jamsight Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 Hi guys since 6th rolled in I have been having a very hard time adapting to the fact that close combat just isn't as viable anymore which is kind of sad since I love a good fight in the middle of the table, so I could do with some advise on how to implement my force to better effect it's at 2k points, I know I am missing the extra armour from the list since now it's pointless my normal list is Logan rune priest living lightning storm caller 4 wolf guard termies 1 set of wolf claws 1 frost blade 1 powerfist 1 chain fist assault cannon Land raider troops 9 Grey Hunters meltagun, power sword rhino 9 Grey Hunter meltagun, power sword rhino 10 Grey Hunters 2 meltaguns, power axe rhino Land speeder multi melta Long Fangs 2 las cannons 3 plasma cannons Long Fangs 2 las cannons 3 plasma cannons main opponents one runs is death wing. or raven wing with the banner of devatation the other an Eldar and Tau or necrons from time to time, What I would like is suggestions on the tactics I should use for each unit and if you think the force is missing something then please tell me. Point I now about logan the guard and raider are very expensive and I am looking at trying to reduce the points sink there. thanks for any tip in advance Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279724-need-help-with-my-army/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mammon Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 Have you thought about using Drop Pods? Most of your list could easily be placed into Drop Pods and used effectively. Your Long Fangs are pretty expensive too. I can see from your list of usual opponents the low AP values would be extremely beneficial but at the price you could trim some of the points fat from this unit by switching to MLs. The Ravenwing will get their Jink saves regardless of the guns AP and the Krak missile will wound marines just as well as the Plasmacannon. Facing Necrons and Tau I can't fault you for using the Lascannons. Given the choice I usually opt for the Twin Linked Lascannnon Razorbacks. The 'backs are glasscannons but can move and shoot independently of the LFs and let you engage 3 units instead of two. Tau and Necrons can make the RBs go boom pretty quickly but they are two extra targets he has to engage and he has to since they can threaten AV14. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279724-need-help-with-my-army/#findComment-3452183 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rift Blade Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 Have to agree with Mammon. For the list you have, Drop Pods might solve your problems against all your opponents. They would let you get your units closer to where they need to be easier. Also, yeah, I would change some of the plasma cannons to missile launchers. Maybe not all but definitely some of them, say 2 in each Long Fang pack. I take it the Rune Priest rides with one of the Gray Hunter packs? If so, have you considered Murderous Hurricane? It hurts mobile armies & you can use it slow down opponents who are trying to get away from your packs coming forward. If you go to Drop Pods & drop the Land Raider, that should give enough points for a 3 man pack of Thunder Wolf Cavalry. With 2 Storm Shields, you can run these guys up using cover while the opponent deals with the Drop Pod packs. With the list you have, I'm assuming you have tried pushing the Land Raider forward with a Rhino tucked in behind it for the cover save & then double teaming whatever it is your charging? THe only other thing that pops to mind is perhaps taking the 10 man Gray Hunter pack & making it 2x5 man packs & scrappping up enough points(changing plasma cannons to missile launchers & maybe even the Frost Blade to a regular power weapon) to give both packs basic Razorbacks with HB's. Use those 2 packs to camp on objectives in your deployment preferably in cover & fire support the other 2 packs & the Wolf Guard. If so, points permitting, give those 2 packs plasma guns for the range. My 2 cents. Good luck. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279724-need-help-with-my-army/#findComment-3452237 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamsight Posted September 8, 2013 Author Share Posted September 8, 2013 Thanks for the advice guys your saying what I've been thinking also I added the points up again and I am sort 128 pts so I could get the 5 man Grey Hunter units with out changing to many bits around I also see you point with the plasma cannons when I 1st took them they scared the hell out of my opponent to such a degree he woun't deep strike which at the time was what I wanted but sine times gone on he's made them target number 1 with everything. the only issue I have with the drop pods is that once I've deployed I am kind of stuck where I am and the Eldar and Raven Wing will decamp pretty quicky. and leave me stranded or strung out. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279724-need-help-with-my-army/#findComment-3452326 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rift Blade Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Keep your Pods supporting each other. A little trick is to buy pods for your Long Fangs & any units you intend to start on the board & deploy those pods empty. It should allow you to bring in most if not all your pod units turn 1. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279724-need-help-with-my-army/#findComment-3452921 Share on other sites More sharing options...
logun Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 if you want to keep the rhino rush theme then i would suggest a vindicator. i added one last week. awesome, just awesome. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279724-need-help-with-my-army/#findComment-3453108 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sohail187 Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 <p>I played a game against raven wing yesterday.... first time ever. OMG the amount of bikes and the fact he was in my half on the firs turn... I pooped my self. I used a list similar to your list, but i used drop pod and 2 razorbacks with 6 man squads. Termies power fists and standard power weapons + combi plasma. and x2 LF with 5 missile launcher.</p> <p> </p> <p>Such a close game!! but i lost due to a lack of experience in the game and making a few bad choices. However the only thing that turned the game for me to even make it as close as it was. Drop pods. in his turn 2 after boosting to my side of the table MY GOD the dmg just insane.... But once the rest of my pods and reserves arrives, and i was able to position them in key locations. KAPOW! i took down bike after bike after bike. I would defo drop the land raider, yes it is nice to being able to charge out of the vehicle, however it is a rare occasions when i actually get my LR across the field to do this.</p> Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279724-need-help-with-my-army/#findComment-3453376 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamsight Posted September 10, 2013 Author Share Posted September 10, 2013 All great advice thanks guys. I've done the vindicator threat stratagem and it works but 125 points to absorb a few melta for a turn or too is abit steep I am thinking that a razorback for the fangs is an idea over empty drop pods abit of mobile firepower is always a good idea. I will put up a revised army list before the weekend. so point that have been made are drop landraider take drop pods lose 2 plasma cannons in each squad take another unit of grey hunters in a razerback maybe even two thunderwolves for extra kill add vinidcator id possible any more advice is welcome hopefully I can challenge my Raven Wing friend and Wolf! him to death Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279724-need-help-with-my-army/#findComment-3456267 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted September 10, 2013 Share Posted September 10, 2013 Plasma might help on a GH pack instead of melta, if you feel youve had enough tank busting elsewhere to deal with those landraiders. And I second the call for more missiles. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279724-need-help-with-my-army/#findComment-3456294 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamsight Posted September 10, 2013 Author Share Posted September 10, 2013 yer this list was made in the heady days of 5th ed so plasma was avoided but now it's making a comeback so LOAD ALL THE PLASMA !! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279724-need-help-with-my-army/#findComment-3456331 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamsight Posted September 11, 2013 Author Share Posted September 11, 2013 revised list HQ Logan Rune Priest ELITES 4 Wolf Guard terminator armour chainfist terminator armour powerfist terminator armour frost axe terminator armour heavy flamer wolfclaw Drop pod TROOPS 9 Grey Hunters plasmagun, Plasma pistol, power weopem Drop pod 9 Grey Hunters plasmagun, power weopen Wolf Guard Power weopen Drop pod 9 Grey Hunters flamer power weopen Wolf Guard Powerfist Drop pod 9 Grey Hunters meltagun Power weopen Wolf Guard power weopen Drop pod 5 Grey Hunters plasmagun plasma pistol Wolf Guard plasma pistol Razorback las-plas HEAVY SUPPORT 6 Long Fangs 2 las cannons 2 missile launchers plasma cannon 6 Long Fangs 2 las cannons 2 missile launchers plasma cannon 2009pts tactics Long fangs Deploy in good cover with LoS and shot stuff razorback held in reserve Logan and 1st two units of Hunters drop in turn one and feed the biggest target plasma logan charges and finishes whats left next two pods land on objective(s) and hold razorback comes in and supports what ever needs them most Review and advice welcome Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279724-need-help-with-my-army/#findComment-3457085 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rune Priest Jbickb Posted September 11, 2013 Share Posted September 11, 2013 Not a bad list, 5 pods I a good number. Though I think you should find the points to make those 9 man squads 10 man as its only 60 points that you need and then every squad has 2 special weapons. 2 plasmaguns are better than one after all. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279724-need-help-with-my-army/#findComment-3457102 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sohail187 Posted September 11, 2013 Share Posted September 11, 2013 agree if you get rid of may the power weapons from the gh, make the squads 10 man and u get a 2nd plasma gun for free. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279724-need-help-with-my-army/#findComment-3457106 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW1 Posted September 11, 2013 Share Posted September 11, 2013 Don't you need to have a 5th Wolf Guard to have a heavy weapon TDA. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279724-need-help-with-my-army/#findComment-3457246 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamsight Posted September 11, 2013 Author Share Posted September 11, 2013 The 9 men squads have a Wolf Guard or the rune priest (might change that and put him with the fangs for divination) so with them capacity is full power weopens are incase I get charged we have them as options so may as well take them give me the edge in a fight and I have 8 wolf guard total so heavy weopen count isn't an issue. all good points though maybe with the 2.0 list after a battle or 3 I will make the 9 man plasma unit 10 man by dropping the power weopen for 5 shots at 12 inches sure to scare any unit who wants to charge me. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279724-need-help-with-my-army/#findComment-3457268 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW1 Posted September 11, 2013 Share Posted September 11, 2013 Didn't spot the extra WG in the list until you mentioned them, going to try knocking together a few lists tonight myself. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279724-need-help-with-my-army/#findComment-3457546 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rune Priest Jbickb Posted September 12, 2013 Share Posted September 12, 2013 Yup I missed em too my bad. I think I read em as wolf standards which would also help you list. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279724-need-help-with-my-army/#findComment-3458124 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamsight Posted September 12, 2013 Author Share Posted September 12, 2013 I did consider wolf standards but to fit them in I would have to loss something from somewhere else and I don't feel that would be beneficial to the force Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279724-need-help-with-my-army/#findComment-3458901 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkseer Posted September 12, 2013 Share Posted September 12, 2013 I reckon the best SW army for 6th is.... Rune Priest in termie armour, Jaws and Living Lightning (swap for Divination powers VS flyer heavy armies) X5 Wolf Guard in Terminator Armour, 1 has a Cyclone X2 Lone Wolves with Chainfist and Storm Shield X10 Grey Hunters, 2 plasma, standard X10 Grey Hunters, 2 plasma, standard X10 Grey Hunters, 2 melta, standard X10 Grey Hunters, 2 melta, standard X5 Grey Hunters, 1 plasmaX5 Long Fangs, 4 missiles X5 Long Fangs, 4 missiles X5 Long Fangs, 4 missiles Aegis Defense Line with Icarus Lascannon A Wolf Guard Terminator leads each Grey Hunter pack who march forward Lone Wolves run forward The Wolf Guard with Cyclone joins the 5 man pack to hold an objective and fire/support The Rune Priest mans the Icarus Lascannon and casts Prescience on the Long Fangs if needed...That comes to 1750pts. Works a treat, because people struggle with all those bodies. Plus you can do clever things with the Aegis line for all 63 models! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279724-need-help-with-my-army/#findComment-3459061 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamsight Posted September 12, 2013 Author Share Posted September 12, 2013 I've got a 1000pter with wolf horde in mind -the defence line with the new marine dex out looking at a 250 pt ally force with a hunter in it Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279724-need-help-with-my-army/#findComment-3459469 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mammon Posted September 16, 2013 Share Posted September 16, 2013 Armies on foot are great in many ways. In terrain heavy games it gives you greater control in how your enemy can allocate wounds to you with the Focused Fire rules. Not to mention Grenades are sheer awesome against buildings and units inside Fortifications. In objective based games a full sized unit of marines can be hard to displace for some armies. There are lots of bodies to soak up the hits and with the 6th Edition "Shoot and Scoot" Rapid Fire weapons I have run foot armies several times. Footslogging does surrender the initiative to armies who are better able to concentrate their forces to reduce a specific unit or flank. Fluid armies such as Tau or Eldar could bring a devastating amount of firepower to bare and kill units piecemeal, quickly. Without Transports or Pods to protect your Troops you will start taking casualties early; playing as Astartes those losses early in the game could cost you everything late game. If one of your flanks buckles, the enemy gains more room to maneuver. If the Long Fangs are not position correctly they have to endure a turn of 6s to hit til they can find better firing lanes. Playing against that army, I would choose to go second, watch your deployment, then tailor mine accordingly to force you to either bunch up your Grey Hunters for Blast/Templates or move your Long Fangs. it is a great list. I don't share the opinion it is the best Space Wolves list in 6th Edition but I am quibbling on the adjective. It would be interesting to see players take this list to tournaments and poll the results on the forum! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279724-need-help-with-my-army/#findComment-3464339 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamsight Posted September 16, 2013 Author Share Posted September 16, 2013 thanks for the tips Mammon you are spot on with the eldar I think my best bet would be to go second as you suggest and castle up on the objectives and have logan and his crew run riot on the back field try and scatter the enemy like a wolf in a flock of sheep get them into the guns of my grey hunters and long fangs Logan is a tough enough nut that my friend tries to steer clear of him he will proberly try and have Samaiel challange him but I think it would be a onesided contest logan will just out fight him with 5 attacks eternal warrior doesn't matter if your taking enough wounds hehe Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279724-need-help-with-my-army/#findComment-3464672 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valerian Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 I did consider wolf standards but to fit them in I would have to loss something from somewhere else and I don't feel that would be beneficial to the force Just my recommendation, but do what you can to fit them in, even if you have to drop a few other pieces of equipment to do it. There is no more cost effective item in any codex. 10 points to re-roll every single 1 rolled throughout an entire assault phase is almost criminal. The only thing about Wolf Standards is that you have to remember to use them! V Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279724-need-help-with-my-army/#findComment-3465518 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamsight Posted September 17, 2013 Author Share Posted September 17, 2013 thanks for the tip I know wolf standards are the best thing I could be taking perhaps I should drop the power weopens in the unit that I will have one power weopen on a Wolf Guard. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279724-need-help-with-my-army/#findComment-3465601 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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