Vomikron Noxis Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 Hey chaps, Anyone tried a spawn rush list? With BL allies you can have something like 2 max units of nurgle spawn, 2 drakes, 3 maulers and the obligatory 3 min cultists (in reserve of course), plus 2 bike sorcerers rolling on biomancy to beef up the spawn. That's all in 1500 points. Not much concern for anti air but it seems like not much could stand up to that on the ground! Thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
totgeboren Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 Give the Sorcerers Telepathy and hope for Invisibility. I faced that, T6 Spawn in cover with 2+ cover saves, and also the enemy counts as WS1 in cc. Much much more vicious than giving them FnP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excessus Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 I can vouch for that! I ran a list with 5 MoN spawns and Be'lakor. Those spawn were invincible! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 But outside of cover your sorc are going to be very vunerable , if they end up in the same unit as spawn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Ambroz Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 But outside of cover your sorc are going to be very vunerable , if they end up in the same unit as spawn. Belakor is a pretty decent solution to that. He's a bit more survivable than your average sorcerer with his EW. Edit: You could also put a ML 3 MoS sorcerer on a steed and hope for invisibility. That way he'd have a unit to protect him while he buffed the other squads. Even take two if you have the points, but that would be investing most of your force this way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excessus Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 Though you can't have MoN on the spawns if you have MoS on the sorcerer. A sorcerer on a bike can't get singled out either way since he'll always have the same or more cover than his unlucky friends... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 more is a problem , because the only thing you need for focus fire is different cover save , not just lower. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excessus Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 more is a problem , because the only thing you need for focus fire is different cover save , not just lower. Umm, actually, no. rulebook page 18. "Your opponent can only allocate Wounds to models with a cover save equal to or worse (i.e a higher value) than the value stated." So if you state 5+, which the sorcerer on bike has, your opponent can only allocate to models with 5+, 6+ or no cover save...which means the entire squad... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 But MoS spawn have no cover save on themselfs. And if a model doesn't have a cover save the moment when you check , if it is lower or equal for focus fire doesn't even happen . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Ambroz Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 Excessus, that would only be one unit with MoS or unmarked, kind of a waste not to use MoN on the others. Jeske, why wouldn't it have a coversave too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excessus Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 But MoS spawn have no cover save on themselfs. And if a model doesn't have a cover save the moment when you check , if it is lower or equal for focus fire doesn't even happen . Huh? You can always use focus fire, even if all the models in the unit is in the open. The only thing focus fire does is to limit targets, but when the limit is the number of models in the unit, it doesn't matter. Still doesn't mean focus fire doesn't happen. A bike will have a 5+ cover save if it moves, a spawn out of cover has none, which means you can't focus fire the sorcerer but you can focus fire the spawns. That is the problem with having a juggerlord with bikers, because it's the other way around and the lord can get focus fired! @TG: Yeah, but MoN spawns are so much better than MoS spawns. I would still grab a bike and just stick to that and unmarked, he can't get focused and he'll be T6 because of major toughness even without MoN himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spacefrisian Posted January 26, 2014 Share Posted January 26, 2014 Who cares about focusfire, you can still look out sir. Or take a 2nd bike unit and have them move in front of Lord and bike unit, so they provide a cover save to that lord. (if you dont care about points sink that is) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valaskjalf Posted January 26, 2014 Share Posted January 26, 2014 I never leave home without a unit of 3 x Nurgle spawn to tie up some Assault Marines or any other fast moving guys who want to get into my backfield - they never disappoint.Also make sure I run an unmarked ML2/3 Sorcerer behind them and roll heavy on Biomancy hoping for Endurance. I do my best to stay within 24inches to give them the guaranteed FNP, the 5+ is much better than an unreliable 4+ now and then. Like the comments about Invisibility, I should really give that a go sometime...good stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hornywingythingy Posted January 26, 2014 Share Posted January 26, 2014 Yup, ran a double sorcerer, 2x5 nurgle spawn, 2 baledrakes, 2 maulerfiends, and 2 Mon oblits. Plus cultists, it works pretty Damn well, but I found it slightly boring if I'm honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valaskjalf Posted January 26, 2014 Share Posted January 26, 2014 Yup, ran a double sorcerer, 2x5 nurgle spawn, 2 baledrakes, 2 maulerfiends, and 2 Mon oblits. Plus cultists, it works pretty Damn well, but I found it slightly boring if I'm honest. It's probably boring because of the 2x Heldrakes...drop them and see how boring it is :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
totgeboren Posted January 26, 2014 Share Posted January 26, 2014 I have tried out these super-rush lists (though using Daemons as allies or main), and I found it's not really all that fun to use. Just move your super-fast beasts as far forward as possible, assault and hope you kill stuff. You seldom have any situation were you really have much choice in what to do, it's just to assault the closest thing really. It's not that it is an auto-win list (though I have won massively every time I used them), it's that your input as player is severely limited since your units are so one-dimensional. Compare with a simple situation of you having a CSM squad with plasmaguns lead by a champ with a powerweapon. Lets say they start the turn 10" away from an enemy. You can move back and shoot, hoping to avoid assault, or move around slightly and rapid-fire, or brave overwatch and close in for an assault. Lots of options, which do make a big difference for how the rest of the battle play out. A unit of spawn in the same situation can really only do one thing, and that is assault. And yes, even taking the flexibility of the CSM into account, the Spawn are probably much better point for point anyway (just so people don't misunderstand me as saying I think Spawn are worse than basic CSM). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valaskjalf Posted January 26, 2014 Share Posted January 26, 2014 Yeah well I suppose Spawn are very one dimensional...then again they're mindless beasts with no weapons so what do you expect? And I still find them fun to play....their purpose is to tarpit, its nothing new and certainly not unique to CSM - it is very effective in tying up your opponent while you give the rest of your longrange guys in the back a turn or two to find better LOS etc. I think in small quantities they are fantastic, Im not saying use up your entire FA slot full of Spawn thats boring.I find them to be great LOS blockers and pretty much just being a nuisance...you dont really HAVE to charge the closest squad, Ive often just used them as a stumbling block or a Unit that the enemy tries to avoid, not because they are scared of them, but because they know the chances are they will be tied up for 2 or 3 turns with these things. So in a sense the way you run them can screw around with your Opponent's movement and targetting as well, especially against Tacticals....bolters do very little to 9 x T6 wounds.So yeah, I agree they are somewhat limited in use, but hey at least you know they are pretty good at what they do and they have a clearly defined role in the army....and you can do it for relatively cheap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hornywingythingy Posted January 27, 2014 Share Posted January 27, 2014 Yup, ran a double sorcerer, 2x5 nurgle spawn, 2 baledrakes, 2 maulerfiends, and 2 Mon oblits. Plus cultists, it works pretty Damn well, but I found it slightly boring if I'm honest. It's probably boring because of the 2x Heldrakes...drop them and see how boring it is :P Nah, the few times I used it the heldrakes didn't do too much, TBH the games were won by turn three when they came in, they just helped mop up. Multicharging tau stuff and breaking about 700 pts in one round really helped..... Well that and invisibility on both sorcerers.... I prefer my circus tbh, it's more a finesse army. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oreaper84 Posted January 27, 2014 Share Posted January 27, 2014 I love my spawn, mostly as an hq escort (any mounted hq really) or as a harassment unit. In my meta there are a lot of marine players and they like to use a little thing called a grav gun. Spawn say eff you to grav guns laughing (or gibberishing-ing) all the way to combat. Coming in at less points per wound at T-6 than a CSM trooper and being a beast makes them super efficient at what they do, tie up any unit. Except grey knights thats different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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