Spanish_Muffin Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 Anyone happen to have a competitive (or semi-competitive, or possibly usable if my opponent is drunk) list that focuses around, or utilizes effectively, Bjorn or Canis? Canis, I'm in love with his fluff, rules, model, pretty much everything about him. I love including wolves, in all forms, into my army (was one of the primary reasons I started with the SW) but I can't seem to make a competitive list using him at all, which makes me sad. I'm hoping that someone might have some ideas of how to pull this off effectively, so that I don't just have to sit him on the bench as often as I find myself doing.I really love Bjorns rules, but sadly, can't find a reason to pick him up (outside of proxy) with any lists that I make. Primarily, I face a fair number of CSM (Tzseech and Nurgle), IG, SM, and Nids. - I've included this in case it helps with any feasible builds. I should also add, that my LGS makes it rain Helldrakes and Flyers - they're very much into the "win, win, win" meta. Even if it's not a list, I'd appreciate any insight into the Heroes themselves, from anyone that's used them with success (or failure) before. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/286740-bjorn-the-fellhanded-canis-wolfborn/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
henrywalker Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 I have a really cool idea for a conversion that i've wanted to do for bjorn for some time but i've been put off by him not seeming to be worth it in the current rules. Annoyingly just as i was typing that i got a canis wolfborn idea into my head and now i want one of those lists too. So sorry, no help but i'm adding my voice to the question. Help us oh wolfy bretheren Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/286740-bjorn-the-fellhanded-canis-wolfborn/#findComment-3592401 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rune Priest Jbickb Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 Canis list (only dreamed never run but looks interesting on paper) Wolf Tide HQ Canis- 2 wolves Lord on thunder Wolf power sword runic armor storm shield 2 wolves Lord on thunder Wolf power axe runic armor storm shield 2 wolves saga of the wolf kin Elite Lone Wolf TDA chain fist storm shield 1 wolf. Troops 6x 15 Fenrisian wolves (that's 90 wolves folks) Is it spam? Heck yeah Is it spam for advantage? Doubtful Let's face it, this list can't score, has low overall leadership, and is not cheap to acquire (borrow the wolves from other space Wolf buddies) but the look of disbelief as you set up 97 wolves 3 guys riding wolves and 1 TDA guy across from you opponent in a 1500 point game will be priceless. Otherwise no clue what to do with canis Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/286740-bjorn-the-fellhanded-canis-wolfborn/#findComment-3592504 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valerian Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 Canis' rules are weak; he has no Inv Save, and no AP2. His fluff is pathetic, in that it is a lazy copy and paste from the fluff of Leman Russ. As far as the model itself, we get into subjective territory, but if you like it, you like it, but many think his Wolf looks like an angry and bitter oversized squirrel. There is nothing redeeming about him, and I hope he's dropped from the next codex, or otherwise significantly reimagined. V Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/286740-bjorn-the-fellhanded-canis-wolfborn/#findComment-3592793 Share on other sites More sharing options...
henrywalker Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 Well i'm playing a world eaters army using the SW codex so the terrible fluff isn't really an issue. Also the main reason i would want to play him is i have a cool idea for a conversion using juggernaughts which i want to do so the model isn't an issue (although10 foot tall angry squirrel of doom sounds like nothing but awesome to me) lets assume that we want to take him for some reason (for me wanting to do the conversion) how would you work around this weakness and make him work for you. Thats where skill in writing lists comes from, not from just cherry picking the best things Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/286740-bjorn-the-fellhanded-canis-wolfborn/#findComment-3592819 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spanish_Muffin Posted February 12, 2014 Author Share Posted February 12, 2014 lets assume that we want to take him for some reason (for me wanting to do the conversion) how would you work around this weakness and make him work for you. Thats where skill in writing lists comes from, not from just cherry picking the best things This is well stated. Personally, I do like the model (I was wondering if it was just me that noticed the squirreliness of his wolf, glad to see I'm not alone), and I love the idea of adding a fair number of wolves, and TWC into the fray, which sadly isn't needed, or considered a hindrance, in a lot of lists. I know that poor Canis isn't a fantastic choice, and really is a point [in his current iteration] sink that's going to get blasted to bits, but I like him none-the-less, and I love that his brings the "wolf" to the Space Wolves. Was hoping to find someone who may be able to find a workable list, that allows Canis (Or Bjorn, as per the original comment) to be used in friendly games, without getting toasted and ending the battle faster than it took to set up. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/286740-bjorn-the-fellhanded-canis-wolfborn/#findComment-3592934 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torin Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 well spanish.. canis overall perspective is pretty sad actually. That i agree with valerian. But the way to use him is by attaching canis together with another Thundewolf Lord. Use the lord to accept challeges while canis takes on the unit. I have tried it once.. not canis but another lord equip like canis with warrior born.. this 2 TWL with 4 TWC(1TH, 1PF, 2x WC & 3 SS) actually tore several squad of CSM and termie. As for the model.. its ok.. a big squirrel.. he is. :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/286740-bjorn-the-fellhanded-canis-wolfborn/#findComment-3593040 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rune Priest Jbickb Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 I have used Bjorn a few times in a pod list. The nice thing about him is he is a bit tougher in cc than your average dread, (read av13) and his assault cannon is fun for the turn he deploys. Yes he will likely draw fire and be destroyed, but the nice thing about pod lists is you can drop a squad later to claim him which actually can give you an objective edge in a closer game. Not sure I can think of a stellar way to combine them, sadly, unless you wanna go target priority saturation. In which case get 3 vindicators, Bjorn, a couple pack's of thunder Wolf calvary, canis cuz for once he might make it into melee due to all the other targets and a couple packs of grey hunters in rhinos. Might work not sure though Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/286740-bjorn-the-fellhanded-canis-wolfborn/#findComment-3593041 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spanish_Muffin Posted February 13, 2014 Author Share Posted February 13, 2014 Hey thanks guys!Realistically, I'm not hoping to field them together. They would be used separately in different lists. While Canis would be my preferred model, I agree. His prognosis is weak, and I doubt it's going to get better any time soon. Someday I'll close my eye's and pretend I'm fielding Redwall, but that day is not today.Bjorn, I think could be a sweet list, and I'd love to get him up and running - but again, I have a hard time justifying using Bjorn when I can take 2 runepriests and a lone wolf to get the job done. That, and HP's have frightened me into using him. I tried to create a Bjorncentric list, and did a quick paper-proxy match against a buddy today. The fears were realized when he hit the field on turn 1, and was dropped by the end of my opponents turn 2 before he really did anything of note. Whelp, drop pod lists it is!Bjorn and Canis might just be saved for fun 2v2 APOC lists. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/286740-bjorn-the-fellhanded-canis-wolfborn/#findComment-3593138 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanPesci Posted February 13, 2014 Share Posted February 13, 2014 Personally, id leave Canis at home, put a WGBL in runic armour, on a TWM, with a claw, he will do better due to the 2+ Id run something like this: Lord - TWM, Sotbear, T.hammer, SS, R.Armour 15x Wolves WGBL - TWM, SotBeastlayer, W.Claw, R.Armour, SS, M.bombs 15x Wolves WGBL - TWM, SotWulfkin, (can you take this on battle leaders?), P.Axe, R.Armour, m.bombs 15x Wolves. 2x Grey Hunter Drop Pods/rhinos (1 twin melta, 1 twin plasma) 1xLong Fangs with ML Not sure on the exact points but tht should come to around 1500. Fenrisian wolves work as meatshields/delivery systems for guys who will eat folk in challenges, and if not challenged, mop up squads. 2 grey hunter squads to drop on objectives, long fangs to provide some hope of anti-flyer haha. Although helldrakes will toast those wolves, you'll hopefully tank some wounds on the 2+ runic armour saves. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/286740-bjorn-the-fellhanded-canis-wolfborn/#findComment-3593268 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wulf Vengis Posted February 15, 2014 Share Posted February 15, 2014 Bjorn can't take a drop pod, unless is a Lucious Patten from imperial armor books. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/286740-bjorn-the-fellhanded-canis-wolfborn/#findComment-3595144 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted February 15, 2014 Share Posted February 15, 2014 I was going to ask: Is FW allowed?Because if it is, we can make a hell of a list with ol Bjorn. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/286740-bjorn-the-fellhanded-canis-wolfborn/#findComment-3595154 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rune Priest Jbickb Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 My bad forgot to mention I put him in the lucious not standard. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/286740-bjorn-the-fellhanded-canis-wolfborn/#findComment-3595475 Share on other sites More sharing options...
henrywalker Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 I was going to ask: Is FW allowed? Because if it is, we can make a hell of a list with ol Bjorn. I use forgeworld all the time. Let hear this hell of a list Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/286740-bjorn-the-fellhanded-canis-wolfborn/#findComment-3595617 Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Rose Princes Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 There are really only 2 reasons to use Canis:1. you love the character's fluff and/or his model. 2. you want to field a crap ton of wolves as troops. if you're not doing either or both, don't bother. He's fun, but nothing you could not build with a Lord. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/286740-bjorn-the-fellhanded-canis-wolfborn/#findComment-3595628 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valerian Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 Bjorn can't take a drop pod, unless is a Lucious Patten from imperial armor books. The Lucius took a big hit, too, when its rules were last changed. It's the only option for Bjorn, unfortunately, but isn't nearly as good as it once was. Here's to hoping for a Bjorn fix, with regular Drop Pod access, in the 6e codex. V Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/286740-bjorn-the-fellhanded-canis-wolfborn/#findComment-3595711 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rune_Priest_Rhapsody Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 You aren't going to be able to 'competitively' use Canis. Can you build a super awesome list full of wolfy win with him, hell yeah!! I run him along side 45 fen wolves 2 TWL's 3-6 TWC and some LF's. It's super fun to play but the best part of it is seeing the look on your opponents face as you pull out wolf after wolf!! I used Bjorn once, when I first started playing 40K, and I haven't touched him since. SO no advice from me, sorry. End of Line Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/286740-bjorn-the-fellhanded-canis-wolfborn/#findComment-3596057 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blacksad Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 Canis with 2 wolves, 3 units of iron priests on TWC with cyberwolf retinues, fill it up with thunderwolf mounted lords and small twc units. (and ofcourse fenrisian wolf units as troops) it's a whipe the enemy or lose kinda list, but can be a lot of fun to play. indeed though, you need a saga of the bear - belt of Russ - Wolf Claw - thunderhammer lord to take on challengers in the canis unit. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/286740-bjorn-the-fellhanded-canis-wolfborn/#findComment-3596501 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torin Posted February 18, 2014 Share Posted February 18, 2014 I just remembered that bjorn can issue challenge since he is an ic..even if he is a walker right.. sorry for the highjack Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/286740-bjorn-the-fellhanded-canis-wolfborn/#findComment-3596848 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valerian Posted February 18, 2014 Share Posted February 18, 2014 I just remembered that bjorn can issue challenge since he is an ic..even if he is a walker right.. sorry for the highjack He's not an IC, just a C, but yes, he can issue Challenges. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/286740-bjorn-the-fellhanded-canis-wolfborn/#findComment-3597018 Share on other sites More sharing options...
HergerOddhowl Posted February 18, 2014 Share Posted February 18, 2014 I understand that a list of Fenrisian Wolves isn't the most competitive, but do you folks have good experiences with them? With a Wolf Lord tagging along, his high LD seems like the only thing saving them as all those 6+ saves surely aren't going to. They move fast, but I suppose my only experience with them was charging a squad of Striking Scorpions... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/286740-bjorn-the-fellhanded-canis-wolfborn/#findComment-3597110 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blacksad Posted February 18, 2014 Share Posted February 18, 2014 a list of fen wolves isn't the most competitive, true, but many competetive lists aren't equipped to handle so many CC units going for their throats that quickly eighter. as stated, it's a table or lose kinda list. if you're fast enough and table the opponent, you win, if not, you lose. Took a list like this to a tournament once, ended up with 2 wins and a loss. I was happy. Some of my opponents weren't. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/286740-bjorn-the-fellhanded-canis-wolfborn/#findComment-3597140 Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Rose Princes Posted February 18, 2014 Share Posted February 18, 2014 For an all comers list, i play them very aggressive and ignore the scenario; most peole are not ready for that and it throws them off, especially in a tournament setting. This one tau guy could not handle it and called all sorts of cheese slinging names... ruined his perfect record. It has it's place... its place is fun. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/286740-bjorn-the-fellhanded-canis-wolfborn/#findComment-3597244 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rune_Priest_Rhapsody Posted February 18, 2014 Share Posted February 18, 2014 I run a pack of 15 Fen wolves with one lord, another with Canis, and one or two solo up front screening and chewing faces. My third lord usually rides with some cavalry buddies. No, it is not competitive, but as stated already it's a very aggro build that the 6th edition shooty armies can have some difficulty with. Hell, I even took out my friends Green tide/speed freak army with nothing but fen wolves and twc (...and some LF'S!! :P). It is certainly a type of army that is not expected and therefor you can get some very satisfying wins from it!! Nice work The Rose Princes!! Stick it to the stupid Tau. They are the flavor of the meta here, so I too like to build lists tailored to play their weaknesses if I go to a tourney and take my wolves. End of Line Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/286740-bjorn-the-fellhanded-canis-wolfborn/#findComment-3597332 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.