goobybls Posted June 15, 2013 Share Posted June 15, 2013 So playing with some friends new to the game. Haven't played since over 10 years ago. 1 x libby +term armour 1 honour guard x 5 plasma guns + drop pod 3x 5 man scout squads each 4 snipers and 1 missile launcher. should work out to 505 points... was thinking to use the scout squads for scoring + causing pinning + minor infantry losses to opposition. Drop the libby and honour guard down with some fear of darkness, shackle soul and rapid fire w/e needs to die most with the plasma? You guys know better than me, criticism and suggestions are more than welcome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taranis Posted June 15, 2013 Share Posted June 15, 2013 Not a bad plan actually. :) No criticism from me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenith Posted June 15, 2013 Share Posted June 15, 2013 Honour guard can only take 4 plasmas. Its a lot of points going into 2 units at 500pts (300pts+?) Bear in mind of you alpha atrike your 'new player' opponents each and every game with the pod, they probably wont want to play you for very long before they get bored of losing. Id try and make it a bit more balanced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goobybls Posted June 15, 2013 Author Share Posted June 15, 2013 Ok, so you're more than correct about the 4 plasma > I guess it would be even more cheesy if the novitiate could actually be fitted with plasma gun as well. Also, i really did fear that sinking so many points into those two units would be risky. Though the alpha strike situation did make sense considering I want to make use of every point as soon as possible. I can't get over the fact that I can grab an honour guard+ a novitiate for so low a cost, so I don't think I can say goodbye to that libby+guard combo. Though I could just drop the plasma and make it seem like more of a fair fight for these guys. That's still a lot of points I'd have free, any suggestions on how to make it more fun/interesting for my opponents? Since I can't turbo boost a rhino across the board anymore, exit 2 " and assault a sure 6" with +1 str/In anymore I've pretty much ruled out assault tactics. Why o Why have you forsaken me Sanguinius?! Could I drop a scout squad and the plasma and pick up a fragioso? How does it hold up as being a pain in my opponents side? Keep them interested in the game regarding problem solving my army? That was a very good point about boring the jesus out of my friends. Thank you greatly! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goobybls Posted June 16, 2013 Author Share Posted June 16, 2013 any ideas on how to translate this base setup into a larger army? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deamons Redeemer Posted June 16, 2013 Share Posted June 16, 2013 ehm, if you have the points take a fragioso in a pod, or just a sternguard squad (the special ammo is a nice ad) ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lfhoule Posted June 16, 2013 Share Posted June 16, 2013 Just re-read the thread (and did some calculations), and the orginial army list, as given, is closer to 600 points than 500 (590 to be exact from the current codex, presuming the libby has no weapons other than his force sword with the termi upgrade, and the honor guard having the max of 4 plasma guns), so to get it down to near 500 points, you will need to drop a scout squad anyway. Even dropping the plasma from the honor guard won't net you the points to get a Fragioso, which, even if you could get him, is sort of overkill at this point level because not many armies have much of anything to deal with a AV 13 walker. You do have enough points, however, for a minimum sized Death Company, which if handled correctly can be a hassle for someone to handle, and it keeps your friends interested. Now, as to expanding the army... this is where / when you can bring in the Furiosos / Baal Predators that you want, along with expanding the DC. While it is true that rhino rush is gone does not mean that all assualt tactics are gone as well. You can get jump pack assualt squads as troops and push them across the board, or take advantage of the discount BA assualt squads have for dedicated transports if they forgo the jumppacks. One question that does remain concerns the scout sniper squads in the expanding force: do you want to keep the squads as pure snipers, or add combat squads of bolter or CCW scouts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanguis militis Posted June 17, 2013 Share Posted June 17, 2013 If I may make one suggestion, if you plan on keeping the librarian with the honour guard try giving your librarian divination powers and make sure you take prescience. Since 6th Ed I run at least one Libby with prescience because those rerolls are amazing, even more so when paired with sternguard, honour guard, or anything with a lot of plasma. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I am Legion Posted June 17, 2013 Share Posted June 17, 2013 Might I recommend a whirlwind and vindicator, 2 scout squads and the Libby? Might I recommend a whirlwind and vindicator, 2 scout squads and the Libby? Might I recommend a whirlwind and vindicator, 2 scout squads and the Libby? Might I recommend a whirlwind and vindicator, 2 scout squads and the Libby? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I am Legion Posted June 17, 2013 Share Posted June 17, 2013 sorry, I don't know why my phone did that. I only meant to say that once.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanguis militis Posted June 17, 2013 Share Posted June 17, 2013 That was like Internet Tourette's haha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I am Legion Posted June 17, 2013 Share Posted June 17, 2013 Lol, even in the future nothing works right :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deamons Redeemer Posted June 17, 2013 Share Posted June 17, 2013 Lol, even in the future nothing works right i blame it on the bugs (nids) :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BAHERSH Posted June 17, 2013 Share Posted June 17, 2013 I was working on an alpha strike list for 2000 pts. Essentially, get 3 - 4 units of scouts with drop pods. Drop them empty so that you can drop the rest of your army on turn 1. All of the scouts are just there to infiltrate/ score. Get 1 - 2 units of Sternguard. They're the best alpha strike unit for the cost. Get 2 plasma guns and combi plasmas, meltas, or flamers for the rest (depending on what you want them to do). Drop them with Corbullo - he's great for tanking fire - probably the best in the game for the points. Drop one unit of DC with bolters for light infantry, and it will also force your opponent to assault them on his turn. Storm Shield Librarian in termie armor can also soak up damage. For the 2nd HQ, get Mephiston on the table so that you don't get tabled if you go 2nd (plus he's a beast!). You can also drop some dreadnoughts (my list has 1 DC dread). I'm not as big of a fan of dreadnought lists, but it wouldn't be hard to tweak the list to drop 5 (3 fragiosos, 2 dc) if you only put points into them/ 1 unit of DC. Morticon made a competitive null deployment list recently - check out his thread as well. Cheers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deamons Redeemer Posted June 17, 2013 Share Posted June 17, 2013 Essentially, get 3 - 4 units of scouts with drop pods. Drop them empty so that you can drop the rest of your army on turn 1. All of the scouts are just there to infiltrate/ score. ehm, you drop half on turn one, if you drop them empty, the rest still comes on turn two? or do i miss something? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Maikel Posted June 17, 2013 Share Posted June 17, 2013 Essentially, get 3 - 4 units of scouts with drop pods. Drop them empty so that you can drop the rest of your army on turn 1. All of the scouts are just there to infiltrate/ score. ehm, you drop half on turn one, if you drop them empty, the rest still comes on turn two? or do i miss something? The idea is that if you have 5 pods, three attached to dreadnaughts/sternguard/DC and two attached to Assault or Tac squads, then you can deploy the Assault/Tac squads on the table at the beginning of the game and your alpha strike wave of dreads/etc can all enter turn 1 leaving only empty pods in reserve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BAHERSH Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 Yeah, basically if you want to expand such a list with scouts, take empty drop pods for them so that you could drop - say - 2 units of sternguard, a unit of DC and a dread on turn 1. If you had 3 units of scouts, all 4 of your hard hitting units would indeed hit hard on turn 1. If you wanted to drop 5 hard hitting units in pods, take 4 units of scouts with pods and so on. Obviously you would drop the empty pods on turn 2, unless you played a particularly strange list (perhaps my sentence structure could have been more straightforward). For such a list, I wouldn't take any more assault marines or tacticals. Just max out sternguard, dreads, DC, SP's, etc, and keep your scouts out of the fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taranis Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 I'm afraid that scouts are unable to buy transports. :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goobybls Posted June 19, 2013 Author Share Posted June 19, 2013 Hey all, I was watching this thread quite religiously until a paper I had upcoming crept up on me. It is great to see so many of you actually provided further insight !!! So working backwords. I just checked my "codex" and it does not mention that scout squads can buy pods at all, though that is a pretty damned clever idea if it works. (I mean the whole, empty drops pods deal) Luckily I do have a vindicator model from ancient times, are they still just a rhino chassis with a giant metal bowl on the front? LULZ And further, I could proxy a WWind in, though do you still have to guess ranges? Does that even matter with premeasuring shenanigans? The whole mephiston deal makes me sad, apparently I can't just run him down centerfield and have him wipe a group > jump to next group > wipe group> jump to next group, kind of checkers him through an army. :( Is the libby with a SS worth his points? I thought of doing this, but not sure as I haven't played since Socrates drank his hemlock Also, I was considering buffering anything upwards of 500 points with some dreadnought goodness frag or bloodtalons not sure, possibly some scary looking TH/SS termies to cause some anxiety between prioritization of targets for those I play against??? Further more had the points worked out like this, but you're most likely correct. 5 scouts @ 75 +10 for upgrade to Hvy Bolter/Missile =85 x3 squads =255 total troops 1 Libby @ 100 +25 for termi armour =125 1 honour guard @115 + (15x4 plasma) + drop pod @35 =210 in overall hq points = 590 pts... YOU ARE CORRECT SIRE, I must recalibrate. that's a full scout squad dropped @ 85 points and possibly termi armour.. Also, can anyone clarify about allies rules? I have only been able to find posts that declare in order to take an allied unit (I WANTS 2 STORM TALONS) we must take an HQ and 2x troops choice from their army list? ( Does this rule get negated by the fact that a standard libby and troops choice are technically also a C:SM libby and troops choice???!!!) If so, I will hover @ 60 inches and cause pinning all day long. Looking forward to all of your replies EDIT: Just read up some prescience/+ machine spirit vindicator shenanigans here http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/268301-vindicator-and-divination/ OH MY SIDES THEY HURT! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I am Legion Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 Allying is 1 HQ, and 1 Troop minimum. And then only one of the FOC slots, so u cant ally in 2 Storm talons. If you really want to ally then go with dark angels and get the cheaper WW or Vindy. Plus a cheaper scout and librarian. But that'll already add up. In small points we will always suffer, that's why i suggest those two vehicles. They will be hard to take down together if u keep them in cover along with the scouts. Just cast prescience on the vindicator to maximize its shooting :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goobybls Posted June 19, 2013 Author Share Posted June 19, 2013 Blast! The thought of having actual gunships that are versatile got me so excited :(. Is it worthwhile to run a techmarine up w the libby/vindicator? Does the repair ability warrant 50pts is it? Since I do recall my vindi always being immobilized and not being able to pivot to make use of the cannon? It seems like a gamble. Though prescience + potms seems to guarantee you can pretty much obliterate a 10 inch diameter section of the opposition off turn 1? Make more sense to spend that techmarines points on a portion of another vindi or WW? SORRY if I'm running away in this thread, just nice to pick all your brains since I'm so god damned ancient! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zatazuken Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 If you pick the Imperial Guard as allies, you can ally in 1-3 Vendettas as part of a Vendetta Gunship Squadron. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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