Flyers and LS Vengeance (and Asmodai)

[L30n1d4s]

As I think about it, the seemingly major misses in the codex are the ones in the title. Everything else seems relatively solid.

 

What if the following:

 

1 - Nephilim Blacksword missiles got Flyerbane rule (gain and extr D3 penetration against flyers)

 

2 - Dark Talon's cannon became a Large Blast, Fleshbane, Heavy 1, Blind weapon

 

3 - LS Vengeance's Plasma Battery became S7 AP2 Heavy4 TLed, 24" or S7 AP2 Large Blast, 36"

 

4 - Asmodai gained Fleshbane for all his attacks.

[Wraith776]

My opinion on it:

1 - Our "air superiority fighter" should have missiles that are at least as strong as a krak missile, seeing as the missile is bigger the launcher for marines

2 - Rather than fleshbane i think it should have some sort of ap value, at least 4. If it can crack a hole in reality than why not armour?

3 - I agree with this, though i think the speeder itself needs something for its survivability.

4 - Again I would rather have an ap father than fleshbane.

[SRSFACE]

I like that idea for Blacksword Missiles. I think the internet has accurately homed in on that being the one thing keeping the Nephilim from being useful. Forget points cost, I just want the thing to feel like it serves a purpose.

 

The Dark Talon's cannon is fine, IMO. It doesn't have an AP value but then again, anything that isn't at least AP4 isn't really that big a deal any way when it comes to shooting. If people are rolling with guys who are just 5+ or 6+ armor and they aren't in cover, chances are even with those saves, not a lot of them are surviving. To make the Dark Talon a lot more useful, they should make it a hover flyer, rather than giving it hover strike. I don't really need BS5 on something where it's shooting attacks are already highly accurate due to twin-linked or simply being a Blast to begin with, what I do need is for it to behave like the gunship it's supposed to be.

 

The LS Vengeance has a few issues going for it, mostly that it's way too expensive. It really needs it's Plasma Storm Battery to be twin-linked. It's represented by 2 barrels: every other weapon like that in the history of Warhammer is twinlinked except for, like, Storm Bolters I think. (And technically, that's not two barrels. It's just two holes in the same barrel.) I've ran it several times alongside my librarian and it's been really, really good. The biggest issues it's got, IMO, is simply it's only armor 10 with HP2, AND tends to glance itself to death anyway. Stupid. Meanwhile, Eldar Fire Prisms get 3 firing modes on their Fire Prisms that allow it to be useful against literally any type of thing ANd at 60" range (A heavy-bolter strength large blast that ignores marine armor, a regular blast essentially Plasma WITHOUT gets hot, and a lance weapon for trying to burrow through Land Raider armor), it's armor 12 all the way around with 3 HP, and it's base 15 points CHEAPER than the LS Vengeance base cost? Ridiculous. Absolutely stupid how that vehicle is better in every single way and is cheaper. You can't even use the argument about how the LSV gets a jink save due to hover, because oh look at that, so do Fire Prisms.

 

If the thing was 100 points base, it'd be about right.

 

Asmodai is fine. He's not good, but he's fine. He's fluffy and fun, not competitive, and I'm okay with that. Whole point of the way they set up the Blades of Reason are because they are one of those weapons you use to heighten the drama of a game. "Make a save, of you're dead!" Makes battles against him pretty epic, assuming the other guy isn't running a monstrous creature or something crazy like that. I wish he was like 15 points cheaper, though, so I wouldn't be tempted (and always end up) going with my own IC instead who ends up being more dangerous and is cheaper.

[Interrogator Stobz]

Totally agree that our dex is nearly there with a few units needing tweaks, my thoughts on your 'wish'list:

1. Blacksword Missiles: Range 72", S8, AP1 the same as Bloodstrike Missiles, NO less than our Brother Angels. @GW: I WILL BUY THREE OF THESE!!!

2. Go see D-Cannon rules in the dirty xenos codex, make the range short like the current one if that helps with balance. @GW: I WILL BUY ANOTHER THREE OF THESE!!!

3. Range 36", S7, AP2 Heavy 3, Twin linked or Range 36", S7, AP2, Large Blast. AND AV11/3HP. @GW: I WILL NEVER BUY THIS DERPSPEEDER BUT PLEASE FIX THE RULES!

4. No opinion, the new model is too naff kidding... I do have the old one and would really like AP3 PS and AP4 PM without losing a pistol too but dreams a free.

I'm not a huge fan of everyone having 'bane' this or 'ignore' that, just good solid stats for things that go boom. Esoteric stuff like the DT cannon would use something weird in the rules department.

Just my 2c toward helping Vetock to get better than a B+ scorecard and help us to remain a viable codex.

Stobz

[cypherthefallenangel]

if it were up to me. This is what I would like to see fixed.

1. black sword missiles 36” S6 Ap4 ”armorbane”. First off this would be an easy 1 word fix. It would still suck against Teq, Meq, MCs, and flying MCs. Ap4 gives you no bonuses on the damage table. It would make unrelenting hunter rule useful. It would give the nephilim an actual game purpose as a anti-flier/tank unit. If you can survive 3 turns to fire all 6 missiles you should glance or pen Av10-14 3 times.(averaging 4 hits) Not overpowered but worth its points.

2. Give the rift cannon rending. fixed.

3. Make it like the executioner 36” S7 Ap2 heavy 3, sm blast and 36” S7 Ap2 heavy 1, lg blast.

4. I think fleshbane or rending would fix the blades of reason.