Daemon princes - Using them in the current codex.

[Rune Priest Ridcully]

So whilst sorting through stuff for ebay, I came across an old metal daemon prince I'd never finished, so I've given him a new head and am painting him, mainly to use for the lucky table roll.

However I am finding myself liking this model more and more, (It may be the grin on the head I gave him, I don't know). and so I was wondering, how do people field daemon princes if they actually take them? I have heard of success with the black mace and wings, but am wondering if the mace is esential, I'm also not sure to give him power armour or not if did use him.

[minigun762]

I think Wings & Power Armor are required. Beyond that, it's how many points you want to invest making it killier.

[zyl-]

The black mace is pretty much needed to avoid tar pit situations especially since it can kill outside of a challenge with it's power. The armor is basically necessary for auto cannons or the like (quad gun). Most small arms can't get through the toughness, and anything heavier is invuln save. Daemon of Tzeentch is the way to go for the saves. The burning brand is nice, too. I find mastery levels too expensive for the payout they bring due to how unreliable powers are.. and the tax of a level that's wasted on a power from the chaos codex.

[bjoluemblem]

The popular form for the DP in my area is wings, power armor, Mark of Nurgle, Mastery Level 3, Black Mace. It's super strong, with stealth+shrouded, vector strike, and T6. slow and purposeful is mitigated by the wings and somewhat by the black mace, in that if an enemy runs, they run after dying to the mace's special rule. The mastery level I find to be invaluable, as the powers should be the mandatory power in Nurgle, and two in Biomancy. If you're lucky, you'll get the eternal warrior power, but most of the others are okay as well.

[Dravenguild]

The popular form for the DP in my area is wings, power armor, Mark of Nurgle, Mastery Level 3, Black Mace. It's super strong, with stealth+shrouded, vector strike, and T6. slow and purposeful is mitigated by the wings and somewhat by the black mace, in that if an enemy runs, they run after dying to the mace's special rule. The mastery level I find to be invaluable, as the powers should be the mandatory power in Nurgle, and two in Biomancy. If you're lucky, you'll get the eternal warrior power, but most of the others are okay as well.

 

Daemon princes do not get mark of nurgle, so no T6. They are daemons of nurgle instead, so you can be instakilled by Str10 unless iron arm

[Emperors Immortals]

I do complain alot, but chaos is fun to play. I give me DP "ElCheapo" the brand, power armour and wings and let him go after troop units, while my top of the line takes Tzeentch ,mace , max.magic and wings.

 

They are fun to play, and I'm still trying to properly model a kai gun, so there's a lot more fun to be had i think.

[Sception]

As mentioned already, daemon prince of nurgle is not T6, because it does not have the mark of nurgle. Princes don't get marks, they get the 'daemons of' rules instead.

 

Nurgle is still generally preferred for shroud to cover the initial advance, though s&p can be a pain, and I find the other alignments to all be reasonable alternatives. Wings and power armor are largely obligatory. Black mace isn't necessary, but is a very good choice, especially if you plan on solo charging, in which case you will be forced to accept sacrificial challenges since you won't have a unit with you. Note the prince does not have the champion of chaos rule, and as such is not otherwise requires to issue challenges, and does not roll on the boon table for killing enemy characters.

 

When running a prince, it helps to have some extra air elements to help overwhelm anti air guns. A pair of princes and a couple drakes might be enough. Daemon allies can help, but if you really want to spam FMCs, you're better off main dexing daemons anyway, and taking csms as allies, if at all. If you do take a second csm prince, brand or blinding axe are decent choices if the first prince already has the mace.

 

If running black legion, the skull for immortal warrior, or the spineshiver for extra attacks, or both if your group allows multiple artifacts on the same character (mine doesn't), are alright.

 

Regardless of how you equip it, try to use line of sight blocking terrain (city ruin kits with windowless bottom floors are ideal) to restrict the number of enemy units that can fire on it while closing. If need be, paint suitable terrain that you buy or build yourself and donate it to the local store or club. A handful of lasguns or bolter shots may not be likely to do much harm to a prince, but they do force grounding tests, which can be crippling, when they aren't just outright fatal.

[Excessus]

No, nurgle princes isn't as popular as you'd think, mali. Tzeentch princes are much better when not psykers. When psykers they are a bit more close...

[Dammeron]

Consider taking an allied detatchment of the Black Legion and equipping your Daemon Prince with The Skull of Ker'ngar; this will give it some of the staying power necessary to take down those pesky Chapter Masters and will protect it from Instant Death.

[the jeske]

Well a chapter master still kills the DP , +3inv , beats +5inv when both have EW.

 

IMO power armor is not an auto include . when grounded or targeted by flyers the power armor won't save him. same with mass fire.

It costs too much to be auto include and doesn't have enough utility .

 

dark mace +wings are auto takes , psyker lvls depand on points played and army build , power armor is a bonus , personaly I never find points to buy it.

[totgeboren]

I tried out a flying Khorne DP with the Khorne Axe and power armour. He hits with a silly amount of attacks at I8 and S9 on the charge. As long as you are careful and don't assault any model within 2" of an enemy character, he can totally decimate anything on the assault.

 

Maybe not the best setup, but he stands a fairly good chance of killing big scary enemy monsters before they get to swing. Though, the mace gives you that too, but with the added benefit of the curse.

[the jeske]

That is why the mace is better, neve rof a nrohk PD . being ap 2 on a high I character it goes around the whole "chaos dudes stuck in challange" thing.

[Rune Priest Ridcully]

Looking at them, I'm thinking power armour, MOT, wings and the burning brand may be good, however it comes to 250pts, and looking at his stats he looks too squishy, plus for his points I could get a kitted out lvl 3 sorcerer some marines, a cultist hoard, a pair of rhinos with havok launchers or some bikers.

Does he perfom better then he looks on paper?

[the jeske]

Not since we got a 4th helldrake slot .

[Rune Priest Ridcully]

Discounting the use of hell drakes, are they good?

[Emperors Immortals]

Ive found him good, but not amazing. Thing is he will get creamed in many challenges, so keep away from charcters. Having a distraction unit is great, spawn work well after your opponant learns about spawn tarpits.

 

The brand is good value, and really lets you sort out MEQ units from out of charge range, spells are there mostly for buffs or just because its fun, and the package allows you to support other units by decimating troop choices/objective claimers.

 

Most efficient setup? probably not, but he does well if you dont run him as a CC powerhouse, which I suppose is kind of his role. I just cant bring myself to add another drake.......

[the jeske]

Discounting the use of hell drakes, are they good?

Maybe in a demon list as ally , if somehow dark mace is not an option. Or in a chaos list that runs 2 DP 2xcultists , drakes and demon ally.

[EricBasser]

Has anyone tried the Black Legion Nova artefact on a Prince? Thinking Wings, Armor, ML3, Last Memory, Spell Familiar, and Spine sword or Skull. Either Nurgle or Tzeentch. Nurgle would be for two guaranteed nova powers.

[Sception]

My venue goes by the reading that a character can take only a single artefact. And while the spell familiar makes failure unlikely, I still wouldn't want to risk the automatic death for failing to cast the memorie's power on a character costing 300 odd points.

[EricBasser]

Yeah, with the Black Legion Supplement wording, it doesn't say trade a weapon for either. I'm taking it as you can take asany as you want, but it will be costly.

 

I main Daemons, so I was thinking of the Prince I described as allied. Black Mace does seem good, but most of my force if Tzeentch shooting. So I'll probably just stick to Last Memory. With Spell Familiar/Fateweaver I'm not too worried about failing the psychic test.

[Sception]

You don't want to overloadfateweaver, daemons will have a lot of critical rolls already. Anyway, the whole artefact thing needs errata, especially for black legion. If the official ok comes down for multiple artefacts, then awesome, a skullshiver prince will definitely start showing up in my lists, at least to try him out. Until then,though, I don't want to rely on a ruling that could be contentious, orstart building my tactics around a unit so likely to be dismantled by future faq.

[Rune Priest Ridcully]

Would you say Daemon prince needs Psyker level?  My mate has a love of riptides and I'm thinking a daemon prince could be a good counter, but am not sure whereever or not he would need any psychic powers, they are good but to get to level 2 or 3 means he gets close to 300pts.
I'm using the chaos marine codex, not using the black legion supplement.

[Tenebris]

I agree with Jeske, Wings, Mace and Daemon of Tzeentch and you throw it against the enemy. Point and click, it requires nothing else. 

[nurglez]

with graviton guns around are people considering not putting power armour on their prince?

 

A totally pimped out DP is rather expensive yes, but if you roll biomancy and get iron arm, he can be totally amazing. Or you could roll badly and be totally crappy having wasted 75 points on psychic abilties...

[Tenebris]

Not really, but due to the point cost which can be incisive on a CSM army list. I think the Daemon Prince should be cheap and cheerful and I have fielded him with Wings alone with some good results. Though the best setup is a fully kitted Daemon Prince with both Mastery levels and the Black Mace the cost becomes high very quickly and you risk to gimp the other elements of your army list due to it. As much with chaos it is not a good option versus a bad option but a mediocre vs a mediocre option so regardless of how much you invest in a Daemon Prince the cost effect ratio is seldom in your favor. Thus when I field it I favor a lower cost and less wargear as possible in order to make him simply a scary thing that eats some flak while I move around with the rest of my army. Not aptly expendable but neither critical to my army. Since I like my model the Daemon Prince usually ends being part of the daemon detachment.