Sons of Horus for Escalate Campain

[MiR]

Hello Guys,

 

I need help for my Sons of Horus. We Play the Escalate Campain from Book 1 and start with 500P.

 

So my Army for this will be:

 

HQ:

- Master of Signal    85P.

 

Troops:

 

- Legion Tactical Squad, Artificer Armor, Melter Bombs             165P.

- Legion Tacticak Squad                                                           150P.

 

Fast Attack:

 

- Legion Attack Bikes (2) with Multi-Melter     100P

 

My problem is, that we all have to take our Legion Rite of War (even when no Master of the Legion is present).

And we have one less Troop choice (one istead of two). I have to take 2 becouse of the Rite of Black Reaving, also no Heavy Support.

 

I testet two games against Iron Hands with an Contemptor with 2 Kheres, and Rapier LasDestroyer. He Obliteratet me in both games in Round 3.

He dont moves with his Tactical and i had only the 2 shoots MM to take his Conteptor, if i fail he kills the Bikes and then my Tacticals.

Anyone tipps for me how i can get this List to work ?

 

Thanks for help!

[Moonstalker]

That's a tough one.  Just going by what you've got, though, I would start by splitting the attack bikes into two squadrons.  This way you force him to split his fire and take down each bike individually, rather than any extra wounds spilling onto the second bike after taking out the first.

 

I would also move the artificer armor and meltabombs onto your Master of Signal.  It is the same price, but with two wounds he will make better use of the artificer armor than a single wound sergeant.

 

Just doing those things, you can keep largely the same list without many changes.  It will be slightly more optimized, but still difficult.

 

If you want to change things up, consider dropping one of your Tactical Squads for a Reaver Squad, or dropping the meltabombs and artificer armor from your list.  By freeing up those points, you can drop one attack bike and take a Rapier Laser Destroyer of your own.  Though less mobile, it will be much more effective at killing his Contemptor.  Once the Contemptor is taken care of, you probably have the numbers to wipe him out in melee with Merciless Fighters + Cut them Down.

 

Remember that Inviolate Armor only applies to models with the Legiones Astartes (Iron Hands) rule.  Don't make the mistake of thinking that it applies to everything in his army.  Contemptors do not have this rule, and so suffer the full wrath of your multimeltas!  It could also be argued that, when shooting at his Rapier, it also does not benefit from the Legiones Astartes rule.  As an artillery unit, the toughness of the gun is always used when rolling to wound, and the gun model itself does not have the Legiones Astartes special rule (though casualties are always pulled from the closest models, as normal for shooting).  How Inviolate Armor interacts with artillery is probably a bit of a grey area, though, and might need to be FAQed/clarified.

 

ETA: The point about the Rapier battery is such a weird one that I made a topic about it for further discussion.  Maybe you can find a good answer to it there.

[MiR]

Thanks,

 

Changed the list to this:

 

HQ:

- Master of Signal, Artificer Armor, Melter Bomb                      100P.

 

Troop:

 

- Legion Tactical Squad                                                            150P.

- Reaver Attack Squad, +1 Reaver (total of 6)                          150P.

 

Fast Attack:

 

- Legion Attack Bike, with Multi Melter                                         50P.

- Legion Attack Bike, with MM                                                      50P.

 

 

The Master of Signal joins the Tactical Squad.

Maybe i should let the Reaver Flank? Can come in the enemys Deployment Zone and will gain Fleet, also reserve rolls of "1" can be rerolled so they will come early (or i hope so).

Dont know what the others play in the first part, but i dont think it will be harder to face than the Iron Hands List. The Contemptor is what me makes suffer. To much Firepower and really tough.

[Moonstalker]

I had imagined something more like either of the following lists.  I meant you should possibly drop one Tac squad for Reavers so as to afford a Rapier Battery with Laser Destroyer, not that dropping a Tac squad for Reavers was a good choice in and of itself.

 

Centurion

Master of Signal, Artificer Armor, Meltabombs

100

 

Legion Rapier Weapons Battery

One Battery, Laser Destroyer Array

65

 

Legion Tactical Squad

Ten Members

150

 

Reaver Attack Squad

Five Members

135

 

Legion Attack Bike Squadron

One Bike, Multimelta

50

 

Or, alternatively:

 

 

Centurion

Master of Signal

85

 

Legion Rapier Weapons Battery

One Battery, Laser Destroyer Array

65

 

Legion Tactical Squad

Ten Members

150

 

Legion Tactical Squad

Ten Members

150

 

Legion Attack Bike Squadron

One Bike, Multimelta

50

 

There isn't much point in dropping the tactical squad for the Reavers, aside from fluff.  You gain more attacks per model in close combat, at the expense of the number of models (and therefore wounds) you can put on the table.  And while a squad of 6 Reavers has 19 attacks base and 25 on the charge, a squad of 10 Tactical Marines has 10 attacks base, 20 on the charge - and more bodies for outnumbering and getting Merciless Fighters attacks.  Not to mention you also have bolters and bolt pistols, where the Reavers only have Bolt Pistol/CCW.  If you swapped the Bolters for CCW in the Tactical Squad, they bring 20 attacks base and 30 on the charge.  I suggest the Reavers only because they are the cheapest second troops choice you can bring, not because they are worth replacing one of your tactical squads on their own.

 

As things stand, if you bring two tac squads and your Master of Signal, you have only 115 points to find the anti-tank that you need for dealing with any Contemptors, Sicarans, etc that you might see at this points level.  Your options basically boil down to Rapiers, Attack Bikes, Meltabombs, WW Scorpius, and Tarantulas.  You can't take the WW Scorpius because it is heavy support, and your RoW requires you have more FA than HS.  Tarantulas make good anti-air with Hyperios launchers, but are usually beaten by Rapiers for anti-tank.  A single Javelin is even more fragile than the two Attack Bikes you are currently fielding.

 

 

So, my recommendation is the second list above (with the naked MoS, two tac squads, rapier battery with lasdestroyer, and one attack bike with multimelta).  Attach the Master of Signal to the Rapier Battery, park him in front of the battery itself, along with one of the crewmen.  Keep one of the crewmen safely behind the gun itself.  Any shooting at the battery is rolling against the gun's toughness for the to-wound, and then has to chew through 3 wounds to actually affect the gun itself (since you have one crewman and your MoS between the gun and the enemy).  If you get hit by something that will double-tough/instant death the MoS, use Look Out, Sir! to re-allocate it to the other crewman in front of the gun.  Otherwise, tank some wounds with the Master of Signal to keep the gun in the fight so you've got multiple turns of shooting with it.  It may be wiser to keep the sacrificial crewman in front of the MoS, instead.  Move forward with both tactical squads and the attack bike at the same time to apply pressure on your opponent.

 

By standing still, and not being tempted to use any meltabombs in melee, the MoS is free to use his Bombardment at the best opportunity while letting your tactical squads maneuver.  This may be firing it first turn at the Contemptor alongside the Rapier Battery's Lasdestroyer (they both have to shoot at the same target).  Remember two very important things about the Bombardment:

 

As Ordnance, you roll 2d6 and take the highest die when rolling to pen

As Barrage, it always strikes the side armor of vehicles.

 

So you only need to roll a 4 to glance, 5 to pen on his Contemptor with the Bombardment, assuming you hit.  The other option would be to fire it at his troops or Rapier battery, but I think that is a waste.  You have the numbers, with your two tac squads, to overwhelm both of them in melee - just not the Contemptor.  Remember that Inviolate Armor also only works vs shooting attacks, so you're better off getting stuck in melee against his tac squad than trying to kill him with bolters.

 

 

Alternately, you can try to use meltabombs to solve your problems.

 

Centurion

Master of Signal, Meltabomb

90

 

Tactical Squad

Ten Members, Sergeant with Meltabomb

155

 

Reaver Squad

Five Members, Jump Packs, Chieftain with Meltagun, Meltabomb

205

 

Legion Attack Bike Squadron

One Bike, Multimelta

50

 

Just run the Reavers and Attack Bike headlong into the Contemptor, shoot the meltagun and multimelta, and charge.  Then stuff a meltabomb in its face.  Don't charge it with the attack bike, that would be silly.  You could send the attack bike to go and charge the rapier or something.  You could also drop the attack bike for more Reavers.  Maybe two Reavers and a powerfist (don't put the powerfist on the Chieftain, he is already busy using the meltabomb).

[MiR]

Thx for the advice. Much to think about.

 

In general, will perform reavers in larger games better when thy try to outflank?

And are they better with or without jumppack?

 

Reaver with Jumppack feel more like Blood Angels, without like Black Templar.

Jump Reaver have no FnP, Prime Medic is to expensive for that and cant have enough of them.

Also think Reaver Armys in general have trouble to provide Heavy Fire Support for mass Infantry.

[Moonstalker]

I suppose you could say that they seem like Blood Angels, but the Reavers are a pretty iconic SoH unit, and they are normally a fast attack choice.  Jump packs would be perfectly normal on them.  Only a few of the Legions seemed very shy about using jump packs.  I recommended the Jump Packs just because they need the mobility to get into melee with the Contemptor as fast as possible.  The double Kheres loadout is pretty strong, but once you get into melee with a ranged Contemptor, it's basically helpless.  It has only two strength 7 attacks that do not pierce armor, and its invul save is reduced to 6+ in melee.  It will be lucky to kill one of your marines every other fight subphase, while you only need one good meltabomb hit to really screw it up (50% chance of an explosion, 16.666% chance of a weapon destroyed, 16..666% chance of an immobilized, and 16.666% chance of a crew stunned once you pen.  And penning should be pretty easy).

 

In this role, I think they are better with the jump pack.  Outflanking in larger games, I don't know.  I personally don't put a lot of trust in outflank, because it's combining the risk of not getting your reserves when you need them and then the risk of them not coming in on the right table edge - or there simply just isn't anything on the table edges for them to easily engage.  Some people make it work, though.  With the jump pack, however, you should be able to get them into melee while only having to weather two turns of shooting from the Contemptor (turn 1: move 12, run 1d6.  turn 2: move 12, fire meltagun, charge 2d6).  The Bike can match their speed for the most part, and if you move them together you force your opponent to make the choice of what to shoot, or split his fire between the two.  It is actually probably better for you if he shoots your bike and lets your Reavers get into melee with the Contemptor.  If there is good cover you can use on the way for one turn of LoS blocking, even better.  If you can thin out his tactical squad with your MoS's orbital bombardment, your reaver squad might actually be able to kill the Contemptor and then what remains of his tacticals, while your own tacticals and MoS follow up.

 

But this all relies on getting your Reaver Chieftain and at least a couple other Reavers into melee with the Contemptor, where you have the advantage.  It's risky and by no means guaranteed.

 

And yes, a Reaver Army is going to have trouble with getting enough heavy weapons on the field.  Not only do you have one fewer heavy support slot, but each slot is more expensive for having to also take Fast Attack options to open it up.  This is part of why I advocate the Rapier Battery with Laser Destroyer, as it gives you a good mid-range anti-tank option in the elites slot instead of trying to get one out of your heavy support.  I think your group has an interesting idea for an escalation league that forces each legion to use its legion RoW, but I do not think it is a balanced option.  The Death Guard, Iron Hands, Salamanders, Emperor's Children, all have fairly minor drawbacks to their RoW, where other legions have fairly crippling requirements (especially at this points level).

[MiR]

Thx a lot for all,

 

Taktic is clear to me atm.

And yes i also think RoW are a bad idea at 500 Points. Espacaly mine, the influence on playstyle and coises you have is far to hard fo a 500P. and i even think for a 1000P. Match.

Some Rites can easely fullfill there Requiaments even on 500P. but it there is a reasen why normaly you cant use a RoW below 1000P.

But its an Interesting Style so we tryed it.