hallodx Posted October 14, 2013 Share Posted October 14, 2013 Hi, all. A Tau player in my place just finished his 5 Riptide Tau army and trying to find a match. And, of course, no one played with him that day. And here I want to launch a thread how to cope with such list. We can choose our match when casual, but not when tourney! All Chapter and army solution allowed here, but C:SM would be much welcomed. I don't want to say "Oh, 5 Riptides! lol! Here take my VP and get out of my sight" after all. Here's some thought came up to me... Sammael in Vanguard Veteran... Charge at second turn (or first if go second) at a random fire warriors or Kroot squad, hit and run, and hopefully reach one of the Riptide. (17'~42' distance should be enough) BA VV, super expensive solution. LotD, opponent needs enough of dice instead of few high S attacks to kill them, and they ignore cover. While fire warriors and Kroots can be taken cared of by the others, LotD can concentrate on Riptides. Must choose location carefully. Plasma Sternguard drop. But since riptides can be in reserve it may not work. So what's your idea? Cheers. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/281863-how-to-cope-with-5-riptide-tau/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axagoras Posted October 14, 2013 Share Posted October 14, 2013 Well my answer is just dont play them. But since you are asking about hypotheticals here (you dont really win vs 5 riptides, you just do a little better each time you play them) I would not recommend using SG or any pod unit to take them out. If they get the 3++ up there is very little chance to down one even with 10 combi plasmas, so my advice would be to ignore them and go for the rest of the army because its over 1k points for the 5 riptides. Kill his troops and gang up on riptides who dont nova for a 3++ or fail it and start taking wounds. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/281863-how-to-cope-with-5-riptide-tau/#findComment-3494297 Share on other sites More sharing options...
hallodx Posted October 14, 2013 Author Share Posted October 14, 2013 Sounds good. 3 fire warrior squads shouldn't be tough targets for space marines, especially I play bikes and lot's of people has drop pad Sternguards. And if there were pathfinders that means he has lesser options to protect his troops. Somehow I'm feeling better now! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/281863-how-to-cope-with-5-riptide-tau/#findComment-3494319 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axagoras Posted October 14, 2013 Share Posted October 14, 2013 although the riptides will be firing at you all game so you gotta remember that. but if you only target them when they dont have a 3++ or no fnp then you can deal with a few, just dont waste turns of shooting on them for no gain. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/281863-how-to-cope-with-5-riptide-tau/#findComment-3494322 Share on other sites More sharing options...
hallodx Posted October 14, 2013 Author Share Posted October 14, 2013 Yep, I should keep that in mind. Still don't play then though lol Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/281863-how-to-cope-with-5-riptide-tau/#findComment-3494334 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axagoras Posted October 14, 2013 Share Posted October 14, 2013 Smart man, with a 2+ 3++ and fnp they are a tough nut to crack, but if they fail the nova they "usually" take a wound and are in just a 5+ and thats when you can punish them. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/281863-how-to-cope-with-5-riptide-tau/#findComment-3494336 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted October 14, 2013 Share Posted October 14, 2013 Yep, wipe out what you need to win, and huddle down tell they expose a weakness, then hammer that as hard as you can. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/281863-how-to-cope-with-5-riptide-tau/#findComment-3494338 Share on other sites More sharing options...
KhorneHunter57x Posted October 14, 2013 Share Posted October 14, 2013 Play to the mission. 5/6 of the normal BRB missions involve objectives, and those require Troops (and/or Fast Attack/Heavy Support, and the Riptides are neither). Kill his Troops, take your objective(s), and the mission is yours.Since you play Bikes, I would strongly suggest the White Scars traits in this case - the +1 to Jink is excellent for this, and the immunity to Dangerous Terrain is also nice. Markerlights only have a 3 foot range, so you should be able to stay away with your bikes and keep your Jink save (and thereby keep your bikes alive). If they move to pursue, either outrun/outmanever the markerlight platforms or kill them. Markerlights can't be everywhere at once - kill the ones that can hurt you, and ignore the ones that are too far away. A Scout move with Khan can help with this. Keep your bikers spread out so blast templates don't do much harm (maybe 1-2 hits, and then you get your cover), and stay away from markerlights. Keep your bikers turbo-boosting for that great cover save so long as they're away from markerlights.Consider some Legion of the Damned - they're beautiful minis, and their rules are pretty good. Use the Legionnaires to hammer the enemy Troop choices and Markerlight platforms (Troops to give you the mission advantage, Markerlights to protect the cover saves of your bikes) - they will slaughter Pathfinders and Kroot, and do a number on Fire Warriors. Your opponent will need weight of fire to deal with them, and if his Troops are gone, well...he probably won't have that. If your opponent focuses on them, then he isn't killing your Bikes, and if he ignores them, then they can take potshots at Riptides (after his Troops in the area are dead) while contesting his objective and/or giving you Linebreaker. For more thoughts on them, I'd read this post by Seahawk: http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/280291-the-legion-of-the-damned-20/Riptides (and some other Tau stuff) can get Interceptor pretty easily, so I wouldn't bother trying to Deep Strike in stuff in an attempt to kill one - at best, you've killed one, and then the other four kill whatever you used. At worst, your stuff dies before it can do anything. Ignore the Riptides, and play to the mission.Consider reserving the stuff the Riptides will kill easily, and keep your bikes moving and away from markerlights. Again, play to the mission - kill his scoring units, keep yours alive, pick up other victory points where you can (but don't force it!), and don't worry too much about the Riptides so long as you have a good cover/invul save - they're just there to distract you from playing to the mission.EDIT: This, of course, is assuming that he takes the Ion Accelerators on his Riptides. If they all have the burst cannon, then laugh, ignore the 'Tides, bike it up, and play to the mission. And then have a discussion after the game about the merits of the Ion Accelerator (unless he has a thing for giant Gatling guns, which I totally understand). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/281863-how-to-cope-with-5-riptide-tau/#findComment-3494343 Share on other sites More sharing options...
hallodx Posted October 14, 2013 Author Share Posted October 14, 2013 Yeah I do play WS! Cheers! And LotD never disappoint me since this book They done what I want them AT LEAST(means often more!) I think maybe I should take care of pathfinders first. Ignoring cover is a big pain, to all SM. Since interceptors everywhere in Tau, any ideas how to take care of them with minimum cost? LotD's job again? That can't meet the cost, but that's a solution, any idea? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/281863-how-to-cope-with-5-riptide-tau/#findComment-3494351 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axagoras Posted October 14, 2013 Share Posted October 14, 2013 Lotd will deck pathfinders, hitting on 3s, wounding on 3s and no save. But thats turn 2 at best, a whirlwind can shell with with a s 4 ap 5 ignores cover blast for 65 points Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/281863-how-to-cope-with-5-riptide-tau/#findComment-3494360 Share on other sites More sharing options...
hallodx Posted October 14, 2013 Author Share Posted October 14, 2013 Oh, yep, I forget whirlwind all the time lol. But how if they hide under roof? Thunderfire cannon looks good. WS don't like it but who cares in tourney. Edit: Shame on me. Thunder fire cannon got barrage now so they can't strike lower level target either... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/281863-how-to-cope-with-5-riptide-tau/#findComment-3494380 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tangamarine Posted October 14, 2013 Share Posted October 14, 2013 How about scouts with a landspeeder storm, give the squad a combi gravgun, and use to to concuss one down, and fire the cerebus launcher at them, hopefully bring at least one of them down to bs 1 for a turn Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/281863-how-to-cope-with-5-riptide-tau/#findComment-3494383 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaedes Nex Posted October 14, 2013 Share Posted October 14, 2013 The easiest way to ensure at least a 50% win rate against Riptide spam is to have sufficient line of sight blocking terrain on the table. That way you have the chance to outplay him with your maneuvers hinging around that LoS blocker. If the Tau player can see all of your units on the entire table on turn one (even if they are in cover) and he knows what he's doing and is running a tuned list, it's going to be tough to get any sort of even matchup with even points, even if you bring good allies. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/281863-how-to-cope-with-5-riptide-tau/#findComment-3494394 Share on other sites More sharing options...
hallodx Posted October 14, 2013 Author Share Posted October 14, 2013 How about scouts with a landspeeder storm, give the squad a combi gravgun, and use to to concuss one down, and fire the cerebus launcher at them, hopefully bring at least one of them down to bs 1 for a turn concuss only work on the wounded model, which will be a killed one in pathfinder. Blind blaster might work if no drone in PF, and unleash full bolter shoots on them sounds not too bad. >> Ultramarini It's a pain but you're so right. I wish I could bring paper tissue boxes to a tourney as terrains lol Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/281863-how-to-cope-with-5-riptide-tau/#findComment-3494399 Share on other sites More sharing options...
KhorneHunter57x Posted October 14, 2013 Share Posted October 14, 2013 Oh, yep, I forget whirlwind all the time lol. But how if they hide under roof? Thunderfire cannon looks good. WS don't like it but who cares in tourney. Edit: Shame on me. Thunder fire cannon got barrage now so they can't strike lower level target either... Remember that Barrage is an option - you can always choose to fire such weapons directly. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/281863-how-to-cope-with-5-riptide-tau/#findComment-3494411 Share on other sites More sharing options...
hallodx Posted October 14, 2013 Author Share Posted October 14, 2013 Oh! Another shame. it's "can" not "must". So, yeah, whirlwind sounds great, and TFC fortify a ruin is great, too. I can fortify a ruin in enemy deployment zone, kill fishes with ignore cover shells and camp in, taking line breaker and obj lol Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/281863-how-to-cope-with-5-riptide-tau/#findComment-3494418 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted October 14, 2013 Share Posted October 14, 2013 As for 'taking out the troop', what happens if your opponent keeps them all in reserves, for as long as possible. And starts with the 5 Riptide on board to destroy your army with? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/281863-how-to-cope-with-5-riptide-tau/#findComment-3494444 Share on other sites More sharing options...
hallodx Posted October 14, 2013 Author Share Posted October 14, 2013 Indeed. That's why I later focus on how to take out pathfinder: they can't really be kept in reserve for their serving purpose. But well, if no other unit on board I'm sure my army can keep riptides busy throwing saves and combat, but that's just mine. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/281863-how-to-cope-with-5-riptide-tau/#findComment-3494465 Share on other sites More sharing options...
goosey_j Posted October 14, 2013 Share Posted October 14, 2013 Use your reserves to kill off his reserves - i.e. keep something nasty and and anti infantry orientated to kill off his inevitable FW or Kroot squads. Legion of the Damned do a fantastic job here. As for the suits themselves, the only thing that will be able to kill them are grav bikers, or drop podding Sternguard with combi grav. Both units have their risks, but with some good playing will survive long enough for you to take some out. White Scars bikers with double grav and combi grav are a good bet, as are the command squad with, you guessed it, 4 grav guns. A 5 man podding Sternguard squad with 5 combi gravs in support of the bikers will work really well as well. Remember, if he intercepts, he can't shoot in his turn. It's a double edged sword. 5 riptides will die to that much grav. Assuming support systems, each Riptide should be coming in around 250ish points, so that's 1, 250 points of army there. If you put 1, 250 points into ultra mobile grav toting units, you should have a force capable of downing his Riptides. That is, of course, assuming you tailor your army to beat his. Using a balanced force, your best hope is to try and kill his marker light units quickly, hunker the hell down, wait for his troops to arrive, kill them, and claim the objective to win. Sadly this means in kill point missions you're going to be fighting a real up hill battle, but hey, that's 5 Riptides for you. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/281863-how-to-cope-with-5-riptide-tau/#findComment-3494522 Share on other sites More sharing options...
hallodx Posted October 14, 2013 Author Share Posted October 14, 2013 1250 would be over 6 squads of bikes and tones of grav gun! People would hate me more if I do so lol. I'll cut some edge for two or more LotD and relay, ADL for whirlwind and maybe thunder fire cannon and stalker to keep the list balance, so CSM won't cook my army. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/281863-how-to-cope-with-5-riptide-tau/#findComment-3494542 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted October 14, 2013 Share Posted October 14, 2013 Use your reserves to kill off his reserves - i.e. keep something nasty and and anti infantry orientated to kill off his inevitable FW or Kroot squads. Legion of the Damned do a fantastic job here And if you don't have anything that DS/Outflanks in reserves? Don't the LotD (still quite expensive themselves) get killed to Interceptor Fire form the Riptides when they DS in? Also, the problem with keeping your own stuff in reserves is you have less targets for the Riptides to kill off, making it easier for you to be tabled before your reserves come in. And this is why dual FoC / allowing a codex to ally to itself is such a stupidly bad idea... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/281863-how-to-cope-with-5-riptide-tau/#findComment-3494569 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted October 14, 2013 Share Posted October 14, 2013 I don't see any real way to win. Even a grav spam will fail as Grav weapons are short range. He'll kill everything before you get in range. If you deepstrike he can counter with Interceptor.. Don't see how you can survive 5 str 9 ap2 large templates each turn from across the board... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/281863-how-to-cope-with-5-riptide-tau/#findComment-3494684 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excubitor Posted October 14, 2013 Share Posted October 14, 2013 I'd use a hammer myself... Seriously, I'd definitely say bring Khan. Scout + bikes means that you'll have units up close enough to shoot in the first phase, and if you concentrate right you might be able to kill 1-2 before they can fire. Especially if you bring a second HQ with another 5 grav gun bike command squad... Plus, if he survives for the second turn, assaulting him in means he just might ID one! (he needs 6 to wound anyway...) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/281863-how-to-cope-with-5-riptide-tau/#findComment-3494699 Share on other sites More sharing options...
hallodx Posted October 14, 2013 Author Share Posted October 14, 2013 Khan is a must take I'm sure. And don't forget bikes can formate a long train so large template can only cover max 3 models I believe. But don't expect ID, for his sword is AP3... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/281863-how-to-cope-with-5-riptide-tau/#findComment-3494717 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted October 14, 2013 Share Posted October 14, 2013 My ideas; take a Land Raider. You'll get into assault range with at least that unit. Bikers can back up a Land Raider too. Legion of the Damned will laugh at AP2 templates though admittedly the Tau player might hit them with all their templates and torrent them to death, which just means the rest of the army is going to get away from a turn of shooting. Win win. But I do agree it's going to be a very unlikely win. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/281863-how-to-cope-with-5-riptide-tau/#findComment-3494766 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.