Nehekhare Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 Cultists don't need to cover 25% of the vehicle, they just need to be between whatever is shooting at the 'Brute and at least "partially obscure" it. That won't give the 'Brute a 3+ against things that are on really tall buildings (unless you cluster the Cultists around enough), but from most things he should get a cover save. you are absolutely right! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilofix Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 Ugh, how did we all read the murderfist wrong last night? I wake up this morning ready to throw out the landing pad suggestion as a very expensive but potentially pretty cool sort of mechadev squad, but with the crazed results only applying to brutes with markers, it really isn't worth it. It's such a shame brutes aren't daemons or you could try for a 2++ brutestar. I guess as a formation at least they get more out of buffs, but no, as far as I can tell, if I ever run 5 brutes, it will be two cults and a meyhem pack. Yeah boo about the Murder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smurfalypse Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 Throw them on a Landing Pad and gain your 4++ and just do the double shooty Helbrutes. . . That is a decent fire base (expensive though). this is terrible advice... a) would have to "just" roll a 1 on d3 for fire frenzy skyshield provides DS without scatter or 4++ c) not a single shot until reserves arrive. did you confuse the mayhem pack with the murderpack? but it's bad even for them, since they need crazed markers to benefit from crazed results. Yes I did, meant the unit of 5 that groups up as a squadron. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nusquam Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 Take Be'Lakor and give the Murder Pack invisibility. Boom, instant 4+ for 5 'brutes, throw cultists in front to give them all a 3+(if you can obscure enough). Or a 2+ for the Helcult 'brute. Plus Be'Lakor is plain good. Oh the possibilities Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Urauloth Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 It seems like the best thing the Helfist Murderpack has going for it is its name. Can't say as I'm in any hurry to sink 500+ points into a squadron just to get the alpha. The Helcult, however, is fantastic. The cover rule owns, the fearlessness owns, the zealotry if the helbrute dies also owns. 100% sold on this and it's really great fluff-wise for my Word Bearers, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clone Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 I have a game coming up against grey knights and my opponent will be using an imperial knight. Does anyone think the mayhem pack with multi-meltas and thunderhammers could bring one down? I could place the helbrutes in a triangle around the knight so that at least 2 would be firing on sides without an ion shield. Then whoever survives the return fire would charge in against it and hit at the same initiative step as the knight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nehekhare Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 the helcult has few downsides: one is that you still have to fill your compulsory troops choice with something else, the other that you have to pay the price of a helbrute to make your cultists fearless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nusquam Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 The point of the dataslate is to use brutes. The fearless cultists is just a bonus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scribe Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 Yeah I dont see it as a tax, so much as a way to get some ranged support out there while also tossing in some additional scoring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nehekhare Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 well a brute means 100pts less obliterators/scoring cultists ;) I'd say the fearless cultists makes that expenditure a bit less unjustified. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daboarder Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 The fact the cultists bare fearless even when the brutes arebdeadnis the real icing on the cake. Cheap fearless scoring means I dont need to take typhus for zombies or a dark apostle to babby sit them Edit: and that 3+ cover save does wonders for the brute survivability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scribe Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Yeah, its a really nice cheap formation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daboarder Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 The problem with the cult in my opinion is that I would want to run two,,,,and thats a lot of points going into cultists given you need 6 squads to do it.... It's something I'll try out, but for my money the first thing I'm doing is swapping out my two termicide squads for a mayhem pack and seeing how that goes, with a multi-melta and powerfist those things are going to be mean, regardless of what they roll. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scribe Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 I think 1 helcult will go in most of my lists, either Daemons or CSM. Mayhem is going to be a fairly specific need, I dont run termicide much these days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilofix Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Spent a couple of hours this evening to get my Mayhem done. Quick and dirty but enough to get them on table. Gonna see how they work if I pre-emptively drop a Kharybdis with a small Termicide beforehand. Lots of points but bah! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plague Angel Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 So is it an extra detachment? If so, is it available to any other armies (Daemons, at least, I would hope)? Or is it just an addon to the Chaos Space Marines codex? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilofix Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 It is a Formation from Faction: Chaos Space Marines. So you could take the Formation with either Chaos Space Marines or Chaos Daemons and be Battle-Brothers. Technically it also means you could take the Formation with Imperial Guard and be Allies of Convenience. Good news for my Renegades & Heretics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incinerator950 Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 I'm interested in the Helcult myself now, two cult formations and a single helbrute? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Fulgrim Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 The Helcult looks really interesting. If you would run this detachment, what equipment would be the best for the cultist and most important the helbrute? I'm thinking running the cultists with cqw and pistol with flamers and the helbrute with power fist and power scourge or plasma cannon and missile launcher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellrender Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Depends where you want your cultists to be. I think a Power Scourge can be really handy for protecting your cultists. Since you will most likely not end up in assault before turn 3-4, i would complement it with a plasma cannon. I love plasma cannons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenith Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Depends on what you want them to do. Autoguns and heavy stubbers combined with lascannon/missile launcher for some safe objective holding, scourge and multi melta to press forward. Could be anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Urauloth Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 I'd love an excuse to take a plasma cannon and the cult 'brute seems like as good a place for one as any. I wouldn't give it a launcher, personally, since that's wasting the rage USR. A scourge or fist backed up by a melta or an autocannon seem pretty appealing. Use a cultist blob for cover, crack off opportunity shots on your way to the enemy, then stamp on something with the extra charge attack. You can park your other fearless cultist squad on an objective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incinerator950 Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 I'm debating whether to go bones Mayhem or Helcult. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BassWave Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 With this new data slate, a dark mechanicus army sounds really tempting... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
totgeboren Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 I tried out the Mayhem Pack today, though it was in a Zone Mortalis game at 1000 pts. (Don't worry, I asked my opponent beforehand if he was fine with me using the dataslate.) Since Zone Mortalis don't really allow much heavier stuff than Dreadnoughts, and long-range anti-tank guns are rare, it's not the best sort of game for determining how good the Mayhem Pack works. Also, deep strike mishaps give you an extra -1 on the roll in Zone Mortalis. Anyway, I scattered on all my Deep Strikes. 3 Dreads and 1 termicide all scattered, and one Dread went back into ongoing reserves and scattered again when he deep struck, so five deep strike scatters in a row. Luckily none of my units were destroyed. Anyway, Helbruts are much much much better when they Deep Strike than otherwise, though having to roll on the crazy-table every turn was really annoying. Heavy Flamers are awesome on deep strike dreads. On the other hand it must be said that dreads are still incredibly fragile all things considered. My first Dread managed to glance himself with his plasmacannon, then he assaulted some Striking Scorps and lost the last two hull points to a Scorpion Claw Exarch before he even got to swing. :sadtrombone One other dread ran up 2" away from two Warwalkers and then proceeded to get crazy and fire twice with his multimelta, which ended with him destroying one weapon on one of them... On the other hand the last Dread did really good because of the crazy roll, as he managed to destroy a squad of Dire Avengers, a squad of Guardians and a Farseer in a single turn of shooting because he got fire frenzy when he was right in front of a whole bunch of Eldar. All in all I can say that the Mayhem Pack definitely move Helbrutes from 'crap' to 'useful'. Though having a versatile load-out is a must. Since they roll for crazy every round, they really need weapons that allow them to function no matter what they roll. Oh, and heavy flamers are awesome on deep striking dreads! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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