as this means they can be taken down more easily. So you have to plan out their moves a little. They excel at thinning out MEQ's or worse, and are one of the few units that can wreck a rhino and then happily wipe out most of the squad, in 1 turn on its own.

I think you could easily take a dreadnought and make it slightly bigger and add hades cannon's to it to count it as a forgefiend, I agree that the TFC is not such a great count as, but I'm sure with a bit of effort it could be a decent attempt (depends on your gaming circle, if you want to go to tournaments etc).

[d3m01iti0n]

Thanks for the advice guys!  My Warsmith arrived the other day (yes the WARsmith, not WARPsmith, thats who Ive been talking about the whole time) and Ive got most of my CSM squad built and ready for paint.  I already have a TDA Chaos Lord w/ LCs painted in IW colors, and will be looking into Oblits next.  Ill keep everybody posted!

[Brother Eleysium]

You sound like you have a pretty good basis or starting point. Especially the fact that you don't want to use Daemons. They are extremely unfluffy for an Iron Warrior player if you look at the original fluff, and not the new revamped corporate crap GW is trying to pull to sell models.

 

I'd recommend lots of artillery and heavy weapons in every Marine Squad. And I don't see why people would have a problem with you using a Warsmith seeing as how it is still a legal model. If I was an Iron Warrior player, I wouldn't leave home without him. Nothing is more appropriate for Iron Warriors than a gun line backed by artillery and lead by a Warsmith.