Possible hint at answer of Tarvitz outcome?

[Conn Eremon]

It was outright stated as such, terranraida. Forceful forgetfulness, severe depression.

 

And then he just gets over it.

[Kol Saresk]

And yet, there's a daemon running around that is called "Tairk reborn, he-who-is-now-Tormageddon".

[SickSix]

Yeah I really thought it was obvious they set up Rylanor to survive. But then they bring Loken back, whom didn't have Dreadnought armor to protect him.

[Conn Eremon]

And yet, there's a daemon running around that is called "Tairk reborn, he-who-is-now-Tormageddon".

But the Tarik that Loken speaks to is in his own mind.

[Kol Saresk]

So you think. ;)

 

Seriously though, if it really was a figment of his own imagination, then how would it now something bad had happened to Tarik and why would it tell Loken that he'd need to fix it?

[Machine God]

Dreadnought Tarvitz.

Then he will be both dead and alive, which will satisfy both parties

THen he'd be Schroedinger's Cat Dreadnought ;-)

[Conn Eremon]

So you think.

Seriously though, if it really was a figment of his own imagination, then how would it now something bad had happened to Tarik and why would it tell Loken that he'd need to fix it?

Because Warhammer 40k. Something bad is always happening for the quote, unquote "good guys" to fix. Just because a gypsy says she sees a rainy day in your future doesn't mean she can actually see the future.

It just means that Loken's mind knew what to say. Something that sounds plausible, but in retrospect was a pretty dang obvious observation.

Besides, Loken went cuckoo. He's obsessively, neurotically smashing spiders in a garden because of repressed Murder memories. Building a garden on the moon that looks like the one where he swore a Mournival oath, without deliberate effort or conscious acknowledgement of what he was doing.

Loken did not come back from Isstvan III with a full basket of marbles.

At least, until the very end, when he just decided "PTSD-induced paranoia and mental instability/fragility, BEGONE!"

And the PTSD-induced paranoia and mental instability/fragility just went "Oh snap, I'm out. *poof*"

Because that's how it works. Apparently.

[Wade Garrett]

It is when you're as awesome as Loken.

[Vesper]

A.K.A Uriel Ventris A.K.A Sharrowkyn.

[Conn Eremon]

Uriel Ventris is awesome?

 

When did that happen?

[Demus Ragnok]

Uriel Ventris is awesome?

 

When did that happen?

He learned it from Draigo.

[Durfast Spiritwolf]

 

At least, until the very end, when he just decided "PTSD-induced paranoia and mental instability/fragility, BEGONE!"

 

And the PTSD-induced paranoia and mental instability/fragility just went "Oh snap, I'm out. *poof*"

 

Because that's how it works. Apparently.

And you assume that it was PTSD and not some other form of disorder, such as exaggerated bereavement, because?

[Conn Eremon]

Because PTSD stands for post-traumatic stress disorder, and Loken's issues appeared to be byproducts of a heavily stressed out mind, induced by an extremely traumatic event.

 

Why?

[Lord Lorne Walkier]

I think Loken's issues might also be because of something yet to be revealed.  Along with his his PTSD i think Loken is starting to break through some of the mental conditioning that was done to him at some point before we were introduced to him.  Some kinda of brainwashing that the Luna Wolves did to their recruits or perhaps their Psykers post Nikaea.  In Legion of one Loken felt intense Pain when he tried to remember who Tarik was and other bits like who He was.  His "death that was no death" took more out of him then can be explained away with mere PTSD.  And the physical trauma that he experienced in the short story Luna Mendax.  I have not read the story but from a spoiler i read here is what makes me think their is something "real" going on. 

......

So now Loken hides in his garden, killing spiders. The spiders remind
him of something, and he gets quite agitated. Somebody, an Astartes,
appears to tell him that the spiders aren't bad-natured, and actually
help his garden a lot. Loken is dismissive of the man, cannot see or
recognize his face. The Astartes picks up a stone and throws it, so it
skims over the surface of the lake in the center of the biodome. The
stone reaches Garviel on the other side, who tries to catch it, but
can't grasp quickly enough. It leaves a bruise on his palm.

 

<snip>

 

Iacton Qruze enters, to summon Loken to Malcador. To his surprise, Loken
agrees, but not before throwing a stone over the water, like Torgaddon
did. Qruze notices the bruise, which is still on Loken's palm. He tells
Qruze that it is a reminder of things he still has to do.

 

 

 

[Kol Saresk]

Assuming that he is a latent psyker who's gone through some brainwashing that made him forget. It would actually be the first we've seen of that.

[GhostMalone]

Sometimes I feel we look to far into it,

A dreamscape & fractured mind may be a way of simply suppressing his sub concise & allow him to deal with the betrayal of his legion.

 

His father and closest brothers betrayed him.

He heard the screams of millions in the biggest atrocity committed in the imperiums history.

 

Not everything can be a latent psyker.

 

 

I'll put this down to subconscious recollection and repression, until he faces a brother face to face he will stay fractured and half an astrates.

 

He knows he should be dead so his life is currently that of a dead man given a second chance at redemption

[Molokai]

Ignore

[Lord Lorne Walkier]

Assuming that he is a latent psyker who's gone through some brainwashing that made him forget. It would actually be the first we've seen of that.

Not quite.  There is Saverion from Outcast Dead and Wolf Hunt....

[Molokai]

Pardon me but I thought this was the Loken thread. Ignore my previous post.

[Kol Saresk]

 

 

Assuming that he is a latent psyker who's gone through some brainwashing that made him forget. It would actually be the first we've seen of that.

Not quite. There is Saverion from Outcast Dead and Wolf Hunt....

Where did it say Sevarian was made to forget? One of the problems with latent psykers is that they usually don't know they're psykers. Technically Sevatar isn't a latent psyker, but an undeveloped psyker who forswore the use of his powers. IIRC, Sevarian never knew.

[Lord Lorne Walkier]

 

 

 

Assuming that he is a latent psyker who's gone through some brainwashing that made him forget. It would actually be the first we've seen of that.

Not quite. There is Saverion from Outcast Dead and Wolf Hunt....

Where did it say Sevarian was made to forget? One of the problems with latent psykers is that they usually don't know they're psykers. Technically Sevatar isn't a latent psyker, but an undeveloped psyker who forswore the use of his powers. IIRC, Sevarian never knew.

I don't think it was said that Sevarion from Wolf Hunt was made to forget.  It is my theory though that the Luna Wolves enacted a program of Psyco- conditioning in response to the Emperors decree at Nikaea to deal with their psykers.  I think this partly because it is unclear what Horus did do post Nikaea.  I have not found one scrap of  information regarding the Librarians of the XVI.  The information is so nonexistent that i suspect foul play.  The silence is defining so to speak.  Each Legion seems to have done their own thing to enact the Emperors will.  I think the clue to what the XVI did is in Savarion and Garviel. 

[Durfast Spiritwolf]

Because PTSD stands for post-traumatic stress disorder, and Loken's issues appeared to be byproducts of a heavily stressed out mind, induced by an extremely traumatic event.

Why?

PTSD is not the only form of condition to which troops in combat are susceptible too. If you do the research, you'll see that exaggerated bereavement, such as may follow the loss of a close comrade, is one such condition.

 

The why is that the recovery rates for other conditions can vary significantly from PTSD, especially in the example I have given.

[Conn Eremon]

 

 

Because PTSD stands for post-traumatic stress disorder, and Loken's issues appeared to be byproducts of a heavily stressed out mind, induced by an extremely traumatic event.

Why?

PTSD is not the only form of condition to which troops in combat are susceptible too. If you do the research, you'll see that exaggerated bereavement, such as may follow the loss of a close comrade, is one such condition.

 

The why is that the recovery rates for other conditions can vary significantly from PTSD, especially in the example I have given.

And troops in combat are not the only ones susceptible to PTSD. I didn't choose it simply because he is a soldier with issues. I chose it because the symptoms seem to fit.

[Durfast Spiritwolf]

 

 

 

Because PTSD stands for post-traumatic stress disorder, and Loken's issues appeared to be byproducts of a heavily stressed out mind, induced by an extremely traumatic event.

Why?

PTSD is not the only form of condition to which troops in combat are susceptible too. If you do the research, you'll see that exaggerated bereavement, such as may follow the loss of a close comrade, is one such condition.

 

The why is that the recovery rates for other conditions can vary significantly from PTSD, especially in the example I have given.

And troops in combat are not the only ones susceptible to PTSD. I didn't choose it simply because he is a soldier with issues. I chose it because the symptoms seem to fit.

 

Indeed, but I assume you have since checked the symptoms against exaggerated bereavement, and perhaps other forms of anxiety disorder, and seen that a different diagnosis might be possible.

 

The diagnosis for PTSD is complex and it is unfortunate that PTSD is readily attached in the popular mind to any display of extreme anxiety by servicemen and woman. To see it used here based on behaviour loosely described in a novel is symptomatic.

[Reinholt]

This also makes the assumption that the genetically modified astartes mind processes these things the same way as the unaltered human mind.

 

I am not sure this is a safe assumption. As much as the authors work to make the astartes human enough to understand, the genetic engineering used to construct them literally changes their minds and how they work. Can an astartes even get PTSD? If they can, will it be the same as a human? How is it cured?

 

I know these things have not been fully explored, but my point is that assuming Loken's mind works like a human soldier may not be a safe assumption.