Augustus Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 Lotarra is the human Captain/Admiral on the Conqueror? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282842-vengeful-spirit/page/2/#findComment-3514331 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostMalone Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 Nah, I can live with Healing Factor Vulkan. And I have a feeling Cyrene is a piece in a long game. To be honest, her death was kind of something I glossed over. It was tragic, but it wasn't like Loken's or Argel Tal's. Heck, the mere prospect of Lotarra dying practically had me on the edge of my seat. So her's is excusable as it really didn't cheapen anything and I got a gut feeling we will see more of her. And I think "Tormageddon who was Torgaddon" is just a way of showing that old fluff where souls became the playthings of the warp and Tarik's happened to be molded into a daemon. We didn't see much of him in Know No Fear and I don't expect to see much of him again. Cyrene was unexpected as a return and I agree she will be a big player, vulkan I can deal with as he's a primarch I just don't like repetitive deaths. Tarik now he was a good character :) Lottara is perfection and I will rage if she dies, I'd like her to ascend to deamon primarch angrons hand maiden :P I agree with you kol on loken should have stayed dead, a living martyr just doesn't have the same affect I feel Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282842-vengeful-spirit/page/2/#findComment-3514343 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Lorne Walkier Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 I agree with you kol on loken should have stayed dead, a living martyr just doesn't have the same affect I feel The thing is Loken's survival is a secret. His martyrdom is intact for those who it would matter, the people of the Imperium. We the reader know, but we don't count. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282842-vengeful-spirit/page/2/#findComment-3514363 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 I agree with you kol on loken should have stayed dead, a living martyr just doesn't have the same affect I feel The thing is Loken's survival is a secret. His martyrdom is intact for those who it would matter, the people of the Imperium. We the reader know, but we don't count. Ergo, why the death was cheapened. Half the Imperium probably doesn't enven know nor care that Loken ever existed. The dramatic moments aren't meant for the in-universe sideline civilian population who probably don't even know the protagonist exists. They're meant for us. Loken's death was meant to strike a chord with us. His revival was meant to be fanboyism made reality by giving the fanboys their heroes back. BL just didn't calculate that in the universe where all is grimdark, heroes never staying dead is supposed to be left to Dragonball Z, Marvel and DC. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282842-vengeful-spirit/page/2/#findComment-3514382 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostMalone Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 Ha! Loken goes ss4 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282842-vengeful-spirit/page/2/#findComment-3514402 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vesper Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 I agree with you kol on loken should have stayed dead, a living martyr just doesn't have the same affect I feel The thing is Loken's survival is a secret. His martyrdom is intact for those who it would matter, the people of the Imperium. We the reader know, but we don't count. The reader is a pretty major part of the storytelling, you know. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282842-vengeful-spirit/page/2/#findComment-3514414 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteelPaladin Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 Lotarra is the human Captain/Admiral on the Conqueror? Yep. The traitorous side of me wants to see her ascend to daemonhood... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282842-vengeful-spirit/page/2/#findComment-3514453 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 Cyrene's death in The First Heretic wasn't as tragic as Argel Tal's? The survivor of Monarchia, saved by the XVII, who has been with them as they lost their faith and found it again, a symbol that they do what they do for mankind but not it's Master, one of the last shreds of good in the whole Legion, is stuffed out by the Emperor's Own, and that's NOT TRAGIC? Meanwhile, Gavriel Loken being so awesome that not even Abaddon and Khârn can overcome his special snowflakeness, and he had to have a Titan drop a building on him or he would have no doubt smote Horus's horde entire with fire from his eyes and lightning from his arse, THAT is tragic. Ohhhhhhkay then. (And no mention of Cyrene's death is complete without a moment of silence in remembrance of brave, brave Incarnadine. Forever may its name be inscribed within the Archive of Visionary Merit) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282842-vengeful-spirit/page/2/#findComment-3514472 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Entei Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 I'm guessing that Lotara's death will be what makes Khârn lose the last of his remaining sanity... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282842-vengeful-spirit/page/2/#findComment-3514480 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostMalone Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 Cuteness death was a spiritual tragedy and I agree it was more meaningful then lokens. I actually felt more though for the remember emcees in a thousand sons though. Lotaras death with argel tals and angrons ascension may cause Khârn to finally succumb Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282842-vengeful-spirit/page/2/#findComment-3514493 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 Given that Khârn well and truly loses it for good after his death and "rebirth" on Terra, I'll predict she falls at the Siege. We know the World Eaters don't have Conqueror by M41. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282842-vengeful-spirit/page/2/#findComment-3514498 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 Given that Khârn well and truly loses it for good after his death and "rebirth" on Terra, I'll predict she falls at the Siege. We know the World Eaters don't have Conqueror by M41. I thought it was "We know we haven't seen the Conqueror in M41". Then again, we haven't seen Mortarion in M41....... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282842-vengeful-spirit/page/2/#findComment-3514501 Share on other sites More sharing options...
helterskelter Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 I thought mortarion just lived on barbarus the 2nd like and put a sign at the door saying do not disturb. As far as I know the last we see of fulgrim is when he slits roboutes throat? Perturabo doesnt show face either. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282842-vengeful-spirit/page/2/#findComment-3514509 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olis Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 Then again, we haven't seen Mortarion in M41....... Draigo has. :lol: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282842-vengeful-spirit/page/2/#findComment-3514512 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 Then again, we haven't seen Mortarion in M41....... Draigo has. He lives in the Eye of Terror. He doesn't count. For all we know, he saw a Nurgling and thought it was Mortarion. Ha! Take that snotling! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282842-vengeful-spirit/page/2/#findComment-3514521 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vazzy Posted November 6, 2013 Share Posted November 6, 2013 When Lotara dies, I'm going to weep like a bitch. I love reading her scenes. Right now I'm praying for ascension ala Valkia. It'd make the traitor in me very very happy. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282842-vengeful-spirit/page/2/#findComment-3514529 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted November 6, 2013 Share Posted November 6, 2013 When Lotara dies, I'm going to weep like a bitch. I love reading her scenes. Right now I'm praying for ascension ala Valkia. It'd make the traitor in me very very happy. I don't ever see her turning cookoo enough to turn Chaos. Besides, I want to see her dying putting a giant hole into the Phalanx. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282842-vengeful-spirit/page/2/#findComment-3514536 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostMalone Posted November 6, 2013 Share Posted November 6, 2013 That would be awesome, I'd like to see her stand her ground as say the blood angels do a boarding action above terra and with her last breath she laughs as she sends the conqueror into self destruct Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282842-vengeful-spirit/page/2/#findComment-3514539 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noctus Cornix Posted November 6, 2013 Share Posted November 6, 2013 Cyrene's death was a brief but tragic thing, especially when you read her data-slate message where it cuts off so suddenly and then learn that Argel Tal has read this over and over and over and over again. Sad stuff. What's more tragic is her return. Do I think it was somewhat rushed? Yes. I felt Cyrene is a very important and interesting character and her purpose in the book as an individual is just... nonexistent. Her soul was lost in the warp, torn and gnashed at by Daemons. And when she is brought back, she's basically just fine with only a small mentioning of her sleepless nights. I would have liked to see much more on this. Now Cyrene however is a much stronger piece as a catalyst for Argel Tal's downfall. He will do anything to amend his failures and knowingly goes into the welcoming grasp of that bastard Erebus. He was doomed from the start that the thought of bringing her back ever crossed his mind. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282842-vengeful-spirit/page/2/#findComment-3514631 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostMalone Posted November 6, 2013 Share Posted November 6, 2013 I agree after entering the warp I think she would be more disturbed, I felt for argel when she saw what he had truly become once her eyes were back. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282842-vengeful-spirit/page/2/#findComment-3514636 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conn Eremon Posted November 6, 2013 Share Posted November 6, 2013 Man, if I wanted to watch someone stay awake at night because they remembered what happened to them in hell, I'd watch Supernatural. It's like the set-up for every other season. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282842-vengeful-spirit/page/2/#findComment-3514644 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted November 6, 2013 Share Posted November 6, 2013 Man, if I wanted to watch someone stay awake at night because they remembered what happened to them in hell, I'd watch Supernatural. It's like the set-up for every other season. Not true! Last season was Purgatory. :P Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282842-vengeful-spirit/page/2/#findComment-3514645 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conn Eremon Posted November 6, 2013 Share Posted November 6, 2013 Hey, it's someone's hell. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282842-vengeful-spirit/page/2/#findComment-3514647 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyaenidae Posted November 6, 2013 Share Posted November 6, 2013 Loken dying was a inspiring moment, touching in it's intensity, and solidified that the brotherhood and unity of purpose of the Legions was gone forever. Him coming back was the worst damn thing ever. Period. Whoever came up with that brainfart, should be thrown out the closest airlock. Or to the Night Lords. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282842-vengeful-spirit/page/2/#findComment-3514656 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostMalone Posted November 6, 2013 Share Posted November 6, 2013 I'd like garro to die on terra against mortarion with the proto grey knights & pre inquisition Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282842-vengeful-spirit/page/2/#findComment-3514660 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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