Termicide squads seem a little too good for the points

[Dam13n]

Jiron - of course you can do that, however the purpose of a Termicide squad is to deep strike next to an enemy and kill it.  Your opponents natural response will be to shoot and kill the Termicide squad in return.

 

Therefore the Termicide squad generally won't see a turn where it'll be eligible to assault. 

So spending loads of points on Chainfists is likely to be wasted most of the time.

Termicide squads should therefore be as cheap as possible, hence keeping their power weapons.

 

Any sensible 6th edition list will have enough AP1/2 to evaporate 3 Terminators (with 5++ saves) without breaking much of a sweat.

 

If you want a squad that'll do more than be a 1 turn wonder, then you'll be looking at having:

On Foot - 5+ Terminators with either MoN or MoT possibly led by a Character.

Mounted - 4 Terminators and a Character in a Land Raider.

 

Chaos lack the access to 3++ saves that would allow a large squad to deep-strike, survive the enemy shooting, then massacre something in assault.

[nurglez]

Well, yes and no. After a termicide squad equiped with 3 melta and power axes (for example) drop down and fire their melta, they can't threaten vehicles with armour 12 on the rear. Having 1 chainfist or some meltabombs can help you threaten, and if one is still alive it can still destroy that landraider or dread or monolith or etc.

 

While I agree that termicide should be kept as cheap as possible, putting the odd extra weapon in there can help win a game, or ensure they receive more then enough enemy fire power to keep the rest of your army safe for a turn.

[Dam13n]

You can't get a meltabomb on terminators. The champion doesn't have access to special issue wargear.

 

A single chainfist on a termicide squad may be justified if your opponent runs lots of vehicles, but the chances of getting to use it are slim.

 

Termicide drops in

Shoots target enemy unit/vehicle

Cannot assault (deep strike)

Enemy shoots the termicide unit to death in their turn

 

Chainfist not used, therefore represents wasted points.

 

I'm not saying that it will never be used. There will be scenarios that see your termicide unit survive, but as most of them hinge on your opponent ignoring them (something you can't rely upon) I would choose to spend those points elsewhere.

[Deus de Mortalis]

Also most rear armor is AV10, so in the rare circumstances that my termicide would assault a vehicle, I would take my chances with their S5 power axes.

[minigun762]

I liked Melta termicide last edition, but I'm not sure Plasma has the same impact.

 

6 shots = 4 hits = 2.67HP against AV10 before saves. It's not that likely you'll open up a transport or kill a tank.

Against a T6 MC you're looking at 2.67 wounds before saves, so not a kill.

[Deus de Mortalis]

I liked Melta termicide last edition, but I'm not sure Plasma has the same impact.

 

6 shots = 4 hits = 2.67HP against AV10 before saves. It's not that likely you'll open up a transport or kill a tank.

Against a T6 MC you're looking at 2.67 wounds before saves, so not a kill.

Compare that to melta.

 

Plasma within 12" vs AV10 averages 2 penetrating hits and .67 glances.

Melta within 6" vs AV10 averages 1.67 penetrating hits and .33 glances.

Melta within 12" vs AV10 averages 1.33 penetrating hits and .33 glances.

Plasma within 24" vs AV10 averages 1 penetrating hits and .33 glances.

Melta within 24" vs AV10 averages 0 penetrating hits and 0 glances.

 

Of course plasma gets +1 on the damage chart while melta gets +2, so that might make it even between them? Either way, no way is melta the winner vs AV10.

 

Plasma vs T6 averages 2.67 wounds.

Melta vs T6 averages 1.67 wounds.

 

Plamsa vs T4 averages 3.33 wounds.

Melta vs T4 averages 1.67 wounds.

 

So sure, a termicide unit might not be an automatic delete button, but they stand a good chance of hurting lots of things, aren't overly expensive, will draw a lot of heavy weapons fire, or if ignored might even hurt things with their power axes.

 

With plasma, every hit against AV10 has a 16.7% chance of glancing and a 50% chance of penetrating, and on average you will get 4 hits. So on average there will be 2 penetrations, and .33 glances. With melta (within 6"), for every hit there is an 83.3% chance to penetrate, and a 16.7% chance to glance.

 

Versus a monstrous creature with T6, you have an average of 2.67 wounds from six plasma shots, and only 1.67 wounds from three melta shots. Plasma wins.

[Dam13n]

Plasma does have a purpose, it just requires finesse:

 

Those 6 S7 AP2 shots are great for finishing off a damaged unit or light vehicle (they'll be coming in on turn 2 at the earliest after all)

 

Termicide isn't an alpha-strike tactic... It's a overhanging threat on any depleted squad or damaged vehicle that could cause your opponent to act more cautiously, thus giving you the initiative from a tactical point of view.

 

Just the same as wolf scouts with a meltagun make people overly concerned about their barrage vehicles

Just like outflanking special weapon chosen were great at funnelling enemies into the centre of the table in 5th edition.

 

If you've whittled that enemy tactical squad down to 3 or 4 members - the Termicide with plasmas have a good shot at getting that kill point (or stripping your opponent of a scoring unit in an objective game).

 

Now I prefer special weapon chosen as they tend to present an on-going threat until they're dealt with and are on the table turn 1.  Add Huron to give them infiltrate and a rhino for a 24" threat bubble*, and they are great for putting your opponent on the back foot.

 

*6" move, 6" disembark, 12" plasma rapid fire / melta range (admittedly without 2D6 AP)

[nurglez]

Guess I'm used to using space wolves terminators then :D

 

I would rarely put a chainfist on termicide, but I wont say that it is useless. If it wins you 1 game out of 8, then it was worth it. If the threat of a chainfist walking around the backfield scares someone into dedicating a whole units fire power to kill that 1 model instead of something else that then wins you the game, it was worth it. It does depend on your meta and what is in your force.

[zyl-]

Well another somewhat easy solution is to run a power maul in the group. +2 str isn't exactly a chainfist, but it does make 4s glance most vehicles.