Furioso - how do you run them?

[Chaplain Admetus]

Recently caved and bought the new shiny furioso, as I'm having withdrawal from my two classic metal dreads that are in storage somewhere. I plan on running a Fragioso in a pod, but was wondering what people thought was the best option for a complementary weapon to the frag cannon - should I go heavy flamer for the triple-template, meltagun, or simple storm bolter; and is it worth adding the magna-grapple?

 

Also, does anyone have experience running a Librarian dread, and if so what powers/tables do you tend to take? I've got mine set up so I can mix and match with arms/underslung guns/swappable front plate, so combined with a standard plastic dread I can practically run 2 dreads in any combination (can't run librarian/choppy furioso, but that'll be fixable when I regain access to the metal dreads).

[GrunTeufel]

Deep striking furioso are fire magnets most of the time. When I deploy a fragioso I give him a heavy flamer because a melta gets the extra d6 in 6" range and if you managed to get that close you might just as well assault the tank. And if you get assaulted by the enemy unit you get a d3 overwatch hits. I generally deploy a fragioso when I am playing against an ork or imperial guard army. Makes short work of any lootaz or heavy weapon teams present. 

 

Magna grapple is quite expensive for the job it does. 

 

For librarian dreads I go with blood lance and shield of sanguinius. If not deepstriking than blood lance and wings of sanguinius. Once managed to take out two leman russes with a single strike. Fun stuff.

[Jolemai]

I usually run mine with a Magna Grapple and it arrives in a Drop Pod.

 

The Magna Grapple at the end of the day is an extra STR 8 shot and an extra variable on the weapon destroyed dice roll. Also, this means I have technically four weapons to fire on the turn it arrives (FC x2, MG, MG). Although I personally don't run it, I feel that if you go for the Heavy Flamer option you need the Magna Grapple as it extends your total killzone from 8" to 12".

[RenderDead]

I always run them in pods.  Now when you kit them, its up to you.  Heavy Flamers are great against certain armies of course, as stated above.  The melta and magna grapple could do work on a bunch of mechs bunched up.  Expect them to die right afterwards since they will be in the face of your enemy, but if you do survive then woohoo! 

[Quozzo]

I feel that if you go for the Heavy Flamer option you need the Magna Grapple as it extends your total killzone from 8" to 12".

This. The magna-grapple allows you to force saves on models that are far beyond the range of the templates. If you don't have it then the remainder of the squad is going to be pretty pissed you just toasted their mates, and the ones at the back usually have the better equipment that can deal with walkers.

[knife&fork]

Yeah, they often die. But that's because the enemy can't afford to have them alive!  You have to make the most of that and put lots of pressure on him at once. 

 

Rarely will you be so outgunned that the other player can deal with everything at once. 

 

 

 

 

I feel that if you go for the Heavy Flamer option you need the Magna Grapple as it extends your total killzone from 8" to 12".

This. The magna-grapple allows you to force saves on models that are far beyond the range of the templates. If you don't have it then the remainder of the squad is going to be pretty pissed you just toasted their mates, and the ones at the back usually have the better equipment that can deal with walkers.

Yes, normally this isn't a big deal, because templates are usually single shot affairs. But since the frag cannon will hit everything under the template twice you really want the extra range. 

[Chaplain Admetus]

Cool, thanks guys. Will be trying a fragioso in a pod with magna-grapple, and a librarian furioso (points permitting) tonight, will see how it goes!

[IK Viper]

I am going to advocate the other way.  I think the Melta you already come with is much better then the Hvy. Flamer.  I understand that the extra template weapon can be nice against 4+ infantry or worse and it synergizes with the Frag. Cannon but in a Take All Comers list (it's just rude to build armies to play people) the Melta gun can now allow you to threaten AV much better on the drop, besides, why pay 10 more points for an AP4 gun that limits your kill range because it replaces the Melta?  This guy usually gets killed once he drops and rarely will he single handedly finish off a whole squad in one shot so I say keep him loaded with a gun that can also take on AV, save some points as he will die soon any way, and just hope he lasts through the enemy shooting phase.  The mental stress a Drop Podding Melta Gun puts on your opponent is much higher than that of a Hvy. Flamer.  They just need to spread out well and limit the damage against the flamer.  Melta also poses a very real threat to AV units and their deployment needs to change acocrdingly.  Besides, most of the light infantry that the Fragioso is good at killing are usually put in reserves or in vehicles to start the game, thus leaving you with no good targets.   

 

On a rules note:  Walkers can shoot 2 weapons per turn, something to consider when loading down a Furioso with a Magna Grapple as you are now going to have to choose what gun NOT to shoot. Again, in my opinion, not worth the 15 extra points here becasue you are using this guys a a distraction unit and the reason people fear him is his CC not his shooting, would not pay alot of points to increase his shooting, if that is what you want (Drop Pod shooting) a Sternguard Squad of 5  or Honour Guard are much better. 

[Chaplain Admetus]

And -that- is why none of the guns are glued in place. I'll be doing the retro version (read: blu-tac) until I can get magnets for the underslung guns. 

 

Also, potentially silly question - nowhere is it stated outright what kind of Force Weapon the furioso librarian comes with, and the option of force weapon is limited to Sword, Staff and Axe (None of this maul/spear business that the power weapons offer as options) or 'unusual force weapons'... I personally reckon the weapon mostly resembles a halberd, which the BRB tells us is used as an axe - am I right in this assumption? Because if so, I like the idea of an at-initiative AP2 force weapon.

[Jolemai]

Incorrect. BRB Page, 84:

 

 

A walker that moved can still fire all of its weapons in the shooting phase.

 

It's MCs that are restricted to just two per phase.

And -that- is why none of the guns are glued in place. I'll be doing the retro version (read: blu-tac) until I can get magnets for the underslung guns. 

 

Also, potentially silly question - nowhere is it stated outright what kind of Force Weapon the furioso librarian comes with, and the option of force weapon is limited to Sword, Staff and Axe (None of this maul/spear business that the power weapons offer as options) or 'unusual force weapons'... I personally reckon the weapon mostly resembles a halberd, which the BRB tells us is used as an axe - am I right in this assumption? Because if so, I like the idea of an at-initiative AP2 force weapon.

Correct, it's a axe.

[thepowerofwar]

Walkers can fire all weapons its monstrous creatures that can only fire 2

[IK Viper]

Great, that is alot better than I thought it was.  I still would not take the Magna Grapple but it is alteast not a useless option now.

[knife&fork]

Don't forget about the grapple part of the grapple! When the stars are right it produces hilarious results.

[Durundal]

I'd run a grapple to not only pop vehicles but the chance at pulling his vehicles back or into a bad position for my other guns on the table. I know chances aren't reliable but this is a game of random chances

[knife&fork]

I like to position my frag dreads so that they hit more than unit. Often that means shooting at a vehicle through the squad in front, grapple adds to the value then thanks to not only being more like to blow up the vehicle but also the possibility of tank shocking the friendly unit. 

 

You can pull all sorts of shenanigans with the grapple, like tank shocking your own unit and taking a death or glory with one of your own models for a chance to kill a transport and still being able to shoot the contents.

 

The odds of pulling these things off are slim, just a bonus possibility to keep in mind when placing the pod and disembarking your dread.  

[Chaplain Admetus]

Yeah. Last night I ran frag cannon/heavy flamer, but I definitely want to try and get the points for a magna grapple. I'm going to be making tweaks to the list that should hopefully result in its inclusion. I'd have to try the heavy flamer against something that's not Tyranids for a fair reflection of its abilities...

[Sanguine_Blood]

I run Fragioso, in a pod when I am taking only one.

Recently I have started using 2, as they ARE fire magnets the turn they arrive.

 

I always choose the Frag/Heavy Flamer option

For the 2nd one I choose the Blood Fist/melta/Magna/Heavy Flamer option. Having the tactical ability to not limit my dreads to one meta has helped me, plus if they ignore the fragger to take out the fister, they are accepting the wrath of more flamers... if they take out the fragger then they have an AV13 assaulter ripping them up. They have to be able to down BOTH, but usually they need to sink a lot of resources into taking both down so it allows the rest of my force to advance.

[thebymster]

I also take frag, mag and melta in a pod! For all the reasons stated above!

Only thing I'd add is where to place pod. Try to: hide your rear armour- get first blood- destroy Eldar vehicles- rouste out tau warlords hidding in cover- block line of sight with pod for enemy big tanks AND enjoy the experience!!

[thepowerofwar]

I have been using 2 fragioso's in pods with magna and heavy flamer and they are almost always my mvp units.  The anti infantry capability's are huge and with av 13 they are strong against most interceptor fire.  The magna is great to cause an Instant death threat to characters or to cause havoc with tank shocking enemy units with their own vehicles.