Kol Saresk Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 I think so. I can't look it up right now But even if the skeleton survives, he would have to regenerate around the skeleton. So as long as the skeleton is caught in the sun's pull, it would mean a literal, burning(or freezing, if you can find one of those cold suns from Atlas Infernal) hell. Until the sun dies at any rate. From their he'll either be blasted across the cosmos or trapped in a black hole. So that's doable. :D Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279225-vulkan-and-the-other-primarchs/page/2/#findComment-3445186 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greyall Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 He'd be permanently dead, I think, so long as he's inside the sun - no pain or anything, since his first cells trying to regenerate will get insta-barbecued, nevermind nerves. You've just found the cure for immortality, Kol. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279225-vulkan-and-the-other-primarchs/page/2/#findComment-3445209 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 I feel special. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279225-vulkan-and-the-other-primarchs/page/2/#findComment-3445218 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 If any of us, in our current state, were immortal, would we singlehandedly make a difference in the Heresy? We're not Primarchs. I mean, I didn't mind the Perpetuals as much when John Grammaticus and Oll were written as basically Immortals from Highlander, who could still be offed by violence. Then we got Betrayer, wherein Perpetuals are completely unkillable (not to mention that between that book and Angel Exterminatus, dying in the Heresy means the same thing as dying in the comic books) and now we have a Perpetual Primarch. And suddenly, I feel a growing fondness for the comparitively minor lore missteps of the fifth edition Grey Knights Codex. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279225-vulkan-and-the-other-primarchs/page/2/#findComment-3445319 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greyall Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 I'll be waiting on this one to see where Vulkan's next appearance takes him (the grave is a possibility). You're right, a Primarch is a different thing and there is the potential for Mary Sue-ism, so no point in discussing something that won't get answers at least until "Unremembered Empire". On its own, Vulkan being immortal is no different from him having a singing mole below his armpit - actually, up until now immortality has allowed him to survive Isstvan V (as was always in his fluff) and to be tortured by Curze. Nothing to see here. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279225-vulkan-and-the-other-primarchs/page/2/#findComment-3445335 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteelPaladin Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 And suddenly, I feel a growing fondness for the comparitively minor lore missteps of the fifth edition Grey Knights Codex. That's a bit harsh. The other perpetuals mention something about each time they resurrect, they come back with a bit missing. A piece of their soul or some such. And Vulkan will die(and stay dead), it's just a matter of how and when. The fulgurite is the most obvious option, but who knows, that could be used instead to wound Horus, or banish daemon price Angron, or kill Dorn in the first Black Crusade, or any number of things. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279225-vulkan-and-the-other-primarchs/page/2/#findComment-3445425 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperor's Furor Posted September 3, 2013 Author Share Posted September 3, 2013 I don't think Vulkan will die, it'll make a mess of all future lore such as the Tome of Fire and his opinions on splitting the legions up. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279225-vulkan-and-the-other-primarchs/page/2/#findComment-3445502 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 All that means is that he has to live long enough to leave Nocturne on a pilgrimage, lol. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279225-vulkan-and-the-other-primarchs/page/2/#findComment-3445507 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperor's Furor Posted September 3, 2013 Author Share Posted September 3, 2013 He's meant to be the last Primarch to disappear afaik. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279225-vulkan-and-the-other-primarchs/page/2/#findComment-3445528 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kais Klip Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 After a while I like it, who better than Vulkan to torture with the old "everyone you ever knew is dead" catch of immortality? Despite first impressions, despite the fact that the risk of Vulkan throwing himself in front of a nuclear bomb to save some homeless family has been nullified, whats more traumatizing to such a soul than a permanent, millennia-repeating case of survivor's guilt? Grimdarkness: Sustained. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279225-vulkan-and-the-other-primarchs/page/2/#findComment-3445530 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostMalone Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 Maybe all the artefacts contain essence of vulkan and when they're reunited he can regenerate? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279225-vulkan-and-the-other-primarchs/page/2/#findComment-3445667 Share on other sites More sharing options...
FunkyMonkey Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 Wait, so I assume Vulkan inherited his Perpetual trait from the Emperor, who is himself supposed to be a Perpetual. If so, how could Vulkan survive torture and murder attempts that I would say greatly eclipsed the injuries of the Emperor sustained against Horus? Nevermind the fact that Horus did blast the Emperor with Chaos psychic powers, but even without the powers, Horus managed to inflict physical wounds with his talons that the Emperor's body on the Golden Throne never seemed to be able to recover from. Edit: Edited for potential spoiler Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279225-vulkan-and-the-other-primarchs/page/2/#findComment-3445897 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostMalone Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 Well he hasn't died as of yet so if he can reincarnate he would have to die Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279225-vulkan-and-the-other-primarchs/page/2/#findComment-3445908 Share on other sites More sharing options...
FunkyMonkey Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 I was under the impression that Vulkan's Perpetual regeneration was always active, regardless of he was dead or not, meaning that he could recover from non-lethal but still grievous injuries much quicker than normal. If this quality is true of Perpetuals, then the Emperor should be up and walking around already, unless the powers of the Chaos gods somehow interfered with that healing power, or the mental strain of forming the beacon of the Astronomican nullified the healing power. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279225-vulkan-and-the-other-primarchs/page/2/#findComment-3445919 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 Well we haven't seen an example of a Perpetual having anything like an enhanced healing factor, at least to my knowledge. They just resurrect with all previous injuries gone. Everytime Vulkan was injured within the book, he usually died right afterwards. Technically speaking, Vulkan died, a lot. So technically speaking, he did not survive Curze. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279225-vulkan-and-the-other-primarchs/page/2/#findComment-3445973 Share on other sites More sharing options...
FunkyMonkey Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 If this is true, then god-damn Malcador should have let the Emperor die instead of going noble and the way of the good servant and reviving him Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279225-vulkan-and-the-other-primarchs/page/2/#findComment-3446058 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greyall Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 Boss' orders. The Emperor demanded to be connected to the Golden Throne. Arguably something in Horus' attacks gave the Empy's perpetual powers pause. Actually, now that I think of it: with all the talk about Ollanius Pious being the guardsman that enters the room and gets flaked by Horus, thereby bringing the Emperor to his senses, I'm betting something 'turns off' all Perpetuals (meaning, their imortality) before the end of the Heresy. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279225-vulkan-and-the-other-primarchs/page/2/#findComment-3446068 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 Possibly. Or maybe there is a page taken out of Doctor Who and they only have so many regenerations. The Emperor and Oll Persson have been alive since the Greeks were big, IIRC the tidbits from Unmarked in the Mark of Calth anthology. The problem would be that Curze drove Vulkan through quite a few of those lives. The Emperor may just be, the 13th Doctor. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279225-vulkan-and-the-other-primarchs/page/2/#findComment-3446206 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Entei Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 Don't restrict your thinking so much guys, we are just starting to grasp the concept of the perpetuals, they may well have vastly different means of reincarnating/regenerating. From what we were told in Unmarked it seems like Oll has worn other bodies than the one he currently uses(Thus my theory about them being free daemons). Also, the events of the Heresy described in the Codex etc. should probably be seen as 10k year old legends, and not fact. To me the stories about the lost Primarchs (Such as Vulkan, Russ, Khan or Corax, not the missing two Legions) are just conjurations to keep the hope up. They may all be dead. Horus may be the one sitting on the Golden Throne(No, I don't believe this.). We don't know yet. Try not to disprove other people's theories by refering to 40k lore when talking 30k. We just know what happens in very broad strokes, and death is in the details. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279225-vulkan-and-the-other-primarchs/page/2/#findComment-3446667 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Musketeer12 Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 So does that mean when the emperor dies, he will be re-incarnated? Musket Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279225-vulkan-and-the-other-primarchs/page/2/#findComment-3446678 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greyall Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 There is talk about that, yes. And it is more or less established that he has been acting through the Warp since his near death, acting as Humanity's god, steering us in the right direction, blessing heroes, etc. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279225-vulkan-and-the-other-primarchs/page/2/#findComment-3446683 Share on other sites More sharing options...
FunkyMonkey Posted September 5, 2013 Share Posted September 5, 2013 So does that mean when the emperor dies, he will be re-incarnated? Musket Depends who you ask. Some of the more radical Inquisitors say that staying attached to his mortal body to light the Astronomican takes up too much of the Emperor's psychic powers in the Warp making him only able to fend off the predations of the Chaos entities upon humanity and not actually take the fight to them as what might have happened after the Great Crusade. Those radical inquisitors say that after the Emperor's death, all of his concentration will be focused on his psychic essence allowing him to be either a full-fledged god of order or allow him to be physically reborn as another emperor with the same essence. Of course, the puritan inquisitors view this idea as lies and heresy circulated by the agents of chaos because it necessitates the Emperor dying and thus being unable to light the Astronomican and guide the Empire (even if only briefly before a rebirth) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279225-vulkan-and-the-other-primarchs/page/2/#findComment-3447065 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fission Posted September 5, 2013 Share Posted September 5, 2013 To Wade Garett : sorry Sir but you are not fairplay with Nick Kyme. 1- These book is stylistically one of his best. He has made a big effort and you can read it. 2- just remember that. When one of theauthor of BL give a new fluff idea its the editors who have the final choice to do it or not... 3- At the end of the book , Kyme explain it is a very old idea that they wanted to put in the background when the Sabertooth Card Game was alive... 4- Don't judge to quickly when you havn't read the book already. You don't know how the author explain it in the story. 5- Never forget its just SF... ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279225-vulkan-and-the-other-primarchs/page/2/#findComment-3448056 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rime Posted September 5, 2013 Share Posted September 5, 2013 Thought I'd mention that there is another Perpetual in Atlas Infernal. She was referred to as a saint. And going back to the Gaunts Ghosts: The Saint we had another saint who is a Perpetual. Seems it isn't limited to the Primarchs or the Emperor. Or maybe GW will pretend that such books don't exist and go about their merry way Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279225-vulkan-and-the-other-primarchs/page/2/#findComment-3448104 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted September 5, 2013 Share Posted September 5, 2013 Not exactly. While it is a theory that the Perpetuals are "good daemons", the Saints seem to be an entirely different matter. So far, every Perpetual shown has regenerated his own genetic material, even from something such as ashes. The Saints seem to actually be more an example of "good daemons" along the lines of Angels and Vessels in Supernatural with a "good spirit" taking possession of a willing host. A person who fits some predetermined and unmentioned sets of requirements comes along, performs a specific set of actions and then they become the Saint, and a completely different person. For example, the specific saint to which you are referring, when we first see the girl, she is a pilgrim. A normal pilgrim. And then after the whole psychic beacon thingymajiggy was done, we later on see the girl now believes herself to be a saint. However, she does not actually become the saint until she was baptized IIRC. The two circumstances might be related, but at the moment, they are vastly different. And it'd be weird for someone to believe that only the Emperor and the Primarchs are Perpetuals since the Emperor and Vulkan(and so far only Vulkan) make up only two of the six confirmed Perpetuals we have been shown. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279225-vulkan-and-the-other-primarchs/page/2/#findComment-3448139 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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