Iron Warrior info from book 3?

[Tenebris]

Well, when working with iron you hit it until it takes the desired shape or it breaks. The Iron Warriors are that iron and the harder you hit them the better shape they take. I see it working for that legion, simple and effective. Also the threat of group sanction is way more convincing that a single execution. It all comes down to numbers, if detracting x numbers from the legion would make it more efficient in the future, than the equation is valid, if not that the equation was wrong. And when comes to Perturabo himself I think that he was used to see numbers everywhere rather than people, sons or astartes. If the numbers in the end proved true... than his point was valid and will be evermore valid. 

[Wade Garrett]

So, after Perturabo was such a HARD MAN MAKING HARD DECISIONS that he murdered a randomly chosen tenth of his Legion...

 

Then they conquered as much as the Luna Wolves! No...

 

Then they liberated as many worlds as the Ultramarines! Wait, that didn't happen either...

 

They earned as many battle honors as the Imperial Fists? They won as many victories as the Dark Angels? They were granted the right to wear the Palatine Aquila as recognition for their dedication like the Emperor's Children?

 

So, in essence Pert :cuss ed thousands of elite, EXPENSIVE transhuman soldiers in an act of wasteful idiocy that accomplished jack squat.

 

And the Emperor's response was to pat his whiney two year old on the head and tell all those meanies at court to leave Lil' Pert alone.

 

The question is starting to become, not "Why did the Traitor Primarchs rebel?" but "Why did sane Primarchs like Guilliman and Corax ever join this kingdom of madmen, idiots, and monsters?"

[Kol Saresk]

Sneaky sneaky, sir.... caught me while I was typing.

Perturbo decimation of his own legion confirms him a failure in my eyes. Suitably grim dark and stupid.

Not to claim he was meant to lead the Imperium, and I can agree that he and many other primarchs are failures.... but why stupid?

because use of a time-honored tradition of punishment equals stupid. Apparently.

Because use of a time-honored stupid punishment in which death is dispensed according to chance and not incompetence equals stupid. Most definitely.

And yet the Roman military is still looked at one of the top fighting forces in history. So whose dumber, the man who uses something proven to work, or the man who calls it stupid?

The use of decimation by the Roman military has been massively exaggerated it seems. It was only ever used a handful of times throughout Rome's entire history. Even when it was used it was seen as a barbaric ancient custom, and those commanders who used it were seen as incredibly old-fashioned.

Also, what effect does it actually have? It destroys morale and lowers the fighting strength of a unit.

A few times is all a disciplinary measure should need to be done. If it gets above a few then it means it didn't work.

This is the only recorded instance of Perturabo doing the decimation, correct? That's because it worked. Never again did Perturabo feel the need to punish his whole army.

[DarKnight]

I think each Primarch had a moment that either bonded or imprinted their will upon their Legion. It was savage, but we are discussing transhumans that depopulate entire planets. Perturabo let his sons know this is how I run things from here on out. I think they got the message.

[Tenebris]

As I have said, it worked, hence the calculation was valid. I think it was a practical application of his principles of logic. He needed to shape up his legion to prevent more incidents and he needed to do it quickly for the Great Crusade was not waiting for anyone, so he did it in his typical, blunt but effective way. If the Emperor validated this point by supporting him in front of the Senate, well it seems that the Emperor too has seen some sort of failing in the Iron Warriors and seconded the decision of Perturabo. Should Big E see it as a harmful measure, well he would stop it. As we well know the Emperor is not one to take half measures when came to his legions of space marines (Monarchia, lost primarchs, unleashing the Wolves...) all in all this decimation looks as a quite timid sanction compared to the others unleashed and sanctioned by the Emperor. I do not understand the fuss about this...

[DarKnight]

Sneaky sneaky, sir.... caught me while I was typing.

Perturbo decimation of his own legion confirms him a failure in my eyes. Suitably grim dark and stupid.

Not to claim he was meant to lead the Imperium, and I can agree that he and many other primarchs are failures.... but why stupid?

because use of a time-honored tradition of punishment equals stupid. Apparently.

Because use of a time-honored stupid punishment in which death is dispensed according to chance and not incompetence equals stupid. Most definitely.

And yet the Roman military is still looked at one of the top fighting forces in history. So whose dumber, the man who uses something proven to work, or the man who calls it stupid?

The use of decimation by the Roman military has been massively exaggerated it seems. It was only ever used a handful of times throughout Rome's entire history. Even when it was used it was seen as a barbaric ancient custom, and those commanders who used it were seen as incredibly old-fashioned.

Also, what effect does it actually have? It destroys morale and lowers the fighting strength of a unit.

I get your point, but 1. Legions don't really have to worry about manpower and 2. morale isn't really the first consideration in Astartes forces. You're talking about dudes that will literally climb over piles of their dead brothers to accomplish an objective.

It's a bit more developed than that Wade. I can't just copy paste it here he does it because he is setting the tone for his command the only way he knows how, and sending a message for what is to be expected and the price of failure. Perturabo is easily the smartest Primarch this side of Magnus, but his intellect and upbringing don't allow him to see things beyond problems to be deconstructed. Remember this is the guy who has warfare down to precise calculation. He gives Guilliman a run for his money on exactly how much men, machines, and material they need to set up a campaign and have it run like a clock.

Actually, yeh. Imagine war is a fine Swiss watch and Perturabo is the watch maker. He knows exactly what he needs, how to tune it, and then unleashes it. Any problems that come after are flaws in the parts, not the plan. The parts of course being human lives.

As for Dorn's flaw, it isn't that he can't express himself. When he does it's ground shattering. There is a mention of him berating lagging reinforcements into action when they start slowing down. His flaw is that he won't express himself. Horus would make a brother mad and make amends later. Dorn would make a brother mad and never mention it again. He is specifically noted for being passed over as Warmaster because he refused to try and make amends or compromise. He didn't ever explain himself either, and took challenges as insults.

re: Perturabo One of the best Primarch breakdowns I've ever read.

[Greyall]

In the end, a Primarch is what he becomes. Horus was all his brothers were and more, if all Imperial lore is to be believed, and yet he gave in to Chaotic whispers and so we have a century-old, superpowerful general who decides on the fate of billions...having daddy issues right when is father relies on him the most.

 

Perturabo is arguably as good a strategist as the best among the Primarchs, likely better than Dorn, but his lack of warmth hinders him. Where the Fists fight till the end out of courage, the Irons do so either on the defensive or out of rage. Likewise, Perty is either impassible and ever-calculating (which makes him inflexible) or prone to rages (I wonder what did he accomplish by double-punching Berossus into a Dreadnought Chassis).

 

It did not work, since the justification to have his men beat to a pulp by their own brothers was that they weren't the best. They certainly didn't become so (and in this case it's easy to measure that, if Perturabo deals in numbers, then to be best they'd have to have the most worlds conquered). Moreover, he himself never truly succeeded where he should have: how to deal with the endless trenchfaring. He brooded and sullied...you go, master calculator.

[Karthak]

I see a thread about the Alpha Legion. I see a thread about the Fists. But where are delicious spoilers about the Sons of Olympia? Especially loyalists. Give it to ussss...

[Dosjetka]

Aye, I'm curious to hear about loyalist Iron Warriors too

[Iron-Daemon Forge]

Same here, really interested to find out the background on the Iron Warriors & background on Iron Havocs & Golg.

Can not wait to get the FW Heresy book when it up for order.  Pretty much looking forward to the art work & background, try convert some models for my Chaos era Iron Warriors base on these Heresy units.

 

IP

[BassWave]

Well word on the street is that Iron Warriors sired the Marines Malevolent. I wonder what Heathens felt when he read that.

[SteelPaladin]

Whoa, more info please!

[hopkins]

here's a copy and paste of the crunch

 

Iron Warriors

Legiones Astartes - may always attempt to regroup

Wrack and ruin - do not suffer morale tests from shooting attacks, may re-roll failed pinning tests, and all grenade and melta bomb attacks have the wrecker special rule

The bitter end- controlling player may opt to play full 6 turns regardless instead having to roll

 

 

Perturabo

Special rules:

Primarch (as the others)

Sire of the Iron Warriors

Relentless strategist

Precision bombardment

Very bulk

Sire of the Iron Warriors - All Iron Warriors in the same army as Perturabo gain the stubborn USR

Relentless strategist -May start rolling for reserves on turn 1

Precision bombardment - Once per game may call down a bombardment

(May draw line of sight from himself or any friendly model with a nuncio - vox)

Range - unlimited - Str 9 AP 2 ordnance D3, barrage large blast (5") twin-linked

The logos - 2+ armor save, all cc attacks AP 2, immunity to concussive and blind, teleport homer, cortex controller, nuncio -vox, cognis signum

Perturabo and all iron warrior terminators gain deep strike.

Wrist cannon

Range- 24" Str 6 AP 3 assault 3, twin linked, rending.

[Forgebreaker - after Ferrus Manus' death, is granted the hammer by Horus. + Extra points to equip]

Forgebreaker - range - Str x2 AP 1 melee, concussive, strikedown, unwieldy, blind

 

 

Erasmus Golg

Special rules:

Independent character

Harsh taskmaster

Legiones astartes (Iron Warriors)

Brutal charge

Terminator attack

Master of the legion

Warlord

 

Kyr Vhalen

Special rules:

Legiones astartes (Iron Warriors)

Independent character

Feel no pain (6+)

Warsmith

Master of the legion

Shatter assault

Master of fortifications

Jealous command

Warlord

 

Tyrant siege terminator squad (elites )

Special rules:

Legiones astartes - Iron Warriors

Wrecker (applied to all of their attacks, shooting or otherwise)

 

Dedicated transport

Proteus or phobos if 5 or less, spartan if above 5

 

Iron havoc support squad (Heavy Support)

Special rules:

Legiones astartes - Iron Warriors

Hardened armor

Tank hunters

Deadly aim

[FunkyMonkey]

Maybe the reason why Perturabo is always said to be pissed off with Imperium command is because he wanted his army to be conquering world after world like the Sons of Horus or Dark Angels or Ultramarines, yet all he does is get stuck with the siege work.  It kind of sucks when you decimate your legion thinking that now they will be the most badass guys to conquer the stars and instead be always assigned the grinding siege work that no one else wants.

 

I think it was touched upon that part of Perturabo's character was based on blind loyalty.  He expected it from his Iron Warriors, and he, up until his betrayal, had it for Imperial military command, no matter how much it pissed him off, which is why he always accepted siege and garrison duty that he seems to hate.

[HaSY]

=] DELETED [=

Let me know if this is allowed?

[HaSY]

Perturabo is the brutal taskmaster. To him, decimation is a purge of weakness and he dont really care whether you are good or not; once chosen, you perish.
Iron sharpen iron...

Iron Warriors is more brutal than Iron Hands it seems...

Instead of decimation, why not decimate and see who becomes dreadnought...more contemptors

Perturabo is a good strategist yet cold and calculating like his brother, Lion... 

[DarKnight]

Maybe the reason why Perturabo is always said to be pissed off with Imperium command is because he wanted his army to be conquering world after world like the Sons of Horus or Dark Angels or Ultramarines, yet all he does is get stuck with the siege work.  It kind of sucks when you decimate your legion thinking that now they will be the most badass guys to conquer the stars and instead be always assigned the grinding siege work that no one else wants.

 

I think it was touched upon that part of Perturabo's character was based on blind loyalty.  He expected it from his Iron Warriors, and he, up until his betrayal, had it for Imperial military command, no matter how much it pissed him off, which is why he always accepted siege and garrison duty that he seems to hate.

This is for the guys that poo poo'ed his record of compliances I guess, the other Primarchs may have been more apt to ignore or delay in assist with Imperial efforts and maintain their autonomy while the IV Legion was stuck cracking open hard nuts.

[Marshal Rohr]

It's strongly suggested Horus sent him through a gauntlet of suck after he became Warmaster, and played it off as the Emperor. Likely because he wanted Perturabo to turn.

 

To me the thing I like most about him is that he gets thrown into one suck fest after another and wins, only to get thrown into a new one and he just keeps on trucking. That's takes character.

[Wade Garrett]

As I have said, it worked, hence the calculation was valid.

 

BECOMING THE BEST PRIMARCH EVER IN THREE EASY STEPS

 

by Perturabo, Iron Lord of Olympia

 

1. Kill ten percent of your Legion in a temper tantrum because they had the audacity not to be the best of the best.

 

2. Realize your Legion still lags behind the Ultramarines, Sons of Horus, Dark Angels, Space Wolves, Imperial Fists, and Emperor's Children, none of whom ever randomly killed a tenth of their own members.

 

3. Declare glorious success, whine because no one appreciates how awesome you are.

[Sevatar]

It would be great if you could enlarge them somehow

[Brother Vidius]

The background for Kyr Vahlen is exactly the way I saw the Iron Warriors. Grand companies that have been completely forgotten about by the Primarch!

 

Really looking forward to the book!

[HaSY]

haha sadly it is not mine though

[Larkyn]

Well, the Alpha Legion thread has several pages of Perturabo info, so maybe we can move those posts over here?

[DarKnight]

Is Perturabo's Iron Circle from Angel's Exterminatus represented at all? I feel like they'd be awesome units/models.

[Brother Captain Lucian]

Not in this book sadly.

 

But Perty himself looks to be kick-ass.