Baneblade vs Stormlord?

[Kilofix]

Let me know if the following thinking is right or wrong:

 

The difference between the Baneblade and the Stormlord (excluding minor weapons and transported troops) is primarily;

Baneblade Cannon, Demolisher Cannon vs Vulcan Megabolter.

 

That's 2 devastating AOE shots vs. 15 (or 30) lighter shots.

 

Assuming we're firing at fewer units without heavy armor, but that still have good saves (e.g. cover, invulnerable); like Stealth Suits in cover or Nova Riptides, etc.; the BB only gets 2 hits each model that may potentially all be saved, while it may be less likely that all 30 SL shots on a smaller unit will all be saved.

 

Which makes the BB more ideal for either blobs that won't get saves, or heavy armor; while the SL would be more ideal for smaller / non-heavy armor units with good saves.

 

Does the above sound right?

 

(btw for this discussion let's ignore the D weapon Shadowsword for a moment).

[Argun]

Yeah, that sounds about right. You've also got to factor in that the BB main gun can also wipe off light-medium armor as well (and possibly even landraiders)

 

For anti-tank/horde, go with Baneblade

For anti-MC/small unit, go with Stormlord

I guess the Stormblade could kinda fit between these two, with it's 10" plasma gun pie plate...

 

But if you really want to mess up their day, just spam artillery and Russes! (this coming from a guy who has 4 superheavies...)

[nurglez]

The other thing to consider is large blast weapons vs bs3 weaponry.at worse your blasts will scatter 9, while at worse the vulcan mega bolter will totally miss.

[Dam13n]

It's worth considering what you are likely to face and what other units you have in your list.

 

If both you and your opponent are fielding Lords of War then you'll need a way of killing theirs while protecting yours.

- Strength D weapons are good at killing theirs (Shadowsword)

- As are multiple melta weapons (if you can get them close enough)

- As are Flying Monstrous Creatures (unless they're taking on walkers)

etc.

 

Now if you have another way of taking out their super-heavy without needing Strength D (or they have no super-heavy), then the next question is what the rest of the enemies army will be made up of, and how best to kill it.

 

Infantry:

- They'll be hiding in cover from your super-heavy, so an ignores cover weapon will serve you best (Hellhammer/Stormsword)

 

Vehicles:

- Strength D is the most reliable against AV14 (Shadowsword)

- However against multiple lighter vehicles, a larger blast, coupled with more guns is preferable (Baneblade/Hellhammer (with sponsons))

 

Flyers:

- Only one option really, you need straight shots (Stormlord)

- Although you'd be better off with other things (Vendettas, Quad Guns etc.)

 

Given the standard 40k game is on a 6' by 4' table (so massive range isn't a necessity) it's hard to fault the Hellhammer.  With sponsons for versatility (one or two sets, if you have the points) it can do pretty much everything.  Plus, there's no hiding from that cannon - 36" range, S10, AP1, Massive Blast, Ignores Cover.  Just deploy it in the middle and you have complete board control (just be careful if you're likely to be going second - or against drop pod heavy armies).

 

On the topic of BS.  An "allied" Inquisitor with ML1 Divination to pop Prescience on it every turn will pretty much solve that issue, and for a very modest outlay in terms of points as well.

[Warhead01]

I don't think the Stormlord is anywhere near a first pick for my. A BaneBlade packs a lot more fire power and with blast markers of any size 5" or larger I see them hitting something vs missing completely.

And that's one of the reasons I had picked the Banehammer, Looking now I see that it has changed. But between the two choices you listed the BaneBlade would be my first choice. The Hellhammer would have beat the BaneBlade but the blast is smaller.  I want to hit more even when missing.

 

As a Guard player I could care less about D weapons I have more then enough men, tanks transports and aircraft. 

[PureFodder]

Of the two, I'd take the Stormlord as it does something that the rest of the codex can't do - put out loads of long range medium strength AP3 fire to deal with MCs.

 

Generally I've found that the Baneblade isn't as useful as you'd expect because most of the time your opponent will be able to get a cover save and will spread out enough or get close enough to prevent you from hitting multiple units in the blast. If you want to deal with high armour threats, Vendettas, Manticores, Russes and artillery all do it better and cheaper than the Baneblade.

 

I predict that the Stormlord will suddenly seem very appealing once the Tyranid codex comes out. With an inquisitor giving it prescience it will be able to gun down two Tyranid MC's per turn on its own. It also makes heavy weapon squads viable as they can deploy in it and shoot out of the back without getting murdered on turn one and provide overwatch support for the vehicle.

[WarriorFish]

Baneblade is almost literally a super-sized Russ so you know what to expect from it, but if you have an idea or role the Stormlord can work with then it will be much better. That's the best way to think of it I reckon, just like Russes there's plenty to pick from so you just need to get the right one for the job and if there isn't the original version is always a safe bet. Other than that I can't add any more to the good points already made :)

[Kilofix]

Of the two, I'd take the Stormlord as it does something that the rest of the codex can't do - put out loads of long range medium strength AP3 fire to deal with MCs.

 

Generally I've found that the Baneblade isn't as useful as you'd expect because most of the time your opponent will be able to get a cover save and will spread out enough or get close enough to prevent you from hitting multiple units in the blast. If you want to deal with high armour threats, Vendettas, Manticores, Russes and artillery all do it better and cheaper than the Baneblade.

 

I predict that the Stormlord will suddenly seem very appealing once the Tyranid codex comes out. With an inquisitor giving it prescience it will be able to gun down two Tyranid MC's per turn on its own. It also makes heavy weapon squads viable as they can deploy in it and shoot out of the back without getting murdered on turn one and provide overwatch support for the vehicle.

 

This is exactly the case.

 

The other day, I (didn't play in but) watched a game where a Baneblade was trying to take out 2 Riptides and a unit of 3 Stealths in cover and it just couldn't do it. After a few turns the Riptides had taken wounds and 1 Stealth died but it just seemed underwhelming.

 

Therefore, I was thinking maybe a Stormlord would have been more effective in that case.

 

It seems the problem with the BB is that it has too few 'hits' against multi-wound MCs that are too tough to be Instant Death'ed and / or against units with good invulnerable / cover saves.

 

And, yes, as PF says, a group of Vendetta's with 9 guns (or Arty, etc.), seem to take out heavy armor much faster than the BB.

[Warhead01]

 

 

The other day, I (didn't play in but) watched a game where a Baneblade was trying to take out 2 Riptides and a unit of 3 Stealths in cover and it just couldn't do it. After a few turns the Riptides had taken wounds and 1 Stealth died but it just seemed underwhelming.

 

Was it the tank or the player?