Greyall Posted March 25, 2014 Share Posted March 25, 2014 Well, we know it has affected Mortarion, if he's willing to kill his men to get a Daemon. I'd indeed like to know what passes through his mind when he does that kind of thing. Also, I'm still curious about how Morty (and the other traitor Primarchs) react to Fulgrim's new look... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288563-another-reason-for-mortarions-turn/page/2/#findComment-3632882 Share on other sites More sharing options...
hopkins Posted March 25, 2014 Share Posted March 25, 2014 there's a significant time gap between scars and VS, anything can happen in the meantime morty could be played like magnus he ends up dabbling here and there then en route to terra could be his back-breaking moment Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288563-another-reason-for-mortarions-turn/page/2/#findComment-3632988 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperor's Furor Posted March 25, 2014 Author Share Posted March 25, 2014 It's possible the writer of VS didn't even consider Chris's portrayal of him in Scars and just gave him the generic necromancer zombie raiser character. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288563-another-reason-for-mortarions-turn/page/2/#findComment-3632996 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greyall Posted March 25, 2014 Share Posted March 25, 2014 Don't think so. Not that things can't slip by, but I'd say that kind of big transformations by one of the main characters would be a very big slip. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288563-another-reason-for-mortarions-turn/page/2/#findComment-3632997 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperor's Furor Posted March 25, 2014 Author Share Posted March 25, 2014 Well the Lion changed quite a bit between previous books and the Unremembered Empire. Curze changed between sadistic mad man to a guy who just wants to be killed in Vulkan lives back to sadistic mad man in Unremembered Empire. Angron went through several incarnations from mad man, to someone you could pity, back to mad man, back to pitied. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288563-another-reason-for-mortarions-turn/page/2/#findComment-3633003 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greyall Posted March 25, 2014 Share Posted March 25, 2014 Curze, Vulkan and Angron are/were all degenerating, but yes, there are some inconsistencies. They're worse in The Lion's case, you're right. Let's hope Mortarion doesn't get the same treatment. I was one of those who understood Jonson punching a Chaplain's head off, but some little more insight might've been helpful. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288563-another-reason-for-mortarions-turn/page/2/#findComment-3633009 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted March 25, 2014 Share Posted March 25, 2014 Don't think so. Not that things can't slip by, but I'd say that kind of big transformations by one of the main characters would be a very big slip. You're talking about Graham McNeil, who couldn't be bothered to double-check his OWN BOOKS about whether the Razing of Prospero happened before or after Isstvan V. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288563-another-reason-for-mortarions-turn/page/2/#findComment-3633074 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greyall Posted March 25, 2014 Share Posted March 25, 2014 Well, even if that happens, it shouldn't be that hard to fill in the gap with a plausible narrative. It's bound to happen, anyway, Mortarion's due for a descent, his complete fall won't just happen out of nowhere on his trip to Terra. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288563-another-reason-for-mortarions-turn/page/2/#findComment-3633099 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Relict Posted March 26, 2014 Share Posted March 26, 2014 That is how Chaos works, sure as sure. 1. "I am a soldier. I have nothing to do with Khorne." 2. "Okay, Khorne is the god of war, which does have something to do with what I do, but it doesn't count if I'm fighting against him." 3. "Well, if Khorne is the god of war, he must also be the god of martial honor. That's what I do, martial honor." 4. "BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD! SKULLS FOR THE SKULL THRONE! BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD! SKULLS FOR THE SKULL THRONE! BLOOD! SKULLS! BLOOD! SKULLS!" That's actually almost the exact downfall I have planned in my custom fluff for my personal company of World Eaters... See signature for details. Back on topic... I think it's nice that the BL writers are depicting the traitor primarchs degenerating during the course of the Heresy. No one goes from noble general of the Crusade to daemon prince overnight. Horus's plotting in the second half of False Gods, the elimination of the remembrancers, the "accidental" killing of his Imperial Army commander, finally leading up to "Let the galaxy burn!" Fulgrim's fall as depicted throughout the titular novel. Angron's character development in Betrayer, with the Butcher's Nails slowly bleaching his mind of all reason and leaving him with only pain and fury. His ascension is excellently depicted as Lorgar's attempt to save his brother's life. And now Mortarion, from crusading against witches before the Heresy to being willing to (at least somewhat) embrace the power of Chaos. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288563-another-reason-for-mortarions-turn/page/2/#findComment-3633461 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prodigal Son of Magnus Posted March 26, 2014 Share Posted March 26, 2014 Don't think so. Not that things can't slip by, but I'd say that kind of big transformations by one of the main characters would be a very big slip. You're talking about Graham McNeil, who couldn't be bothered to double-check his OWN BOOKS about whether the Razing of Prospero happened before or after Isstvan V. ^^this times ten. Graham is a good author but he really spits on established fluff. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288563-another-reason-for-mortarions-turn/page/2/#findComment-3633494 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostMalone Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 he was raised by a necromancer, an avid student/acolyte in his formative years and was a fearless leader/warrior of his zombie manifestation creations. once learning the truth about chaos and already turning traitor he'd be more then able to utilise nurgle to his advantage. im not really surprised, even though he realised his own race was enslaved he stood against witchcraft he never truly did care for humanity. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288563-another-reason-for-mortarions-turn/page/2/#findComment-3635469 Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveNYC Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 he was raised by a necromancer, an avid student/acolyte in his formative years and was a fearless leader/warrior of his zombie manifestation creations. once learning the truth about chaos and already turning traitor he'd be more then able to utilise nurgle to his advantage. im not really surprised, even though he realised his own race was enslaved he stood against witchcraft he never truly did care for humanity. He never seemed to care for the Emperor, but I don't see how you get to him never caring for humanity. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288563-another-reason-for-mortarions-turn/page/2/#findComment-3636152 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuskRaider Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 Yeah, Mortarion definitely cared about humanity. That was the main reason for him to rebel, he saw the Emperor as a tyrant. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288563-another-reason-for-mortarions-turn/page/2/#findComment-3636174 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperor's Furor Posted March 28, 2014 Author Share Posted March 28, 2014 He was annoyed at the Emperor in a similar fashion to Angron, the Emperor kind of stole his chance at killing his father. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288563-another-reason-for-mortarions-turn/page/2/#findComment-3636218 Share on other sites More sharing options...
marshal seanisi Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 Mortarions Heart drops clues about some of his decisions and continues his views on vehemently opposing any sort of witchcraft. It unfortunately fails to deliver any revelations on any of the clues. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288563-another-reason-for-mortarions-turn/page/2/#findComment-3636233 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greyall Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 Might he see daemons not as sorcery, but as simply beings from another dimension? It's far-fetched, but that information from Mortarion's Heart doesn't seem to compute, I thought by now he'd stop being a hypocrite and either convert or live with sorcery. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288563-another-reason-for-mortarions-turn/page/2/#findComment-3636297 Share on other sites More sharing options...
marshal seanisi Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 His disdain for sorcery/witchcraft is still very evident. It's almost as though after 10,000 years of being a Daemon, he still hasn't come to grips with his fate?. At least that's what I took from it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288563-another-reason-for-mortarions-turn/page/2/#findComment-3636359 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted March 29, 2014 Share Posted March 29, 2014 In Mortarion's Heart, doesn't he kill Gerotinian by sorcerously calling up a giant cloud of Magic Space Ebola? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288563-another-reason-for-mortarions-turn/page/2/#findComment-3636805 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conn Eremon Posted March 29, 2014 Share Posted March 29, 2014 Maybe his personal criteria for what constitutes sorcery doesn't include the gifts of Nurgle, for whatever reason. He would certainly have a lot of company if he adopted a "Oh, but what I do is different" stance Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288563-another-reason-for-mortarions-turn/page/2/#findComment-3636818 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoros Posted March 29, 2014 Share Posted March 29, 2014 Chaos: the ultimate force of hypocrisy. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288563-another-reason-for-mortarions-turn/page/2/#findComment-3636869 Share on other sites More sharing options...
marshal seanisi Posted March 29, 2014 Share Posted March 29, 2014 In Mortarion's Heart, doesn't he kill Gerotinian by sorcerously calling up a giant cloud of Magic Space Ebola? It was the slice across his throat that actually killed him. But the sorcery was what stunned him enough to allow Mortarion to almost decapitate him. He got enough of a cut to allow the poison to take hold tho. Ala Komodo Dragon style. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/288563-another-reason-for-mortarions-turn/page/2/#findComment-3637096 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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