Arhriman in 6th edition

[Khaines wrath]

Just got Ahriman is he any good, if so what armies does it fare well against?

Troops,elites or hq killer plz anwser ASAP

Thanks

Khaine

[Excessus]

He is not that good in cc. He has a force weapon for ID and his staff gives +2S, so high T targets he can do well against, also he can get iron arm from biomancy...but he only has AP4 on his staff, so I wouldn't reccomend using him in cc against 2+ save, that he has his spells for! (and biomancy has a lot of AP2 spells)

[Dam13n]

Ahriman isn't a CC beast - if that's what you wanted you'd have been better off with Khârn or a Jugger-lord with Axe of Blind Fury or a Nurgle Bike Lord with the Black Mace etc.

 

He is, however, the best warpfire caster in the game. His staff allows him to shoot three warpfire powers a turn, plus he's mastery level 4 allowing 4 powers.

 

I'd take:

- Telepathy Primaris - Psychic Shriek

- 1x Pyromancy Power - If it's nothing special - swap for the Primaris, which is basically a heavy flamer.

- 1x Biomancy Power - If it's nothing special - swap for the Primaris - Smite - 4 S4 AP2 shots.

- 1x Tzeentch Power (because you have to) - Provided I already have 3 other psychic shooting attacks, I'd hope to get Boon of Mutation as it's just funny.

 

Regardless, I'd want 3 Psychic Shooting attacks to make the most of his ability, ideally ones that will either cause lots of hits/wounds or ignore as many armour saves as possible.

 

On top of that he comes with the Master of Deception warlord trait which allows him to infiltrate D3 infantry units. Now I'd want units of special weapon chosen for this personally, but opinions will vary.

 

Now for his points cost, he's a bit fragile and not great in melee - so he's by no means the best HQ choice in the codex when it comes to value for points, but if you want to blast people with psychic powers and have a guaranteed useful advantage when deploying - he's in a class of 1 (in the Chaos Codex at least).

[Deschenus Maximus]

No no no, ignore the warpfire ability... what you want Ahriman for (if you do use him) is to roll on Telepathy to get Invisibility, Hallucination and Puppet Master. Mental Fortitude is also useful to give Fearless to your units.

[Dam13n]

Then why not take a normal unmarked Sorcerer with ML3, a Sigil and a Familiar?

 

You'll still have the same saves, the same number of Telepathy powers, you just lose 1 wound and a guaranteed warlord trait.

 

Plus, the Sorcerer will be a lot cheaper.

 

The only things that set Ahriman apart are:

+1 Wound (on T4 - not a big thing for a non-CC character quite frankly)

+1 Mastery Level (although has to use 1 for a Tzeentch Power)

3 Warpfire powers per turn

Guaranteed Master of Deception

 

So the only reason I would take him is if I wanted a fun army that spammed psychic attacks around - otherwise he's kinda pointless. (Huron is cheaper for Master of Deception and the above sorcerer is cheaper for Telepathy/Biomancy buffs).

[minigun762]

 

 

So the only reason I would take him is if I wanted a fun army that spammed psychic attacks around - otherwise he's kinda pointless. (Huron is cheaper for Master of Deception and the above sorcerer is cheaper for Telepathy/Biomancy buffs).

I agree with the overall point but he does bring Deception and Psychic powers if you're really big on having both.

[Deschenus Maximus]

Then why not take a normal unmarked Sorcerer with ML3, a Sigil and a Familiar?

 

You'll still have the same saves, the same number of Telepathy powers, you just lose 1 wound and a guaranteed warlord trait.

 

Plus, the Sorcerer will be a lot cheaper.

 

The only things that set Ahriman apart are:

+1 Wound (on T4 - not a big thing for a non-CC character quite frankly)

+1 Mastery Level (although has to use 1 for a Tzeentch Power)

3 Warpfire powers per turn

Guaranteed Master of Deception

 

So the only reason I would take him is if I wanted a fun army that spammed psychic attacks around - otherwise he's kinda pointless. (Huron is cheaper for Master of Deception and the above sorcerer is cheaper for Telepathy/Biomancy buffs).

 

You are forgeting two things though:

1) even if he HAS to roll on the Tzeentch chart doesn't mean he HAS to use the Tzeentch power - since he is Mastery 4, you could be lucky and get both Invis AND Hallucination on the Telepathy chart. Failing that, it is very very likely he will get at least one Warp Charge 2 power, and then get two Telepathy Warp Charge 1 powers and still not have to use the Tzeentch one. If you are really unlucky, you might get only WC 1 powers, but that is pretty unlikely.

2) Unlike the standard Sorcerer, he is Fearless.

 

In effect, he combines the psychic might of the ML3 Scor and the utility of Huron (Master of Deception + granting Fearless to the unit he join). The ability to use 3 Warpfires is nice, but it is mostly a failsafe in case you get REALLY unlucky and only roll crappy powers.

[Dam13n]

I didn't forget either of those things.

 

They just matter little in the scope of the lists I'd write around either character and the way I'd choose to use them.

[*Furyou Miko]

On the contrary, I do like Ahriman as a melee fighter. Aeronwy (my counts-as) has killed, in close combat: Biker Librarian, C'tan Shard, a fethload of Necron Warriors, several Bikers, and crazy numbers of Tau (including battle suits).

 

I've only played her in about five games. I'd put Ahriman as an all-rounder, but best deployed against non-MEq armies where he can get stuck into the rank and file.

 

Unfortunately, that puts him in the same role as Thousand Son squads.

[Xenith]

Last time I used him I managed to get molten beam, doombolt, endurance and something else.

 

Endurance was excellent, and almost worth taking 3x biomancy for.

 

9 terminators, 2+/4++/5+ FNP and It Will Not Die on Ahriman was priceless.

 

I found the witchfire to be generally underwhelming.

[FashaTheDog]

A fellow at my local store who is also a moderator in the Blood Angels forum runs Ahriman with loads of Thousand Sons squads and lately some Tzzentch Daemons.  Holy damn is his 2,000 point army effective with something close to two dozen rolls on the psychic powers table.  Between the mass invulnerable saves, spammed AP3 and loads of psychic powers for all occasions, with a few other neat little toys here and there to fill in a gap, it is a scary list to face for all but a handful of lists.

[vonny]

A fellow at my local store who is also a moderator in the Blood Angels forum runs Ahriman with loads of Thousand Sons squads and lately some Tzzentch Daemons.  Holy damn is his 2,000 point army effective with something close to two dozen rolls on the psychic powers table.  Between the mass invulnerable saves, spammed AP3 and loads of psychic powers for all occasions, with a few other neat little toys here and there to fill in a gap, it is a scary list to face for all but a handful of lists.

what does he field?

[FashaTheDog]

Off the top of my head, I believe it is Ahriman, a level 3 Tzeentch Sorcerer, a pair of Tzeentch Obliterators, at least three or four squads of Thousand Sons, some Tzeentch Raptors, a Soulgrinder, some Horrors, and a Tzeentch Herald if memory serves. If he wanders over here from the Blood Angels forum (without Sanguinius' rabid forumites killing him), he could tell you better, since you know, he runs the army , and quite well if I might add.

[JamesI]

A fellow at my local store who is also a moderator in the Blood Angels forum runs Ahriman with loads of Thousand Sons squads and lately some Tzzentch Daemons. Holy damn is his 2,000 point army effective with something close to two dozen rolls on the psychic powers table. Between the mass invulnerable saves, spammed AP3 and loads of psychic powers for all occasions, with a few other neat little toys here and there to fill in a gap, it is a scary list to face for all but a handful of lists.

Who could that possibly be?

You missed it Monday, my Ahriman killed a Storm Raven (2 glances from psychic shooting, then it went into hover mode. I had Iron Arm as a power and charged).

Off

the top of my head, I believe it is Ahriman, a level 3 Tzeentch

Sorcerer, a pair of Tzeentch Obliterators, at least three or four squads

of Thousand Sons, some Tzeentch Raptors, a Soulgrinder, some Horrors,

and a Tzeentch Herald if memory serves. If he wanders over here from

the Blood Angels forum (without Sanguinius' rabid forumites killing

him), he could tell you better, since you know, he runs the army , and quite well if I might add.

Generally running Ahriman, level 3 sorcerer, 2 units of TSons (I've cut down a bit), 1 unit of normal marines for some meltaguns (great for infiltrating from Ahriman), 2x2 Oblits. Then mix in screamers, large squad of pink horrors, herald and soulgrinder if I want demons.

Personally, for psychic powers, it depends on the opponent. I always take a shooty power from Tzeentch, but usually not the flame power unless facing masses of minis.

I like Psychic Shriek if facing lots of 2+ armor or low leadership units. Every so often Hallucination works out great for me (Fasha's Abbadon wouldn't know anything about that would he ;) ). But most of my rolls go to Biomancy. Getting Iron Arm is great, smite or life leach are ok, and some of the other powers are pretty good too.

[SRSFACE]

Could have sworn I wrote a post here, but apparently not.

 

Both times I've tried to run Ahriman, he's turned into a Chaos Spawn. It's quite frustrating when a 230 point model turns into a 30 point model. New model syndrome, I suppose. I wish they'd give him a special rule similar to Abaddon where he couldn't spawn or prince out, personally.

 

I personally find him awkward to run. Most likely he's going to sit in a squad of thousand sons, which would rather remain shooting things than running into hand to hand, but most psychic witchfire powers have terrible range. I usually do my first roll on my Tzeentch table as I'm forced to take at least one. If I get Boon of Mutation or Breath of Chaos, I primaris out every time. I know a lot of people aren't a big fan of Tzeentch's Firestorm, but honestly it's usually the only witchfire power I'm ever able to actually get to use before his squad gets charged or I'm better of doing the charging myself and then getting locked into combat the rest of the game. I absolutely love Doombolt, though, so I keep that if I get it. Fun power.

 

Looking at other witchfire powers he's got access to, all of the primaris powers are pistol range only. If you're playing against someone with fast moving troops like bikers or jump packs or beasts, they're going to get the assault off on you before you get it off on them. I know the point of Ahriman is to bring as many witchfires as possible so you can mindbullet people to death, but he's better off taking as many blessings and maledictions as you can take, and frankly I'm not sure that's worth as many points as he costs.

 

I love him, though, all that complaining aside! I love his character in the fluff, I love the silliness he can inflict on the table. He's just not a very competitive choice, in my mind.

[Ethrion]

Ahriman should take biomancy up the ying yang - 3 of them plus the requisite tzeentch spell. His warlord trait needs to be maximized so build the list around that. And while he is not really meant to be a CC monster he can hold his own - especially if he has a bunch of the biomancy spells like increased toughness and strength and eternal warrior. Ive had Ahriman face down Eldrad on e (see: death mission) and managed to survive and kill him.

[Rune Priest Ridcully]

What would you say the smallest game size he could be used in is? i've written up a 1000pts list with him in :P

[*Furyou Miko]

Ahriman is about 250 points. Cultist squad is about fifty points base.

 

Could do Ahriman + cultists at 500 points if you wanted, but you'd have to take Pyromancy to deal with any jerks that bring land raiders.

[JamesI]

What would you say the smallest game size he could be used in is? i've written up a 1000pts list with him in

I've been using him in the current escalation league at my club at 1000 points. He did well, the rest of my army needs some help.

[Rune Priest Ridcully]

What sort of list are you running with him?

[JamesI]

What sort of list are you running with him?

I had 10 chaos marines with meltaguns and a power sword champion, 2 squads of Thousand sons (1 minimum sized, 1 with a few extra guys) and 3 Obliterators. 

 

Worked well against most opponents but I also managed to avoid most of the top players this round of hte league.

 

I wasn't counting on seeing a lot of flyers, and got lucky that I only faced 3 fliers in the round.  For next month I need flyer defense.

[Architect]

I agree with people here posting that you should roll on Tzeentch first before generating other powers. This can give you an idea of what his powers will look like. I normally trade Breath of Chaos in for Firestorm then just roll Pyromancy 3x and focus on killing infantry (unless my opponent has lots of terminators or marines in cover, in which case I go Breath of Chaos/Flame Breath/Psychic Shriek/random Telepathy roll). It's a shame to have more powers than you can use (Invisibility, Hallucination, Molten Beam, Breath of Chaos), but sometimes it can happen if you're not careful.

 

I save Boon of Mutation for the Aspiring Sorcerers, but if you want to keep it on Ahriman, that is the only time I could see him staying away from Witchfire powers. Boon/Endurance/Iron Arm/Enfeeble is actually very very very good........ But don't try to get it. You could be stuck with Boon/3x witchfires which is a waste. You don't have ways to stop taking damage from Boon, so it will only kill you combined with the Perils you WILL take from spamming the witchfires..

 

I am on the team that believes Ahriman should always have three Witchfire powers. My favorite setup (if I can get it!) is Doombolt/Life Leech/Smite/Endurance or Dominate or something. I have rolled that a crazy number of times. Whether or not you believe he is points efficient or not, I am sure that we can all agree that:

 

1.) Ahriman needs 3 witchfires.

2.) Ahriman should always try to have Warp Charge 1 powers to maximize his Mastery Level.

 

Since most Witchfire powers that are truly effective are limited to pistol range and less, it's okay to keep a power like Invisibility or Hallucination, or the good powers from Biomancy. Fire Shield even has a place with Thousand Sons. It's safe to say that you can go a few turns without being in 3x witchfire range, so don't pass on the opportunity to buff/debuff from a distance.

 

For extreme buff/debuff (ie- 3x straight rolls on Telepathy), just take a cheap lvl 3 with Ahriman. You will not be disappointed.

 

So keep all that in mind and he is effective. : ]

[Rune Priest Ridcully]

I am planning on using Ahriman with 2X Telepathy, 1XTzeentch (as we have to) and biomany rather then the biomany mania, mainly for the reasin that as most of the telepathy spells are witchfires, you are making the most of his special rule.
A problem I'm finding in list building is trying to fit 3 infantry squads as I like to take a pair of preds for my heavy support, shich means between them, a big squad of rubrics and Ahriman I struggle to find the pts for a third squad, any thoughts on using him at lower pts level?
Edit: Could a dreadnought use his inflitrate?

[Architect]

Infantry units only

 

Are you concerned with always having 3x Rubricae units at 1000pts? Ahriman would be good with the Telepathy/Telepathy/Biomancy/Tzeentch with this:

 

Ahriman

7 Tsons- Rhino

7 Tsons- Rhino

17 Cultists

Predator- LC Sponsons

Predator- LC Sponsons

 

The real imagine in this list comes with the HQ, of course. Since you intend or enjoy using the above Disciplines, Mental Fortitude would actually be useful to you. I just had to see people get it and then since all their Tsons are Fearless, trade it away and get stuck with it on the second roll... 

 

I like this forum.

[Rune Priest Ridcully]

I really do need to get osme cultist models, only problem no one does robed ones cheaply :/