Stickeh Posted September 2, 2013 Share Posted September 2, 2013 With Chief Librarian Tigurius looking like a real winner in the new codex I've been throwing together a few lists trying to use him, however there is one glaring problem: survivability. Tiggy has your basic power armour, 3 wounds and no invun save, he's pretty squishy. This has me pondering what unit to use in order to prevent him becoming an easy slay the warlord point, and I've narrowed it down to a couple of units: Tactical Marines + large unit size, scoring, fairly cheap, gotta fill those troop slots anyway! - only 3+ saves Devastator Centurions + 2+ saves, 2W, powerful ranged weapons benefit from prescience - high point cost, SnP, no invun, ugly models Terminators + 2+ saves, 5+ invun, can take ranged options - high point cost (still cheaper than centurions) Command Squad + very flexible armament, FnP - get expensive very quickly, still only 5 guys with 3+ Each has a couple of points for and against, it's been suggested to me to use TH/SS Terminators, however using them to babysit Tiggy is counter productive to the units main goal (face stomping), and so I feel they're inappropriate. The divination power Forewarning can offset the lack of invun for a few units, however even Tigurius is going fail to get it/successfully cast it occasionally. What unit does the B+C recommend for this role? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 I will run him with sternguard or centurians, making use of Divination for the 4++ hopefully... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Captain Andrew Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 I would run him with Honor Guard. 2+ saves with 4++ from divination, Upgrade to one to a Chapter champion so that he doesn't get challenged out and if you bring a banner Tiggy gets an extra attack. You can also make your other HQ your warlord to avoid giving up that point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stickeh Posted September 3, 2013 Author Share Posted September 3, 2013 Sternguard are great but aren't you worried they're a bit squishy themselves? No more survivable than a tactical squad really. Honour guard have the same problem as Hammernators really, you ideally want to use them aggressively and Tiggy isn't too happy about being in melee. Add on to that the added cost of having to buy and kit out a chapter master (150+ easily) and a transport for the honour guard unit (probably a land raider) you're looking at a huge chunk of points. At anything less than 2k that's not really a feasible unit option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greatcrusade08 Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 ive seen both command squads and honour gaurd suggested, but no-one has taken into account the unlock tax of the captain/chapter master that aside i have been considering tiggy for my scout army, infiltrating/scouting LSS and using teleport homers for gate power to get him and his unit close.. and then i could trigger storm of fire for re-rolls on scouts multi/combi meltas. plus if its a nasty combat unit like honour guard/master/tiggy, they could get turn 2 charges whilst my opponent is still dealing with storm teams and scout bikers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stickeh Posted September 3, 2013 Author Share Posted September 3, 2013 Librarians and chaplains now unlock command squads as well apparently, but you're right about honour guard. Right now I'm leaning towards a Terminator squad with CML for a bit of long range punch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulochromis Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 no invul save? what about telekine dome? do you need him in CC - no, put him in a vehicle with fire points. otherwise a command squad with FnP via apothecary is worth considering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 You guys are right. Tigarius needs a lot of support. The problem I see is that if you plan on using Ultramarine tactics, Marneus Calgar really is the hq of choice despite his cost... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pyroknight Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 In 6th you can't cast blessings out of vehicle fire points (you can only target the vehicle itself). Seems kind of a waste of his divination if you hide him in a transport all game. I would run him with sternguard personally for attack synergy, but the key to his survival is going to be his positioning and mobility. A squad of 3+/4++ marines is pretty hardy if kept out of reach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demus Ragnok Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 Does Tiggy have access to divination powers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greatcrusade08 Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 tiggy knows all disciplines, has mastery 3 and can reroll his psychic power 'selection' rolls Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scrimdog Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 It will be honour guard all the way for me, banner, chamion and with the points decrease they will come in a bit less pricey. My reasoning for this is that I have used my honour guard many times with just a standard librarian 3 power swords and 2 relics. The idea was usually teleport about getting into combat if I didn't run a raider and they were great, did the job everytime if I made the right moves. So imagine them with big T possibly a 4++ and any other power you choose to roll for. Honour guard ARE durable and effective in the offence if used right it could be a great combo in my opinion :) Tiggy with termies just does not seem right to me, TDA is designed to be either teleported in or raidered into the most hostile of combats. They always have strength 8 attacks and that don't mix to well with a librarian, and what's the point in a 4++ when you have a 5++ anyway Now if he could upgrade to termie then I would say that's the only way to run him lol. I actually like the idea of him with a squad of tacticals could be very effective with tiggys abilities to re roll his powers and get almost anything on divination ha imagine a tactical with a 3+ 4++ and rerolls on the dice mmmm dakadaka. But me personally will use him with said honour guard in a raider and will be giving that the 4 invun and thundering down the field to assault almost anything and come out on top :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 Honour Guard in their Land Raider for me for the most part, but I will have a flexible army list (as any Ultramarines player should!) so he can go into a 9 Man Tactical squad's Rhino. Reason being, if I get Misfortune on as one of his powers, I'm going to want to take advantage of it and that usually means Tactical squads. "What's that, Grey Hunters? Yes I know you're bad, but how do you feel about re-rolling your saves after I use the Tactical Detachment Trait and get twin linked weapons?" Plus if I get lumbered with other powers that favour shooting units, I'll want to take advantage of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greatcrusade08 Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 if we can get HG without the chapter master tax, id definately consider them for my scouts tbh.. atm im looking more towards white scars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scrimdog Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 I actually like using my chapter master :) use bombardment on the first turn to get first blood on a cheaky target. (hopefully). But beliveva good list could be made from that particular combo, still it won't be my bread and butter list till I have a few games with him. Does anybody own the model or used him before? I have him painted in pewter and painted up to highlight stage in finecast, but have never fielded him as himself so to speak. Always felt under powered for the greatest librarian of the astartes, I know he has great tactical abilities only matched by the likes of calgar but meh can't put words to it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 I have the original model and won't buy the latest one since it just sucks! I'm using my Tigurius in a planned list like this: Chapter Master - Relic Blade, Eternal Warrior Storm Shield and Artificer Armour Honour Guard - 5, Champion with Relic Blade, Ancient Land Raider Tigurius Tactical Squad - 9, plasma gun Rhino Tactical Squad - 10, plasma gun Rhino 5 Man squad with heavy weapon (or Scouts - we'll see) 5 Man Biker squad with 2x Grav guns and combi grav 5 Man Biker squad with 2x Grav guns and combi grav Now this is just a preliminary idea, but the core concept is established for further use; Tigurius goes with the Land Raider and Honour Guard when I need to boost their survivability and hitting power (ha ha, Orks? Unit of 20? Don't make me laugh!), or if my opponent is like Tau I might want to be casting other powers I might want to spread the fun to a Tactical squad. Remember you can't caste Maledictions inside a transport ;) An interest discussion is what to powers might be best for him and his unit? Divination is great as we all know, but imagine a Feel No Pain, 3+ invulnerable save and 4 wound model tanking the damage along with It Will Not Die and Eternal Warrior. I also love the idea of putting -1 to toughness of opposing units, so the Biomancy table does appeal to me. Only problem is I only really want to take 2 of the powers for Tigurius from Biomancy where as I can feasibly get 3 powers I want from Divination (i.e. the Primaris power). Still, it's not terrible to be able to hit an opponent with S6 AP2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 You know, I've been pondering this. Putting Tigarius with Sternguard, Termies or a Command Squad screams "Shoot me!" I think it's best to bubble wrap him with 10 normal tacticals, give everyone a 4++ and march him up the field behind a tank. Tacs are the weakest and most overpriced unit we have to put up with. Tigarius can definitely make them more survivable :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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