DanPesci Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 So, I have a housemate who plays a variety of marine armies, but one of his main ones being dark angels, however he found teh new codex fairly underwhelming for the style he plays (he generally plays deathwing, not ravenwing). So i thought...how can i help this...wel, why not include a character that gives his whole army a new special rule, whilst giving us an excuse to play some themed games. However, is cypher a viable choice, and can he fit into a wolves army successfully? Here are things im thinking - Infiltrate with some thunderwolf cavalry - Also include redmaw so i can infiltrate a grey hunter unit along with this - Outflank redmaw and another pack of grey hunters - At least one drop pod with wolf guard terminators basically, ive been crafting a redmaw themed army where a lot of the troops/scouts are outflanking, but was thinking cypher could give them a nice infiltrate boost. what do folk think, is he worth taking? Or just a bit of fun (which is mainly how id be using him anyway) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285310-cypher-and-wolves/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Volsung- Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 Wait, I don't quite understand... Your buddy doesn't like how DA plays, so you want to include Cypher in your wolf army? How is that going to change how his army plays? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285310-cypher-and-wolves/#findComment-3562498 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frater Cornelius Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 Wait, I don't quite understand... Your buddy doesn't like how DA plays, so you want to include Cypher in your wolf army? How is that going to change how his army plays? To a special rule to he entire army and more objectives. When there's Cypher vs DA, then all Inner Circle dudes also get Zealot. And there are a handful objectives for the DA player when playing against Cypher outside of the usual primary and secondary ones. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285310-cypher-and-wolves/#findComment-3562502 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanPesci Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 What immersturm said. Basically dark angels get more stuff when FACING an army with cypher in it. And it would mean some nice options for themed setups etc. But is it worth the hassle? Is cypher worth it? I dont actually have the dataslate so no 100% sure on all his rules (or his points!), just read a quick rundown of him on a blog and seemed like it may be an interesting idea to try out. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285310-cypher-and-wolves/#findComment-3562606 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max_Dammit Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 I dont know his rules, but I doubt he can join TWC to infiltrate. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285310-cypher-and-wolves/#findComment-3562718 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blacksad Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 why wouldn't he? TWC don't have thunderwolf mounts according to the rules, so they don't have the same restrictions as a character mounted on a thunderwolf mount Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285310-cypher-and-wolves/#findComment-3562808 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valerian Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 I dont know his rules, but I doubt he can join TWC to infiltrate. No reason that he couldn't, really. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285310-cypher-and-wolves/#findComment-3562900 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max_Dammit Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 why wouldn't he? TWC don't have thunderwolf mounts according to the rules, so they don't have the same restrictions as a character mounted on a thunderwolf mount thats bending the rules just to get what you want in my eye's, the fact that the book states thunderwolf about 5 times in its stats. but to each its own, just not the way i play. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285310-cypher-and-wolves/#findComment-3562913 Share on other sites More sharing options...
skeletoro Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 max, its not bending the rules in any way. It is very much arguable that it goes against the intention of the rules, but if so, the rules are poorly written. I can understand refraining from doing this combo because it feels like exploiting a loophole, but it is legit, RAW, IMO. The only real RAW limitation to this combination seems to be that cypher only moves 6", so the TWC will have a hard time moving full tilt without breaking coherency. Of course, he can leave the unit if necessary. At least he has fleet so the unit can continue to benefit from the rule (only applies if all models have fleet) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285310-cypher-and-wolves/#findComment-3562934 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valerian Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 why wouldn't he? TWC don't have thunderwolf mounts according to the rules, so they don't have the same restrictions as a character mounted on a thunderwolf mount thats bending the rules just to get what you want in my eye's, Well, that's the thing, what is the rule, exactly that is being bent? I know we've gone around this issue time and again here at The Fang, and we aren't likely to convince you to change your position, but the simple matter is that there is nowhere in the codex a rule that restricts what types of Independent Charaters can attach to a unit of TWC - and that is that. You can't/shouldn't attempt to extrapolate a constraint that is in the rules for a piece of Wargear (Thunderwolf Mount) to a Unit (Thunderwolf Cavalry); they are very much distinct things (just as Fenrisian Wolves as Wargear are disctinct from Fenrisian Wolves as a Unit). V Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285310-cypher-and-wolves/#findComment-3562956 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max_Dammit Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 This is not the thread for this discussion, so lets get back on topic. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285310-cypher-and-wolves/#findComment-3563340 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanPesci Posted January 8, 2014 Author Share Posted January 8, 2014 no worries max, i admit, attaching him to TWC would, indeed, be cheesy as (almost as cheesy asarmoured space marines riding big wolves....ha), but aye the possible plan would be have him attach at the start, then in the first turn, he leaves the unit, and they hopefully get a first turn charge...im getting fed up with my TWC getting shot to peices before they arrive. Although it may be quite nice to leave him with them, as although they'll lost 6" off their movement they still retain fleet, and get hit and run off cypher. To be fair, id be more interested in combining cypher and bran redmaw in order to get two squads of grey hunters infiltrating, as that seems a lot less cheese, and kinda fits in with the redmaw infiltrate/outflank list im currently working on. However im guessing the points cost to do so would be pretty daft. general rundown for his rules (and the other recent release dataslates) can be found here: http://space-wolves-grey.blogspot.co.uk/2014/01/dataslates.html 10 man wolfguard terminator squad with infiltrate? :D Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285310-cypher-and-wolves/#findComment-3563391 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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