baldur27 Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 given that the cursed founding was 4,000 years ago is it reasonable that a cursed founding chapter could have successor chapters? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288362-cursed-founding/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaplain Lucifer Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 I don't think so, because the Cursed founding Chapters are known and after things went south , no one would sanction Chapters with messed up gene-seed. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288362-cursed-founding/#findComment-3627616 Share on other sites More sharing options...
baldur27 Posted March 20, 2014 Author Share Posted March 20, 2014 they sanctioned raven guard successors and their gene seed is mangled beyond all recovery Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288362-cursed-founding/#findComment-3627759 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Messor Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 Not all cursed founding chapters are known, and with 4,000 years to play with, plenty of clerical errors can slip through the cracks that might obscure a seemingly healthy Chapter's founding date. Obviously, though, a prospective sire chapter would have to undergo some rigorous examination, so if there are notable flaws, they would need to be very well hidden. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288362-cursed-founding/#findComment-3627978 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffTibbetts Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 I think it's technically possible as Messor mentioned, but I'd ask "why" first. Is it really important for them to come from one of the know CF chapters? I think it's a stretch, to put it mildly. If you have a cool idea, though, out with it! Let's see what you're talking about first. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288362-cursed-founding/#findComment-3628067 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olis Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 I agree. If you've got some gold waiting in those hills you call a noggin then perhaps describing the idea would be good - refining it with some help and experienced knowledge could do wonders. It'll also help you 'get a feel' for the Liber - certain Liberites will approach the same problem in different ways and express themselves differently too. Some might be brusque, some might be comprehensive while others still might be succinct and to the point. If you feel that the idea 'isn't ready' yet, then fair enough. We'll not pressure you into doing something you don't want to. The Liber is a place for creativity, not stiflement. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288362-cursed-founding/#findComment-3628197 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffTibbetts Posted March 20, 2014 Share Posted March 20, 2014 "...stiflement." Read this in Bilbo's voice after Gandalf tells him that Bullroarer Took invented golf in the first Hobbit movie: "I do believe you made that up." Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288362-cursed-founding/#findComment-3628212 Share on other sites More sharing options...
baldur27 Posted March 21, 2014 Author Share Posted March 21, 2014 right now I think my guys are too "unique snowflake" to be taken seriously so I've been testing the waters with various ideas to see how much fat needs to be skimmed off Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288362-cursed-founding/#findComment-3628603 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffTibbetts Posted March 21, 2014 Share Posted March 21, 2014 Oh, we're good at helping to skim it. Sometimes we cut a bit close to the skin, but it's all in good spirits. ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288362-cursed-founding/#findComment-3628622 Share on other sites More sharing options...
baldur27 Posted March 22, 2014 Author Share Posted March 22, 2014 hmmmmm well lets say said chapter had a master that went quietly mad and decided his chapter was really the long lost 2nd legion and began to enlarge it on the sly splitting it into groups and slowly enlarging each group keeping the exact size of these war bands secret from everyone but himself. now if he was found out by his chapter and they removed him and came before the lords of terra with heads bowed in repentance what would happen to all the extra marines? would they be split off into new chapters or quietly gotten rid of? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288362-cursed-founding/#findComment-3629792 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olis Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 Onto the idea: ...lets say said chapter had a master that went quietly mad and decided his chapter was really the long lost 2nd legion and began to enlarge it on the sly splitting it into groups and slowly enlarging each group keeping the exact size of these war bands secret from everyone but himself. I would advocate losing the reference to the 2nd Legion and just claim that he believed that his chapter was chosen to rebuild the Legion (whichever their parent Legion would have been) - I'd wager that this would immediately cut the 'special snowflake' quotient down by at least, hmm, 75%*. Of course, the how and the why he went a bit bonkers might need to be elaborated on. In a sidebar, preferably. *arbitrary number now if he was found out by his chapter and they removed him Chapter War! I do love a good Chapter War. This is the perfect opportunity to have one. and came before the lords of terra with heads bowed in repentance what would happen to all the extra marines? would they be split off into new chapters or quietly gotten rid of? In my opinion, they'd sit down, argue for a bit and send you on a penitence crusade to thin your numbers. A "Don't come back until you're a codex adherant chapter again. Or crusade for a century. Which ever is longer." attitude. Make the punishment fair but grim (insofar that can within the 40k universe - 'fair' usually ends up being really rather cruel by our standards). Also, if I were you, I'd try to keep this part of the background succinct. It is something the chapter would be ashamed of but a 'let's move on' feel might add to the historical perspective (especially if it genuinely is ancient chapter history). Feel free to interject if you think my notions don't gel. Also feel free to reject them, if you so wish - this is your chapter not mine. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288362-cursed-founding/#findComment-3629857 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Messor Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 Yeah, I'd agree with Olis. To simply split them up, regardless of what they knew about the CM's shenanigans, would risk being perceived as acceptance. They might be fair enough to gather them all together, but then they'd send them out to butcher and be butchered til only the requisite thousand remain. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288362-cursed-founding/#findComment-3630050 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conn Eremon Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 What Olisredan said is pretty much the same thing that springed to mind while reading your idea, baldur27. Drop the II Legion reference, end it with a Penitence Crusade. Sounds like a pretty cool idea. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288362-cursed-founding/#findComment-3630291 Share on other sites More sharing options...
baldur27 Posted March 23, 2014 Author Share Posted March 23, 2014 ok cool, what I'm really looking for is an excuse to have multiple successor chapters from a cursed founding with chimeric gene-seed but that might be to much to ask alas Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288362-cursed-founding/#findComment-3630446 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olis Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Unfortnately, yes. It might be possible to wrangle it so you could have successors but it runs the risk of sounding too implausible to work. I suggest stretching your wings with a less ambitious idea - say, what you got so far minus the successors and the II Legion reference - and crack on with that. You have got some great stuff tucked away here. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288362-cursed-founding/#findComment-3630537 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Debonair Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 ok cool, what I'm really looking for is an excuse to have multiple successor chapters from a cursed founding with chimeric gene-seed but that might be to much to ask alas Actually, there is technically a way forward, but I'm not sure I'd recommend it. You could have a couple of successors created during the Cursed Founding from an older Chapter, who go on to suffer the same (or at least very similar) curses. The thing is, this is a lot of work. You'd have to flesh out the original Chapter, then when it's done move on to the successors and make them all different and interesting enough to be notable. Speaking as a guy who once tried (and failed miserably) to develop four Chapters at once, I'd recommend not doing that, or at least not until you've done a stand-alone Chapter. Working on one Chapter at a time is more than enough work - doing multiple at once is a lot harder! All that said, I'd totally recommend the Penitent Crusade story you've got brewing here. There's a lot of potential there! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288362-cursed-founding/#findComment-3630629 Share on other sites More sharing options...
baldur27 Posted March 23, 2014 Author Share Posted March 23, 2014 I've already got 5 nearly fleshed out chapters ready to roll actually 1 fully fleshed 2 mostly done and 2 basic outlines but you get the idea Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288362-cursed-founding/#findComment-3630635 Share on other sites More sharing options...
incinerator950 Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Generator Roll dice on the gene seed mutations and deficiencies. Splicing together multiple geneseeds seems haphazard, and unlikely warranted unless you take a situation where you can justify it. There was a IA a while back about detachments of four chapters which got stuck on a planet and ended up with a new progeny. However, simplicity is usually preferable in this case. The High Lords are more keen to take IF or UM stock simply because it's more stable than say, Dragon Warriors or a stock made behind their back. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288362-cursed-founding/#findComment-3630669 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olis Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 I think your link is broken, brother. :/ Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288362-cursed-founding/#findComment-3630892 Share on other sites More sharing options...
incinerator950 Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Fixed, I was wondering what was with it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288362-cursed-founding/#findComment-3630894 Share on other sites More sharing options...
baldur27 Posted March 24, 2014 Author Share Posted March 24, 2014 that's the chaos one but I found the loyalist one easy enough some good stuff here Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288362-cursed-founding/#findComment-3631407 Share on other sites More sharing options...
chromedog Posted March 24, 2014 Share Posted March 24, 2014 My guys are definitely too "unique snowflake" - but I don't consider 40k to be a serious thing. Never have. It's grimdark dialled up to 11. Serious took the last bus out of town years ago.Not with the amount of crap fluff put out by GW themselves. My marines are all the result of cloning experiments (this is why all my sgts look alike - They are all clones. They found a 'perfect' subject for their implant initiations, mentally and physically suitable - and cloned him. Given the amount of indoctrination they do as well, it's easier to do it to a "blank" brain - but you can at least "train" them from birth, instead of their environment hardening them up. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288362-cursed-founding/#findComment-3631427 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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