What would you like to see in a Legion Codex?

[Castigator]

Rumour has it that we'll see a supplement for the Emperors Children in the next 12 months, so what would you like to see in it?

 

Although I think the Codex is adequate for our needs, there are a few things that I would like to see.

 

Sonic Weapon upgrades for Marine Characters.

Cult Terminators or Sonic options for Terminators.

A Slaanesh Daemon Weapon.

Sonic weapon upgrades for Bikes, Preds and Helbrutes.

 

Combat Drugs would be nice and I'd like to see sacred numbers introduced once again but they seem to have fallen out of favour just lately. Now that I think about it, I've realised that I'm reasonably happy with what we have and would more than happy if they just added a few more options to increase their flavour.

 

So what is everybody hoping for?

[hushrong]

I like the idea of more noise across the army. Combat drugs would be interesting too. If there would be more units using sonic weapons I'd pray for some new conversion packs.

 

Something I've been thinking about is a combined codex of Slaaneshi Daemons and Astartes. I really want this to have a purely Slaaneshi detachment. No limited allied detachment FOC and not having to flip through two books. No idea how a dex like this could work out though.

 

Maybe an anti-air vehicle too. Something like an LRAD on a rhino. A nice option I'd want to try in lieu of massive firing and hoping for sixes or having to bring pricy Havocs with flak or fortifications for flyers.

 

Another thing I would like would be a few named characters, maybe an independent one and a unit attachment. Maybe even Julius Kaesoron.

 

Just a few things I've been daydreaming about.

[Disciple of Fulgrim]

Interesting question - are these the Faeit 212 rumours you're referring to?

 

Your entire wishlist strikes me as being appropriate and reasonable, but given the minimalist approach GW seems to be taking with the supplements (to especially include the BL one) I can't see us getting more than two or three tweaks.  New artefacts for our ICs seems rather likely, but what form they'll take is more questionable.  I'd love to see the Blissgiver return, but the Murder Sword now seems to fill that role (poorly) - also, given the new Challenge rules and our guys' Initiative bonus, I could see folks complaining that a Slaaneshi Daemon weapon with ID was OP.  On the other hand, the one Slaaneshi melee weapon in the Daemon dex (the Witstealer Sword) is pretty meh (even if you give it +1D6 A) and I've heard that the special EC sword in the Horus Heresy rules is also nothing to write home about.  As far as sonics for our Characters goes, that's also a tricky one IMO, since the Burning Brand already is (basically) a more flexible version of our Doom Siren.  Maybe a Sonic pistol of some sort? 

 

Sonics for Helbrutes of course has the FW precedent, and I recall there were rules for sonic Preds too, but I'm not sure how efficient/useful such upgrades would be on AV12 or 13 platforms in the current meta - though Relentless Blastmasters sure would be tempting.  Our Bikes though do seem to have possibilites - a DS for the Champ and twin-linked Sonic blasters for the regular guys would be very nice (which is why we probably won't get this option.)

 

I actually think your idea about Combat Drugs is somewhat likely, and would also be nice from a strictly fluff perspective.  The Dark Eldar still have them, and while utterly random, that seems to be how Chaos is going to roll in 6th Edition (especially if Phil Kelly writes our supplement.)  While their utility will probably be marginal at best, at least it would bring the EC back towards their utterly depraved "sex, drugs and rock and roll" roots.  (Not that my warband's fluff focuses on that, but still.)

 

My wishlist would also include the option for an IC on a Steed to join allied Slaaneshi Daemon units (or at least Seeker units.)  It fits from a fluff and common sense perspective, isn't particularly OP, and from a personal perspective would let me get my oldest (RT era) mini back onto the tabletop.

 

What I do not want to see is the requirement for everyone to have the MoS - my Oblits currently deploy with Papa Nurgle looking after them, and I'm not going to give that up, even for a Relentless Blastmaster shot every other turn.  Additionally, any option that requires me to take Lucius or Fabulous Bill is probably going to be a no-go as far as I'm concerned.  While I like Lucius' fluff and model, he's still pretty mediocre on the table top, and as for Bill - well, I guess I have seen some funny conversions of him. 

 

That's my two riyals.

[Forté]

-Blastmasters for Havoks.

-Combat drugs.

-Close combat squads with multiple Doom Sirens.

-Bonus of some kind for using the sacred number or multiples of.

-Decent close combat options for HQ. Daemon weapon, sabers, dueling blades.

-Trophies to cause fear.

-Throw away, fearless meat shield of unarmed, drugged up slaves.

[Lord-Captain Cepinari]

I just want the sonic weapons to look like electric guitars again.

[k0k0z]

- Noise Weapons in HS slot

- Squad Captains for Marines to be able to take Doom Sirens (basically Squad Captains are Noise Marines)

- Noise Dreads - I hope this one is could become real as GW really needs to make the Hellbrute model playable.

- Decent AP2 or at least AP3 Daemon weapon for CC

- Some fluffy upgrade for the cultists

- KoS,Masque and heralds as HQ choices + Deamonettes and Steeds in codex slots.

[The Nephilim]

Without even reading what everyone wrote... I demand a return to an all sonic army! I'm still upset with the loss of my sonic termies, bikers and tanks.

[Forté]

I would actually like a variety within the EC because I'm pretty sure not every hedonist would go down the audio route.

 

This just popped into my head:

-Remove the icon completely. It doesn't really represent anything.

-Units with VotLW may add one of the following for +2pts per model.

>Centuries of Excess. Gain feel no pain (like the Icon).

>Honed to Perfection. Gain Counter Attack.

[The Nephilim]

After thinking about this more, this is what I'd like to see:

 

-A return of combat drugs

-A small selection of daemon weapons, including a return of Blissgiver

-A list of themed for Rewards of Slaanesh for the Champion/Character list

-A return of sonic weapons across the board, swapping bolters for sonic blasters, heavy bolters for blast masters and melta guns for doom sirens

-The Icon of Excess should be a squad upgrade, not a bonus that a precession shot can take out

-Cult terminators

[Forté]

We'll have to see what Black Library dump on us. I'm expecting something that can't be polished. And after Legions which already have kits (all of the others) and Huron's renegades.

[The Nephilim]

We'll have to see what Black Library dump on us. I'm expecting something that can't be polished. And after Legions which already have kits (all of the others) and Huron's renegades.

 

They have a Chaos accessory sprue that has yet to be released. I'm hoping that one day we will get to see it.

 

 

 

http://i392.photobucket.com/albums/pp7/jstead2/Forum%20Crap/Unreleased_-_Chaos_40K_Terminator_P.jpg

[Forté]

I doubt that will get released. And two of those arms look more like possesed pieces now. Keep an eye on Forge World really I think.

[Lord-Captain Cepinari]

To me, Chaos represents short term gain, long term loss. CSM armies should be able to straight up out DPS Loyalist Marines, with the trade off that they lack their counterpart's cohesion and teamwork. In addition, the fickle and random nature of Chaos means that there should be a Random Element, wherein an advantage could easily be replaced by a disadvantage, with the RNG standing in for the Ruinous Powers.

 

There's also the fact that the ways of Chaos are meant to be many, so instead of homogenizing the CSM they should strive to make them all as tactically different as possible.

 

Everything Khornate should be as aggressive as possible. No fancy tricks or maneuvers, just run up to the enemy and hit him. Like the Blood Angels, Space Wolves and Black Templar they should be entirely about the Assault. Chaos Gifts should increase damage while making it easier to get into melee range, with the Faustian downside of making you roll every turn to see if your guys completely lose their s**t and start butchering each other or break off to run towards the nearest enemy tank so they can bite it.

 

Everything Tzeentchian should be as magic as possible. Sorcerers get extra spells, units get lots of mutations, and the Daemon options either provide more long range firepower or mess with the opponent in some manner. The downsides are that you're not quite so adept at out-punching your foes, so you rely more on your shootier options, and there's always a chance you'll botch a Chaos Gift roll and that Terminator Lord you invested so heavily in gets one Gift too many and turns into a worthless Chaos Spawn.

 

Everything Nurglish should be as diseased as possible. Your Marines should all be damage sponges, and your special abilities should be geared towards debuffing your opponent and causing some DOT as well. The drawbacks should involve you not being all that good at straight up killing; you can't hit as hard as a Khorne Berserker and you can't shoot as well as a Rubric Marine, and since all your guys are mostly dead armor plated plague victims they aren't the fastest bunch around, assuming you don't fail a roll and they just collapse into a heaving sack of phlegm.

 

Everything Slaaneshi should be as EXTREME as possible. Your spell options should be about messing with your enemy, and that extends to Special Weapons options. The Slaaneshi need to kill in as perfect a manner as possible could translate into being able to take out singular targets very well, but not being so good at dealing with large numbers at once they way a hack-n-slash Khornate can. Also, your team's Sensation Addict tendencies should make them unreliable in the field, with bad rolls causing them to bliss out and stop paying attention to their surroundings, or make them crash and burn out, or just have them so distracted by a new sensation that they drop whatever they were doing. (For example, abandon killing an enemy scoring unit so he could enjoy having a piece of shrapnel embedded in his eye.)

[The Nephilim]

Yeah no. You just made competitive play impossible. No thank you.

[Lord-Captain Cepinari]

Curse my desire to merge fluff and crunch into one glorious whole!

 

What would you call such a combination, anyway?  Chewy?  Smooth?  Gross?

[The Nephilim]

I understand what you're trying to do, but it doesn't work with competitive gameplay. Point and example, no one takes possessed in this edition or the last due to the unpredictability of the unit. Same thing with crazed dreads. No one wants to risk something not doing what it is supposed to do, let alone harm your own forces.

 

I'll take set point values for set bonus any day of the week vs set cost and random bonus. My army lists reflect this as does a wide majority of the community.

[Disciple of Fulgrim]

@Nephilim: While I agree with you that the whole "wacky random chaos" thing was handled poorly in the new CSM dex, I think Kelly did a much better job implementing this concept in the new Daemon dex.  Just like the new "Primaris" psyker powers in the BRB, the default options for the new Daemonic Rewards give you some idea of what you're paying for when you do up your list.  If we could get something like this for say a "Combat Drugs" chart, it might make paying for the roll something worth considering.  (Provided that the default is worth the points of course, and doesn't just turn all your guys into Spawn or - even worse - Possessed.)   

[Forté]

Or...could fix Possessed at the same time.

[Slave to Darkness]

I run a 20 man possessed unit in my Word Bearers, and every army I have runs a Hellbrute. Then again, I dont care for the whole 'is/isnt  competitive gameplay' thing (dont own a Helldrake, wouldnt even know a  competitive list/army if it jumped up and hit me right in the tenders), I play for the love of the game, and to have a good time with the lads. 

 

I see a chaos army being well, chaotic, some stuff good, some stuff decides its gonna run off and molest a gerbil, a chaos army without possessed and mentally challenged dreads is just a marine army to me, might be due to me bein a 1st ed player, when chaos was just pure random, and even ork stuff malfunctioned and fell apart mid game. 

 

Im not bashing competitive gamers, if thats how they wanna play then good for them, I think Im basically just rambling when Im trynna say not every chaos player runs lists without the units the 'internets' say are worthless, I know more chaos players that use them than I know ppl who dont. Chaos should do what it says on the tin. 

 

@The Nephilim one day, if the gods allow it, I wish to face you over the games table, my army might not win, but it will bloody your nose ;)

[Forté]

Glad you said that. I have 12 possessed wanting something to do.