Kay Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 I have been trying lately what I like to call the "boarding command squad" it is pricey (to some armies more than others) but, as dangerous as it is, peoe is terrified about it and it draws a lot of attention: Command squad, 5x storm shields 4x grav guns 1x thunder hammer Drop pod 275 points. You can ditch the thunder hammer of course. Drop on turn 1, survive the interceptor, blow up some elite unit. You can charge and tank a dedicated cc unit of theirs to keep them from killing your men, it'll is anathema to riptides and such... I have used it a couple if times now and it has worked ok., but it might have been just luck... What do you guys think about it?? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282247-boarding-command-squad-thoughts/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lysere Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 I would personally leave the hammer out of it unless I was putting the captain in their with them with the shield eternal and a hammer. I just feel one wound models in a small 5 man team aren't the best place for a weapon that expensive. Definitely seems fun though. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282247-boarding-command-squad-thoughts/#findComment-3502234 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerekLee688 Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 I don't want an I:5 character's only CC weapon to be a Thunder hammer. Does the hammer count as a 2nd weapon for power swords? Also, is there a better place to put a hammer where it can't be singled out in challenges? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282247-boarding-command-squad-thoughts/#findComment-3502355 Share on other sites More sharing options...
minigun762 Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 I was actually looking at something very similar but using melta guns, an Apothecary and the Champion supported by a Captain. 3x BS4 and 1x BS5 shots should kill most targets and 3++ with FnP is durable. After that, I assault or shoot whatever I can. Haven't tried it but I see potential on paper Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282247-boarding-command-squad-thoughts/#findComment-3502363 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lysere Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 I don't want an I:5 character's only CC weapon to be a Thunder hammer. Does the hammer count as a 2nd weapon for power swords? Also, is there a better place to put a hammer where it can't be singled out in challenges? If you have the shield eternal the hammer is a wonderful weapon, also it's easy enough to end up in a fight where your going second anyway, if your going to last with someone tough you at least want to go with a hammer. Also no swords are not matched with hammers as the hammer is a specialist weapon. If the guy was I6 then I'd say the hammer might be a waste, but he isn't so the hammer can be quite solid when matched with the shield eternal. Otherwise you could take a relic blade, but the hammer is useless on a single wound model that isn't even WS 5 or in terminator armor. Unless your just having fun because I've made a scout sergeant with a thunder hammer just because I could. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282247-boarding-command-squad-thoughts/#findComment-3502370 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Storm Dragons 3rd Company Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 It seems to me that this squad would be very fragile. The 3++ is great if I were to shoot at it with AP3 weapons, but if you put normal marines on the table with 3++, I'm going to be trying to drop them with concentrated bolter fire. If you put those five marines in the heart of my army, I should be able to do for them in my next round of shooting. Your only protection would be to assault, but you have salvo weapons there and I don't think you can shoot them and then assault. Thus, I think Minigun is right - you both shoudl look at meltaguns (an assault weapon) and you need an apothecary for durability (and you need him as far away from that incoming fire as you can get him). Otherwise, one hammer is nice, but if you are planning to assault, I would think you'd want more. So as far as that goes, I'd either go large or leave it back on the ship. (Probably the latter since you can't assault after you pod in, and I don't see this unit living through until the next turn often.) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282247-boarding-command-squad-thoughts/#findComment-3502454 Share on other sites More sharing options...
minigun762 Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 It's part of the reason I'd attach an HQ to the unit, especially if he has a 2+ save, to help tank incoming wounds Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282247-boarding-command-squad-thoughts/#findComment-3502501 Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdemayo Posted October 22, 2013 Share Posted October 22, 2013 I assume you want a squad that looks like it is about to board a hostile ship? Maybe one using the Forgeworld models? The 3++ shield is great for a boarding unit, and would look awesome. I'd take some other weapon over the grav guns, since you'd probably want to keep the squad moving. Salvo isn't so hot. Me, I like plasma -- kills everything and has lots of shots whether you move or not. But melta might work better as a theme for bording an enemy ship. Or maybe not. ("Then Brother Ralph missed and hit the wall with his meltagun, and the decompression sucked us out into space.") Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282247-boarding-command-squad-thoughts/#findComment-3502744 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trevak Dal Posted October 22, 2013 Share Posted October 22, 2013 I assume you want a squad that looks like it is about to board a hostile ship? Maybe one using the Forgeworld models? The 3++ shield is great for a boarding unit, and would look awesome. I'd take some other weapon over the grav guns, since you'd probably want to keep the squad moving. Salvo isn't so hot. Me, I like plasma -- kills everything and has lots of shots whether you move or not. But melta might work better as a theme for bording an enemy ship. Or maybe not. ("Then Brother Ralph missed and hit the wall with his meltagun, and the decompression sucked us out into space.") Space Marines got Far Future Reebok Pumps that stick to the floor/ceiling/etc in case of such a thing. They are Space Marines, and are trained to fight in Space. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282247-boarding-command-squad-thoughts/#findComment-3503428 Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdemayo Posted October 22, 2013 Share Posted October 22, 2013 a) It was a joke. B ) Explosive decompression is never fun. I bet you shouldn't fire your armor-piercing weapon in a space ship, magnetic boots or no magnetic boots. All it takes is one peice of shrapnel in the helmet, and even Space Marines can't breathe. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282247-boarding-command-squad-thoughts/#findComment-3503449 Share on other sites More sharing options...
minigun762 Posted October 22, 2013 Share Posted October 22, 2013 Back on topic, would the 3++ provide enough protection without a 2+ armor save backing it up? I'd say no, unless you're also bringing the Apothecary. 3++ with FnP is durable enough, and you can always take AP3 hits on your 2+ Captain.. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282247-boarding-command-squad-thoughts/#findComment-3503579 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Storm Dragons 3rd Company Posted October 22, 2013 Share Posted October 22, 2013 You can try to take hits on the captain or not on the captain as you like. The enemy frequently does have something to say about that, esp on their shooting turn. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282247-boarding-command-squad-thoughts/#findComment-3503594 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Office temp Posted October 22, 2013 Share Posted October 22, 2013 a) It was a joke. B ) Explosive decompression is never fun. I bet you shouldn't fire your armor-piercing weapon in a space ship, magnetic boots or no magnetic boots. All it takes is one peice of shrapnel in the helmet, and even Space Marines can't breathe. Naw, I'd still use my armor piercing slugs against the enemy, I'll just politely ask them to refrain from using armor piercing ammo against me Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282247-boarding-command-squad-thoughts/#findComment-3503818 Share on other sites More sharing options...
minigun762 Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 What about flamers? Would 4-5 flamers be overkill? Would naturally be best with Salamanders but still functional with anyone else. That would also be a nasty overwatch. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282247-boarding-command-squad-thoughts/#findComment-3504424 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lysere Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 I was thinking of getting something set up for a zone mortallis game and I was thinking of this whole boarding squad idea. (Not sure the exact rules for the boarding shields but the idea of just using them for storm shields seems fun) The idea involves most of your original idea. One marine gets a thunder hammer, 2-3 will have the shields with either a flamer or combi-flamer, and then the last guy or two in the command squad will pretty much take whatever. Either more combi's or flamers, maybe an apothecary, or even a close combat weapon. The idea being that the guy with the thunder hammer would effectively be the breacher when the squad hits any doors. The others would use the flamers and bolters to sweep and clear the room. Not sure how effective it would be in a normal game of 40k. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282247-boarding-command-squad-thoughts/#findComment-3504459 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerekLee688 Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 I don't want an I:5 character's only CC weapon to be a Thunder hammer. Does the hammer count as a 2nd weapon for power swords? Also, is there a better place to put a hammer where it can't be singled out in challenges? If you have the shield eternal the hammer is a wonderful weapon, also it's easy enough to end up in a fight where your going second anyway, if your going to last with someone tough you at least want to go with a hammer. Also no swords are not matched with hammers as the hammer is a specialist weapon. If the guy was I6 then I'd say the hammer might be a waste, but he isn't so the hammer can be quite solid when matched with the shield eternal. Otherwise you could take a relic blade, but the hammer is useless on a single wound model that isn't even WS 5 or in terminator armor. Unless your just having fun because I've made a scout sergeant with a thunder hammer just because I could. I was wondering if you could use the hammer to add +1 to the sword. I know it takes a specalist weapon to give the hammer +1, but a ccw, pistol, or PW will work for the sword, so can a specalist weapon be used as a 2nd CCW for the Sword and not the other way around? I'm thinking of the "captains are meh" topic and think a master should have the shield eternal and hammer, while a captain should be kept "cheap". I'm thinking of AA, TH, and power sword if paired with a command squad. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282247-boarding-command-squad-thoughts/#findComment-3504624 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthanor Posted October 23, 2013 Share Posted October 23, 2013 Both weapons need to be of the same category, oddly enough. A specialist weapon cannot give or receive a bonus attack to/from a normal weapon. That being said, take a lightning claw instead of the power sword, gain shred and.. specialist weapon! For the same price! The power fist & lightning claw combo can work very well, at the cost of some protection. It is cheaper than 2x power fist and you gain the extra option of ap3 shred at initiative, all while still keeping the extra attack. Calgar should grow some claws on one of his gauntlets! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282247-boarding-command-squad-thoughts/#findComment-3504636 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerekLee688 Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 All that sounds good. I'm going to have to bitz shop for a cool "thunder hammer" and "lightning claw" for a rule of cool figure. Is it still possible for a command squad vet to take a meltagun and flamer? Which is my other rule of cool model I want to build. However, it might be nice to have a squad with 4x PG and one guy with MG/Flamer instead of an apothicary if the pod is going into the opponent's backfield. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282247-boarding-command-squad-thoughts/#findComment-3508854 Share on other sites More sharing options...
minigun762 Posted November 1, 2013 Share Posted November 1, 2013 Let us know how it works for you. I'm hoping it lives up to the hype! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282247-boarding-command-squad-thoughts/#findComment-3510111 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElectricPaladin Posted November 1, 2013 Share Posted November 1, 2013 I don't want an I:5 character's only CC weapon to be a Thunder hammer. Does the hammer count as a 2nd weapon for power swords? Also, is there a better place to put a hammer where it can't be singled out in challenges? No, but it would count as the 2nd weapon for a lightning claw - or anything else with the Specialist Weapon rule, actually. Including, say, the Teeth of Terra. My Sons of Medusa chapter master has a power fist in one hand and the Teeth of Terra in the other. My Knights of Blood captain has a power fist in one hand and a lightning claw in the other. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282247-boarding-command-squad-thoughts/#findComment-3510130 Share on other sites More sharing options...
minigun762 Posted November 1, 2013 Share Posted November 1, 2013 I don't want an I:5 character's only CC weapon to be a Thunder hammer. Does the hammer count as a 2nd weapon for power swords? Also, is there a better place to put a hammer where it can't be singled out in challenges? No, but it would count as the 2nd weapon for a lightning claw - or anything else with the Specialist Weapon rule, actually. Including, say, the Teeth of Terra. My Sons of Medusa chapter master has a power fist in one hand and the Teeth of Terra in the other. My Knights of Blood captain has a power fist in one hand and a lightning claw in the other. Are you finding the flexibility pays off more than taking a storm shield? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282247-boarding-command-squad-thoughts/#findComment-3510133 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElectricPaladin Posted November 1, 2013 Share Posted November 1, 2013 I don't want an I:5 character's only CC weapon to be a Thunder hammer. Does the hammer count as a 2nd weapon for power swords? Also, is there a better place to put a hammer where it can't be singled out in challenges? No, but it would count as the 2nd weapon for a lightning claw - or anything else with the Specialist Weapon rule, actually. Including, say, the Teeth of Terra. My Sons of Medusa chapter master has a power fist in one hand and the Teeth of Terra in the other. My Knights of Blood captain has a power fist in one hand and a lightning claw in the other. Are you finding the flexibility pays off more than taking a storm shield? I haven't had a chance to play with it much, but I think it will. I wouldn't do it with a character who lacks a native invulnerable save, but is a 3++ that much better than a 4++? And is it better enough to justify losing a potential attack and having to chose between power and speed? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282247-boarding-command-squad-thoughts/#findComment-3510136 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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