Looking for a Little Help - Army List Creation

[Primacy]

Greetings, Brothers. 

 

I'm a newbie to the forums, but I already like that the Unforgiven have their own subforums in B&C. I am a huge fan of all things Dark Angels, and have been since I started playing 40k. My main reason for coming to the forums is this: I need help coming up with a good, competitive army list. I havent actually played 40k since the birth of 4th edition, and I have no idea how to play with the new Dark Angels. I need a tactica update.

 

I have a range of models so far:

- Dark Vengeance box set (1 Tac Squad, 1 DW Terminators Squad, 1 RW Biker Squad, 1 Librarian, 1 Company Master)

- 2 Tac Squads

- Ezekiel

- Company Master

- 1 DW Terminator Squad

- 1 Devastator Squad

- 2 Scout Squads (with Sniper Rifles)

- Command Squad

- 1 Assault Squad

- 1 RW Bike Squad

 

Now, as far as what to do with these models, I have no clue. I don't have a cohesive army, and I need some help coming up with one. What do I need? Who should I take and what should I get rid of? Do I need more? Thanks for your input. 

[xnickbaranx]

You have a great mix of stuff. The least popular options in your pile are Scouts and Assault Marines. I, or course, use both but I'm not a "highly competitive player".

 

Deathwing is considered a solid build. Currently Ravenwing seem to be the top competitive choice - I hear great things about combining Ravenwing with the Standard of Devastation for mobile firepower.

 

People seem to be anti-multi-wing as its tough to take advantage of the full synergy between the parts of the army at the 1500-1850 point range.

 

You might consider focusing on one element - Ravenwing or Deathwing to start, and building out from there. Just make sure you take Sammael or Belial to make your bikes/termies troops.

[Isiah]

What size army are you looking to build? 500 points, 1500, 2000? My advice would to carefully scrutinise both army list and comments in the DA Army list section to try and glean what works and what isn't so hot.

 

If in doubt - go with what feels right for you. Remember armies are fluid entities and should evolve with both time and experience :).

 

Cheers

I

[march10k]

+1 to Isiah's words.  The other important question is "how do you want your army to work?"  Do you favor the immovable object or the irresistible force?  Mobility or firepower?  Numbers or individual prowess?  The bolter or the chainsword?  You will not be happy or effective if you can't answer these questions, and you can be both regardless of the answer because DA is well balanced and can build a viable army of any style you like.

[Primacy]

You have a great mix of stuff. The least popular options in your pile are Scouts and Assault Marines. I, or course, use both but I'm not a "highly competitive player".

Deathwing is considered a solid build. Currently Ravenwing seem to be the top competitive choice - I hear great things about combining Ravenwing with the Standard of Devastation for mobile firepower.

People seem to be anti-multi-wing as its tough to take advantage of the full synergy between the parts of the army at the 1500-1850 point range.

You might consider focusing on one element - Ravenwing or Deathwing to start, and building out from there. Just make sure you take Sammael or Belial to make your bikes/termies troops.

I really like the Deathwing, in both fluff and model appearance. But they seem to be relatively too expensive in the army I am trying to create. I just feel like I could do more with less. Besides, according to what I've been told about 6th Ed. meta, Termies in Deep Strike don't survive for long. I can and will gladly chunk the Scouts and Assault marines if necessarily. I dont think I've ever played with them anyways.

What size army are you looking to build? 500 points, 1500, 2000? My advice would to carefully scrutinise both army list and comments in the DA Army list section to try and glean what works and what isn't so hot.

If in doubt - go with what feels right for you. Remember armies are fluid entities and should evolve with both time and experience .

Cheers

I

I am hoping to play anywhere from the 1000 to 2000 point range. I'll be sure to look in that section of the forums though. Thank you!

+1 to Isiah's words. The other important question is "how do you want your army to work?" Do you favor the immovable object or the irresistible force? Mobility or firepower? Numbers or individual prowess? The bolter or the chainsword? You will not be happy or effective if you can't answer these questions, and you can be both regardless of the answer because DA is well balanced and can build a viable army of any style you like.

I like the idea of a shooting army, which I get the impression DA are relatively good at doing. I know that having Azrael would assist this sort of army but I'm not sure of things like what size of force he's best in, and who I am take him with (other than as many bolters as possible). I would prefer a solid army over a solid individual character.

Thank you for all the input thus far!

[facmanpob]

I think the simplest thing to do in the short term is find a mate who is happy to run a balanced army list against you, create an army out of all of your miniatures, and play......

Once you've had a couple of games with all your stuff, you'll have a much better idea of what worked and what didn't, and more importantly what you liked and what you didn't.....

You can read all the helpful advice you like, but it's no substitute for finding out yourself what units you like to use

[Brother-Sergeant Bohemond]

If you want to run a shooty army...then Standard of Devastation is the answer, and blow your enemies away with firepower.

[DiscipleOfCaliban]

Although Assault Marines are not popular they can compliment a RW force who would otherwise struggle with buildings. On the other hand they aren't scoring so you may as well just attack the building or kill anyone inside of it with SoD massed bolter fire.

[march10k]

If you want a shooty army, you definitely need to avoid the deathwing.  They simply don't have the model count to provide enough shooting, and their stormbolters don't benefit from the dakkapole anyway.  And you don't want to leave the dakkapole out of a shooty list!

 

I would start with this:

 

All three tactical squads

 

The devastator squad

 

The librarian (with prescience and a PFG.  He joins either the command squad or the devastators, depending on whether you can hide the command squad out of LOS and still get the benefit of the banner...which means that he usually joins the command squad to give them the save, lol...just keep the devastators close so he can twinlink them!)

 

The command squad (preferably with combi-weapons...they can get one good shot of plasma or melta, and otherwise benefit from the banner they'll be carrying)

 

That gives you 46 models for about 1100 points.  Find out what the usual points level is in your area, and add whatever you need to get to that points level.  Preferably?  Add bikes from here.  They don't need to be scoring, but if you're playing 1850 or more, take Azrael in addition to the librarian, and you not only make the bikes scoring, you give a 4++ to both the command squad and the devastators.

[Primacy]

I think the simplest thing to do in the short term is find a mate who is happy to run a balanced army list against you, create an army out of all of your miniatures, and play......

Once you've had a couple of games with all your stuff, you'll have a much better idea of what worked and what didn't, and more importantly what you liked and what you didn't.....

You can read all the helpful advice you like, but it's no substitute for finding out yourself what units you like to use

I will take your advice

If you want a shooty army, you definitely need to avoid the deathwing. They simply don't have the model count to provide enough shooting, and their stormbolters don't benefit from the dakkapole anyway. And you don't want to leave the dakkapole out of a shooty list!

I would start with this:

All three tactical squads

The devastator squad

The librarian (with prescience and a PFG. He joins either the command squad or the devastators, depending on whether you can hide the command squad out of LOS and still get the benefit of the banner...which means that he usually joins the command squad to give them the save, lol...just keep the devastators close so he can twinlink them!)

The command squad (preferably with combi-weapons...they can get one good shot of plasma or melta, and otherwise benefit from the banner they'll be carrying)

That gives you 46 models for about 1100 points. Find out what the usual points level is in your area, and add whatever you need to get to that points level. Preferably? Add bikes from here. They don't need to be scoring, but if you're playing 1850 or more, take Azrael in addition to the librarian, and you not only make the bikes scoring, you give a 4++ to both the command squad and the devastators.

This sounds like something I would like to try. Thanks! The average game in my neck of the wood is usually 1500-2000 pts. I have enough models to support such an army, but I don't think it'd be a good one. I actually went back through my things and found another Tac squad, along with a chaplain with an assault pack. And I forgot to mention the Chaplain that came with Dark Vengeance. Are those useful in any way?

[SvenONE]

Personally I think building a bike-centric army with greenwing or deathwing support (one or the other, not both) is the way to go.  Ravenwing armies are durable, mobile, and can really keep your game from being really lopsided.  

 

People say pure Deathwing is a list that requires "skill and finesse", I think that's nonsense, you are one bad roll and your entire list is cooked.  I think a full DW squad with either the PC or AC and CML/THSS is perfect support to a GW army and some devastators or vindicators/predators.

 

Whatever you do, resist the urge to buy/field the flyers or the landspeeder vengeance.  The Darkshroud (or two) is a perfect unit to run in a ravenwing army.  The biggest downside of the RW centric armies is the cost.  You're talking $100+ USD for just 1 full squad (~300 points) of RW.

 

Company master or librarian on a bike are great options for you with what you currently have.

[Primacy]

I think I'm going to take some of the advice I've seen here. I'll post my army list in the thread later. 

 

Side note, does anyone have a recommendation for brushes? I just killed the Citadel ones that came with my paints and I'm looking for something else. Any of y'all have personal preferences over the Citadel line? 

[march10k]

 Any of y'all have personal preferences over the Citadel line? 

Yeah, "anything but." They cost twice as much and are half as good as the moderately decent brushes I get from Michaels.  The brand varies, but I look for the bristles to be made from Golden Taklon.  I do have one really nice Tamiya (brand) kolinsky sable  000 pointer that I paid $12 for, but I got it in Tokyo. 

[Primacy]

Yeah, "anything but." They cost twice as much and are half as good as the moderately decent brushes I get from Michaels.  The brand varies, but I look for the bristles to be made from Golden Taklon.  I do have one really nice Tamiya (brand) kolinsky sable  000 pointer that I paid $12 for, but I got it in Tokyo. 

 

I had a feeling it would be like that somehow. :D But I'll take a look.

 

He's the army list I've got http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/281118-new-da-multi-wing-army/