Cant cast presciense from rhino

[Torin]

Good day brother, 

 

I has a game yesterday, and one of my buddies mention that you cant cast prescience from a rhino even if you have firing point. Because the spell is cast during movement phase and not shooting phase... so what.. firing point is not available during movement.... I find it weird that you cant cast out of a rhino even if you have a firing point..... " marine you are not allowed to pop your head out of the hatch while the rhino is moving.. gunner you to.. get back in here and strap yourself in..."

[Cheex]

Your friend is correct.

 

"This means that a Psyker embarked on a Transport can only target himself, his vehicle or another unit embarked on the same vehicle..." (RB p67)

 

No exception is given for transports with fire points. In addition, fire points only give permission for models to use them when shooting a weapon (RB p78).

 

Witchfire powers have a specific exception to this, allowing them to be used through a fire point (RB p69).

[skeletoro]

*From memory, mind you* I think he's right. However, you can cast on the unit inside the rhino, or the rhino itself (choose 1).

 

Not so useful casting prescience on a rhino, but giving that storm eagle a 4+ invulnerable save is quite good (though you cannot cast blessings the turn you arrive from reserves, sadly!!!)

[Khine]

*From memory, mind you* I think he's right. However, you can cast on the unit inside the rhino, or the rhino itself (choose 1).

 

Not so useful casting prescience on a rhino, but giving that storm eagle a 4+ invulnerable save is quite good (though you cannot cast blessings the turn you arrive from reserves, sadly!!!)

 

BUT, you can cast them BEFORE you arrive from reserve.

[skeletoro]

Hmm, I don't think that's right...?

 

BRB p 67: On the turn that a psyker arrives from reserve (see page 124) he cannot attempt to manifest any psychic powers that must be manifested at the start of the Movement phase.

 

It seems pretty ironclad to me: no blessings the turn you arrive from reserves. Unless there has been an errata I'm unaware of?

[Grey Mage]

All 'begining of the turn' powers can be used because both happen at the same time, so you as the player whose turn it is decide the order they happen in.

[dswanick]

The BRB FAQ addresses 'start of turn' events, and how they are handled.

[Baba Lem]

It speaks of reserve rolls, however. And not the act of deploying them.

[skeletoro]

What does turn order have to do with it? The rule says you cannot manifest such powers the turn you come in from reserves. Making reserve rolls before using your psychic powers doesn't somehow remove that limitation.

 

Q. Did you come in from reserves this turn?

If yes, no start of turn powers for you.

[Khine]

What does turn order have to do with it? The rule says you cannot manifest such powers the turn you come in from reserves. Making reserve rolls before using your psychic powers doesn't somehow remove that limitation.

 

Q. Did you come in from reserves this turn?

If yes, no start of turn powers for you.

 

BRB FAQ Page 7

"Q: Blessings are manifested ‘at the start of the Psyker’s Movement

phase’ – does this mean they happen simultaneously with Reserves

rolls, Outflanking rolls etc and if so which is resolved first? (p68)

A: They do occur simultaneously – as such, the player whose

turn it is decides in what order these things occur as per

page 9 of the Warhammer 40,000 rulebook."

 

Meaning that you cast your blessing, Then you roll for reserve, THEN you come on from reserve.

 

The rule you stated only stops the psyker from casting maledictions on enemy units or casting blessings on friendly units once they have come on. It still allows them to be cast BEFORE you come on.

 

Granted that just means you could potentially perils yourself to death before you even get on the table if you keep failing your reserve roll.

[dswanick]

What does turn order have to do with it? The rule says you cannot manifest such powers the turn you come in from reserves.

Are you paraphrasing or synthesizing this rule? In a circumstance such as this, I've found it's best to quote your rule verbatim before then posting your interpretation of what that rule means.

[BrotherCaptainArkhan]

 

What does turn order have to do with it? The rule says you cannot manifest such powers the turn you come in from reserves. Making reserve rolls before using your psychic powers doesn't somehow remove that limitation.

 

Q. Did you come in from reserves this turn?

If yes, no start of turn powers for you.

 

BRB FAQ Page 7

"Q: Blessings are manifested ‘at the start of the Psyker’s Movement

phase’ – does this mean they happen simultaneously with Reserves

rolls, Outflanking rolls etc and if so which is resolved first? (p68)

A: They do occur simultaneously – as such, the player whose

turn it is decides in what order these things occur as per

page 9 of the Warhammer 40,000 rulebook."

 

Meaning that you cast your blessing, Then you roll for reserve, THEN you come on from reserve.

 

The rule you stated only stops the psyker from casting maledictions on enemy units or casting blessings on friendly units once they have come on. It still allows them to be cast BEFORE you come on.

 

Granted that just means you could potentially perils yourself to death before you even get on the table if you keep failing your reserve roll.

 

I have never, ever heard of casting psychic powers (or indeed performing any kind of action) with a model that is not even on the table. Is this actually possible? Gut instinct tells me no...

[skeletoro]

<p>I guess I should have used quote marks to make it clearer, but when I gave the page number, that was a verbatim quote from the BRB.</p>

<p> </p>

<p>Even if you could use psychic powers before deploying, I don't think that would allow you to cast psychic powers the turn you arrive from reserves. The rule explicitly disallows this. I don't think you can cast psychic powers before deploying, but if you could and did, I think that would preclude you from arriving from reserves that turn. The rule says that you cannot use them the turn you arrive from reserves (it says nothing about which happens first)</p>

<p> </p>

<p>Unless I'm missing something? But I don't think the turn order thing really contradicts the BRB rule.</p>

<p> </p>

<p>I believe the FAQ exists to deal with situations like where a Rune Priest wants to cast prescience on a different unit that just arrived from reserves. That said, I'm not a mind reader so can never be 100% sure (I'd be 99% sure if GW explicitly stated that this was the purpose of the FAQ - allow 1% for GW later contradicting themselves :P)</p>

<p> </p>

<p>One thing that seems to pop up regularly in rules disputes is intuitions to do with causality and temporal order, but at least to me, it seems that often the rulebook isn't phrased that way. E.g. the following are different:</p>

<p> </p>

<p>1) You can't use the power the turn you arrive from Reserves.</p>

<p>2) You can't use the power after arriving from Reserves that turn.</p>

<p> </p>

<p>Subtle difference, but the BRB (quote in previous post) is phrased like 1.</p>

[dswanick]

<p>I guess I should have used quote marks to make it clearer, but when I gave the page number, that was a verbatim quote from the BRB.</p>

<p> </p>

<p>Even if you could use psychic powers before deploying, I don't think that would allow you to cast psychic powers the turn you arrive from reserves. The rule explicitly disallows this. I don't think you can cast psychic powers before deploying, but if you could and did, I think that would preclude you from arriving from reserves that turn. The rule says that you cannot use them the turn you arrive from reserves (it says nothing about which happens first)</p>

<p> </p>

<p>Unless I'm missing something? But I don't think the turn order thing really contradicts the BRB rule.</p>

<p> </p>

<p>I believe the FAQ exists to deal with situations like where a Rune Priest wants to cast prescience on a different unit that just arrived from reserves. That said, I'm not a mind reader so can never be 100% sure (I'd be 99% sure if GW explicitly stated that this was the purpose of the FAQ - allow 1% for GW later contradicting themselves )</p>

<p> </p>

<p>One thing that seems to pop up regularly in rules disputes is intuitions to do with causality and temporal order, but at least to me, it seems that often the rulebook isn't phrased that way. E.g. the following are different:</p>

<p> </p>

<p>1) You can't use the power the turn you arrive from Reserves.</p>

<p>2) You can't use the power after arriving from Reserves that turn.</p>

<p> </p>

<p>Subtle difference, but the BRB (quote in previous post) is phrased like 1.</p>

Ahh, I think I understand. We're talking two different points. You're talking casting the Blessing on yourself the turn you arrive from Reserve. I (and I think maybe Grey Mage, also) am/are talking casting a Blessing on a unit arriving from Reserve, if you had the ability (which the Fire Points rule does not give).

[skeletoro]

Ahhh, right. Yeah, we were talking about two different things... oops. That did occur to me a while back but then I fell asleep and forgot to ask!! 

[pedrogzc]

so the sequence would be something as roll for reserve, if you get it, then roll for blessings on unit, transport or himself and then deploy?

[SW1]

If the rune Priest started the turn already on the board and something enters the board from reserves the query is can the Power be used on the unit?

 

However if the Rune Priest comes on from reserves then he CAN'T action the power it says so in the rules.