Anybody else think that Eisenhorn was kind of disappointing?

[corlinjewell]

So I finished Eisenhorn a couple of days ago, an despite its glowing reviews, I did not think it was the greatest book ever.  Before I talk about the content of the book, I want to say that I really wanted to like this book so I went into it with a very positive attitude.  I also think that Abnett's writing style does flow pretty good and some of the set pieces were pretty cool. But, I feel that it had some pretty serious flaws (and not just because it disagrees with my personal view of 40k).  SPOILERS FOLLOW: YE BE WARNED!

 

First off, I did not like how the book took place over 150 or so years.  I realize that the galaxy is a vast place, but I feel like it kinda robs the pace of the book when you find out that they have been chilling out at some outpost or planet for years and nothing exciting is going on.  Also, Eisenhorn and his team knew each other and were close all 150 years, and the way they interacted did not really seem to fit how unbelievably close they would be (considering they've known each other for longer than a normal human life).  Also, for some reason that doesn't add anything to the plot at all, his pilot Midas dies only to be replaced by his daughter Medea.  This makes no sense and is frustrating because a main character dies off-screen.  Because they are basically the same character, when Medea is suddenly in the second book, it feels like that scene in Beerfest where Landfill's brother comes back to replace his dead brother.  The romance story is completely naive, and I felt like Abnett felt compelled to add one in (he didn't have to), but shied away from anything more mature than a Disney movie (though I guess it does mention he had sex).  The deal with Alizebeth being an untouchable was meant to add sexual tension I think (as he is a psyker and her presence should repulse him), but it fails on this level because Abnett doesn't really go into it.  Plus, he is in constant contact with her and her Untouchable cronies and it doesn't seem to bother him too much.  Also, after 150 years of knowing each other, I feel that he would have told her he loved her at some point, rather than being coaxed into it right before she dies in an extremely passive fashion.  The Crezia relationship was really thrown in there to try and create some Twilight-esque love triangle.  The better way to handle this was to have Eisenhorn and Alizebeth be together, but unable to be intimate and then have him have an affair with Crezia.  This would've created personal tension and external conflict when it came to light.

 

Also, the conclusions seemed incredibly rushed and thrown in.  All three books would have this massive build-up as Eisenhorn did his detective work, but they all would end in this planetary invasion that would only last like 20 pages (if that).  Most of those twenty pages would be spent walking around in the bad guy's lair and commenting on how eerie it looks too.  I wanted more satisfying conclusions.  Also, Eisenhorn had way too many of those "the gun was to my head and I knew I was dead" moments before his allies or something equally convenient would save him.  Also, his will (basically a Jedi mind trick) and psychic powers in general worked as a total Deus Ex Machina when everything else seemed hopeless and it seemed liked Abnett picked and chose which enemies should be affected by it.  Also, it doesn't work when you talk about how fearsome an enemies' reputation is (Vessorine mercenaries) when the main characters blow the crap out of them constantly.

 

Finally, I didn't like Eisenhorn's transition from puritan to radical because it didn't seem like he changed the way he thought about things.  The book is written as if he is recording his memoirs, so the way he thinks is constant throughout the book and he always mentions that he knew he was pure at heart.  It would've been way cooler if he was constantly having internal battles over whether or not he should commit a questionable action, and if his thoughts themselves became darker as he slipped into being a radical.  Also, his team members (Fischig notwistanding) are totally okay with it.  They should've constantly become more and more wary and untrusting of him (or become more corrupted themselves) as he became a radical.

 

These are my problems with the book itself, what follows next are my problems with how it fits with 40k.

 

Simply put, Eisenhorn was not ruthless enough for my visions of Inquisitors.  In the fluff, these guys are burning heretics constantly and can call down Exterminatus on an entire world.  But Eisenhorn was cracking jokes and was all buddy-buddy with his staff.  Also, why oh why does Abnett make him Ordo Xenos if he like NEVER encounters a xeno race (except one that is completely corrupted by Chaos and may as well be daemons).  He could've just said Eisenhorn was Ordo Malleus and been done with it.  Also, I didn't like his encounter with the Tech-Adept as Bure didn't seem machine-like enough.  The AdMech should be completely unfeeling and cold when compared to normal humans (the Dark Apostle book does this perfectly).

 

Anyway, these are just my opinions and I was curious if anyone out there felt the same.  I did enjoy the book somewhat and it kept me interested enough to read the whole thing.  I really liked Abnett's descriptions of the Space Marines in combat and Pontius Glaw and Cherubael were really neat as well. I wish Cherubael and Glaw would've had more of an influence on Eisenhorn.  Also, I wish the Malus Codicium would've had an active dark influence on Eisenhorn rather than the passive one that he makes a reference to on occasion.  Finally, I thought Aemos was a cool character and his death was actually pretty well-done and finished out his character arc nicely. 

 

[Apothecary Vaddon]

Nope.

[Growler67]

Only read the first third so far.  Put it back into the queue to read "Deathwatch" which I just finished and now I'm on "Path of the Outcast".  More background infor for my protracted fan-fiction in progress.  I'll get back to "Eisenhorn" after that.  Still several more in the queue that have been waiting for a while.

 

I'll say that I haven't been too disappointed with "Eisenhorn" so far, though.  I'll post back (if I remember) once I have it completed.

[Hephaesteus]

Eisenhorn was the first 40k novel/trilogy I read and it got me into reading 40k. I thought it was great.

I was going to write more, but the baby is crying; so best be off!

[Conn Eremon]

I thought it was good, solid. Certainly not the best Abnett can deliver, but a good 40k series nonetheless.

[daveNYC]

I liked it, but it helps to realize that the 40k that Eisenhorn is set in is very different from the 40k that exists currently.  The biggest change are the psyker powers and the warp.  In Eisenhorn and Ravenor, these things are mostly just tools.  Dangerous tools that are unreliable and can potentially cause you harm, but still generally just tools.  In current 40k, these things are infinitely more dangerous.  The Warp is inherently corruptive, Daemons are some combination of being much more malicious while also being much weaker, and psyker powers are much flakier and dangerous to the user.

[Aegnor]

Loved it and pretty much disagree with every one of your complaints. :/

[Antarius]

I remember wondering about the Ordo Xenos thing myself.

 

As for the rest, well... I wasn't disappointed with it at all. But it is more of a "story", than a "40K story" perhaps. That's not to say it's bad -the story is just more about the storyline and characters than about the setting, if that makes any sense.

[Aegnor]

Disagree with that as well. The 40k setting is more than just the wars that occur there, although obviously those are the major point of interest. It's a bit like saying a novel about a detective in England in 1942 isn't a "novel about England because it isn't about WW2".

 

Will concede that it has struck me as weird that both Eisenhorn and Ravenor are Xenos but spend all their time investigating heretics.

[corlinjewell]

I remember wondering about the Ordo Xenos thing myself.

 

As for the rest, well... I wasn't disappointed with it at all. But it is more of a "story", than a "40K story" perhaps. That's not to say it's bad -the story is just more about the storyline and characters than about the setting, if that makes any sense.

 

I understand what you are saying, but the majority of my complaints weren't about the 40k fluff.  I just felt like the book is held in a loftier place than it actually deserves.  I made this post for discussion, so for you guys that really enjoyed it, I ask that you tell me what you really liked about it.

[Aegnor]

I liked precisely that it gives us a look at a part of the Imperium from an angle we haven't seen before. I liked Eisenhorn as a character a lot, as well as his crew, including his relationship with Bequin. I thought Cherubael was a pretty cool invention.

 

They're not perfect - I agree the big action finale in each book doesn't match the quality of the rest of the books, except maybe the first one. I think Ravenor's intervention is used as a bit of a deus ex machina a couple of times. (Don't agree however that a psyker using his psychic abilities to solve problems amounts to a deus ex machina - that's a bit like saying that a space marine using his bolter to kill someone is a deus ex machina)

[MordentHex]

Well honestly, this is probably my most favorite book 40k series to date,  I did not like the ending of Ravenor very much, but that was ok and the new series is starting to look epicly destructive. :P

[corlinjewell]

I liked precisely that it gives us a look at a part of the Imperium from an angle we haven't seen before. I liked Eisenhorn as a character a lot, as well as his crew, including his relationship with Bequin. I thought Cherubael was a pretty cool invention.

 

They're not perfect - I agree the big action finale in each book doesn't match the quality of the rest of the books, except maybe the first one. I think Ravenor's intervention is used as a bit of a deus ex machina a couple of times. (Don't agree however that a psyker using his psychic abilities to solve problems amounts to a deus ex machina - that's a bit like saying that a space marine using his bolter to kill someone is a deus ex machina)

 

Cherubael was really cool, I'll give you that (I really enjoyed Pontius Glaw in the first two books too).  I wished Eisenhorn's character would have shifted more as he went further down the path of the radical, but like I mentioned in the OP, I think this has more to do with Abnett writing it as if Eisenhorn was writing his memoirs.  Therefore, this is more of an opinion of mine than me trying to make myself into a master literary critique lol.  I have a couple of buddies that absolutely loved his character too.

 

Fair enough on the psychic abilities but I felt like Eisenhorn's powers waxed and waned depending on who he fought against. The runestaff more than anything is what I would consider to be the deus ex machina considering he killed an all-powerful daemonhost with it, but could not destroy a titan later on.  However, he uses it to summon a similar daemonhost to the one he killed with it earlier.  If it is this powerful, then I think he should have had to go find it (which could have turned into an interesting quest, especially if it was some kind of xeno or Chaos artefact) rather than his Tech-Priest buddy Bure building it for him while he chills out.

[gogmagog]

You know when I read 40k fiction I get entertained. I don't think too much about it, but I have recommended Eisenhorn to those who aren't 40k heads and they have enjoyed it. There are some really crap 40k novels out there, hunt for volordius top of the pile!

[Beta galactosidase]

corlinjewell, on 15 Jun 2013 - 08:38, said:

Plus, he is in constant contact with her and her Untouchable cronies and it doesn't seem to bother him too much. Also, after 150 years of knowing each other, I feel that he would have told her he loved her at some point, rather than being coaxed into it right before she dies in an extremely passive fashion.

I'm not really interested in addressing anything else, because the books are this role playing party written in first person and I do not care.

 

This is a better / more useful portrayal of pariahs than any other. Very commonly in reality, a person can be beautiful and charming, and have found his or her perfect match to be somebody consistently involved in his or her life, but somehow fail to achieve a close relationship. Bequin is also obviously talented and driven, but she drifted around and sold her body without ever making anything of herself; it was only Eisenhorn coming along and using her for his own end that made her useful to someone, but still not to herself. These are precisely why she is such a powerful pariah. If someone were unattractive and stupid, there would be nothing surprising about her being unlucky in love. That is how untouchables work, there is a deficit between how their lives should go and how their lives actually do go, so there are deficits in their souls.

[lilMAC25]

is it just me or did about 10 posts dissapear from this thread?

[Kol Saresk]

They had to reboot the entire forum from older data. They did warn that some of it had disappeared.

[Brother Captain Sirus]

Personally I loved this book yes it is done in a memoir style which from my point of view suits the type of book. The whole Eisenhorn going radical affair is covered more than once in the book, as most radicals don't believe they have changed and that its the views of others that change and brand them a radical for doing what had to be done. For instance when he first bound Cherubael it was to keep him locked away never to be used again as Quixos did but in a moment of desperation it was the only option.

The setting is more to show the enemy within, not the grand battlefields but the fight against internal troubles within the safer more peaceful parts of the imperium if you will, he is also Ordo Xenos because he is dealing with xenos Technology to begin with in his investigation, and as any inquisitor would followed it to its conclusion rather than getting in touch with a different branch of the inquisition to pass it over and hope it was followed up.

The romance with Bequin is what it is, their working relationship was as close as they were getting so why try or think differently, plus why constantly go on about it in a report format, obviously mention some pieces to how they effected his emotional well being/judgement at the time but other than that no reason to go there.

The book gives face to the inquisition explains that they are people and can choose to destroy that planet or follow something to its final conclusion, yes most use the world destroying ego-maniacs as the poster boy but you cant really write a good investigation saying "I am gregor eisenhorn I know you're on that planet" BOOM..... the end, doesn't make for good reading. then there's the issue of if you don't like an inquisitor having human emotion you must really have some beef with the Horus Heresay series as space marines feel, just as observation.

All in all you're entitled to you're opinion but we are viewing the same corner from two different angles, so each to their own at the end of the day

Edit: Alizabeth didn't die, she was put into a coma and has been kept on Ravenors ship for the last however long and eventually awakens (Pariah: Ravenor vs Eisenhorn, the Bequin Trilogy)

[Ethrion]

I liked it mostly for the fact that it was a crime/mystery novel set in the 40k universe. He was also a cross between detective at times and leader of a spec ops team at others which was very cool and the type of murders and cases varied greatly but ultimately was all being masterminded by the same dark shadowy cabal from behind the scenes.

 

The length of time between the books could throw you slightly but one has to imagine that he is going on tons of other cases or else spending years researching and hunting for clues. Basically the time scale is stretched compared to modern day detectives to make it fit with the 40k setting.

 

Apparently the Eisenhorn trilogy leads perfectly into the Ravenor series (which I have heard is even better) so I'm really keen to get started on that.

[Lucien Eilam]

Compared with most of the garbage BL were publishing at the time, which was mostly written by games dev, Eisenhorn was a masterpiece. I don't think it would be as well regarded if it was released today. I'm not sure it would even make my top 20 BL novels now. If you went in believing the hype rather than expecting it to be just pretty good, I can imagine it being disappointing.

[-Volsung-]

I think both Ravenor and Eisenhorn are very good books, but both had flaws that irked me in some ways.

 

With Eisenhorn, it was the killing of certain characters that just got me feeling like it was totally unnecessary. Aemos, for example, didn't have to die. That's the thing about Ravenor that I liked is that characters didn't die unnecessarily. 

[Chaeron]

Surely it's better that Abnett has the confidence to kill off characters, especially if they have had important roles?

 

Furthermore, makes sense, as he was his conscience, and with him - I doubt Eisenhorn would be as adequetely set up as 'rogue' for the Bequin trilogy.

 

Of the two, I prefer Ravenor I think - but both excellent trilogies. Always makes me want more!