Dominate and walker CC attacks

[bystrom]

I have two questions that have come up in our games that I would like clarification.

 

Dominate and FMC (Rules Question)

The first regards the psychic power Dominate (Telepathy) and flying monstrous creatures. A FMC can choose each turn whether to be swooping of gliding. If it is swooping, it has to move 12"-24" (pg 49). What happens if you dominate a FMC, it decides to swoop, and then fails its Ld test and so misses its movement phase? I know the rules for flyers specifically note that a flyer is destroyed if it cannot move at least 18", but there is no such wording here.

 

Walker and Specialist Weapons (Clarification)

A defiler can have up to three power fists and one power scourge. The power fists are specialist weapons, while the power scourge isn't. We haven't found anything hindering a defiler with a power scourge from using the power fists in CC, and still getting the effect of power scourge (which seems to be supported by the FAQ), the question is rather how many attacks the defiler gets.

 

I have yet to find anything that lets a walker override the specialist weapon rule. Therefore, a defiler with 3 power fists and one power scourge would always use the power fists, and would get, 3+2 attacks, and not 3+3, when not charging. Is this correct?

[shortysl]

Pretty sure Defilers, like Dreadnoughts, get Dreadnought Close Combat Weapons. They are not Power Fists, therefore they are not Specialist Weapons.

 

Never mind. Just read it. Stupid Defilers.

 

Models with multiple weapons usually have to declare which one they're using at the beginning of Combat. If you used the Scourge, you'd get 4 Attacks on the charge. If you used the 3 Fists you'd get 6 (+1 for charging and +2 for the 3 Specialist Weapons).

[Dam13n]

"At the start of it's move a Flying Monstrous Creature must declare whether it is Swooping or Gliding until the start of it's next turn."

"It must move at least 12" and can move up to 24"." (Swooping)

BRB page 49

 

"... , the target unit must pass a Leadership test each time it attempts to move, ..."

"... - if the test is failed, the action is forfeit and the unit can do nothing that phase."

Dominate, BRB page 147

 

What this means is that if the Flying Monster is Dominated and fails it's Ld test, it cannot move at all.  It therefore cannot move the minimum 12", so cannot declare itself as Swooping.  It is therefore effectively grounded for that turn.

 

The Defiler with Scourge question has been asked and answered more than once, Searchy is your friend.

 

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/278232-defiler-attacks/

[bystrom]

Knew I missed a defiler thread. Thanks for that. As for FMC, I was pretty certain the wording was at the start of turn, but it is at the start of a move.

Though I would argue the reason the FMC cannot swoop is because the Dominate Ld test comes first. If the Ld test is failed, the move is forfeit, and so the FMC cannot choose to glide or swoop. There simply is no start of move, not including the fact that choosing glide or swoop is doing something that phase (which you also cannot do). Of course, the nice thing would be to let the FMC glide at least, so that it can charge as jump infantry (assuming it passes its Ld test).

[Disruptor_fe404]

There's an issue tingling in the back of my mind regarding Flying Monstrous Creatures (and Flyers) not being able to be hit by things that automatically hit.

 

Now, my gut tells me that what I'm remembering is more related to shooting attacks and shooting psychic powers, rather than maledictions.

 

Am I remembering wrong? Can you actually hit a swooping FMC with a malediction?

 

All that being said, not being able to swoop at all on a failed Dominate Leadership check seems to have been covered completely by Dam13n.

[infornography]

maledictions can affect flyers just fine.  Psychic shooting attacks that do not roll to hit cannot however.

 

And I agree with Dam13n.  There is room to argue about the rules, but the only reasonable response to the apparent contradiction is to force the FMC to glide instead of swoop.