Reasons why you should take AdMech for allies.

[depthcharge12]

Hello gentlemen and occasional lady,

 

I decided I wanted to make a thread based on why you should take Mechanicus units in your detachment (other than fluff, or you can add fluff after) due to the proliferation of new legion rules. Feel free to discuss and add your own thoughts :)

 

 

1.) Magos Dominus- this guy is a cheap buy in for an HQ detachment and comes base with a power weapon and stubborn. He is rediculously customizable to make him more powerful or shooty if you have the points. Stick him in a blob of tech thralls with a conversion Beamer on a backfield objective and let him rip.

 

 

2.) Troops, subdivided here:

 

(A) Tech Thralls. Wow these guys are cheap as well to buy in for the mandatory troop choice when you are specifically taking AdMech like me for things like the Thanatar siege automata. The Thralls can be given an upgrade to become fearless too, and if you buy 10 more cheap guys, they will sit in the back on an objective like no ones business. They also have a 6+ FNP which is a bit of a lip service, but can be handy once and a while, or even be upgraded to a 5+.

 

Use them as a big fearless, scoring blob on an objective that you can use as ablative wounds for your Conversion Beamer Magos.

 

 

(B Thallax - A bit more pricey, but very good at what you want them to specialize in, I personally need more anti tank in my list, which is what these guys will do quite well. They are jet pack infantry and function much like hated Tau battle suits. I would throw on a multi melta or a photon cannon if I have the points in conjunction with the Destructor upgrade and it's possible to penetrate Spartan tanks on their sides, which these guys are mobile enough to do :)

 

One of the other biggest draws for me for this unit is their djinn sight rule. The ability to strip -2 off of anyone's cover save and prevent infiltrators from setting up within 24" of them is fantastic. This rule completely messes with Alpha Legion and Night Lord players who use infiltrate to get close and also the good cover saves the NL player might get from using night fight.

 

 

© Castellax - These robots are tough as nails and seem to be designed for squishing big 20 man tactical squads. For about the same price as a 20 man squad, you can get three of these T7 monstrous creatures with BS 4 AP 3 3 shot pinning bolter cannons. What's not to like? They are also upgradable and are scoring, but don't count towards your mandatory troop slot. They also need a Magos nearby to babysit them or else they will revert back to basic protocols.

 

If somehow the marines can get through T7 4 wound 3+ save Castellex in close combat, they might even blow up in their face with the reactor core explosion.

 

 

*note: due to reasons of sanity and time I have only selected a few other units that caught my eye*

 

 

3.) Heavy support:

 

(A) Myrmidon Destructors - while cheap at first, they begin to get pricier after needing to buy a certain heavy weapon. However, these creepy dudes are customizable to your whims and are incredibly tough with T5 3+/5++ 2W. Not to be overlooked is BS5 and PREFERRED ENEMY: EVERYTHING.

 

So you have now a heavy weapons team that is tough and relentless and have 2+ rerollable against whatever they shoot at. Yummy. Use them to blast anything and everything.

 

Oh...and dem models ;)

 

 

(b Krios battle tank squadron - for about the same points these guys function just like the predator executioner with its main weapon function. However it gets rending and shred for its large blast for losing the three small blasts and AP2 of the predator.

 

If you are worried about losing your main weapon to an incoming shot, you can purchase a set of volkite sentinels which function separately from the tank itself :) not to mention the fact that this thing has the same armor rating as a predator but has a flare shield, can regenerate hull points, is fast, and can reroll failed dangerous terrain tests.

 

Also can upgrade for the pulsar fusil, which is a lascannon on steroids. Ordinance 4 shots baby.

 

Bargain is that you can get these in a squad when limited to the one slot allocated for allies.

 

 

© Thanatar class siege automata - HOOO BOY. These beautiful models are the reason why I wanted to take AdMech as allies. Not to mention the fact that their weapon is XBOX HUGE PLASMA CANNON. While they cost about the price of a Land Raider, they are just as sturdy. T8 with 4W and 2+SV and 5+ Inv is nothing to laugh about. With an improved plasma weapon that also forces successful cover saves to be rerolled with added effect of being a barrage weapon (guided in by your nuncio voxes).

 

They can also squad up...but unless you are rich and/or crazy you will likely take only one. Also, bubble wrap them with your thrall squad that has the Magos in it so he can give it orders.

 

 

4.) Fluff. Yup. Take this stuff for that and Rule Of Cool. That's why we play the game no?

 

Even if you take some crazy stuff like the Thanatar, make a reason why you've got it in your army.

 

My reason is that being part of my first legion XVth Cataphracts, they needed mobile heavy support to shellack an advancing monolithic enemy while the nimble Cataphracts ran circles around them and did glorious cavalry flank charges from their metal steeds.

 

Seeing as how the Dark Angels used lots of jetbikes, tanks, and other older esoteric weaponry, they looked to their erstwhile allies of the mechanicum who had also set out on the great crusade with them in its earliest years.

 

The Magos with his thrall bodyguard provide over watch and command the Thanatar while strike squads of Thallax are quick enough to keep advance with my mobile Dark Angels.

 

 

What other reasons do you guys see yourself using the AdMech as allies?

[hisdudeness]

NO.  30k is a setting of fluff, not minmaxing.  It is not a setting of finding the most OP allies combo. 

[depthcharge12]

Lol I guess it came across as that didn't it. It was more of filling a role for those who are creating lists to play with.

 

We are fluffy yes? But we also play to win and have a good time. I have yet to meet a person on this planet who doesn't play a game to try and at least win. This was just done for identifying good units to use, not to abuse. Haha I didn't even go through some of the other good units either like the Usharax.

[Moonstalker]

NO.  30k is a setting of fluff, not minmaxing.  It is not a setting of finding the most OP allies combo. 

 

That's what it is to you.  I don't see any rules here saying, "Discussion of crunchy math is allowed on this board, but not in the 30k section."  This game is different things to different people.

[hisdudeness]

Yet all the roles are (will be by the end of the series) filled in the marine legion list.   There is nothing to fill.

 

I'm not against having allies or even using AdMech as allies, but the fluff needs to be addressed first...not last.  Otherwise it is shoehorning an ally for the sole purpose of making it more powerful on the table then coming up with a weak 'reason' they fit together. 

 

As soon as AdMech was included (which is not a bad thing) I knew there were going to be people cherry picking their units. 

 

 

 

That is what it is to me and the staff behind it.  30k is about the narrative, not the power of the list.

[Molokai]

What's the point of having in depth rules if we can't analyze, discuss and use them? If you're interested solely in fluff that's fine but don't bring negativity into a constructive thread.

[Moonstalker]

Yet all the roles are (will be by the end of the series) filled in the marine legion list.   There is nothing to fill.

 

I'm not against having allies or even using AdMech as allies, but the fluff needs to be addressed first...not last.  Otherwise it is shoehorning an ally for the sole purpose of making it more powerful on the table then coming up with a weak 'reason' they fit together. 

 

As soon as AdMech was included (which is not a bad thing) I knew there were going to be people cherry picking their units. 

 

 

 

That is what it is to me and the staff behind it.  30k is about the narrative, not the power of the list.

 

If you don't agree, that's fine.  But don't just try to shut down the discussion for the people who want to minmax their list via allies.  They have just as much right to their playstyle and their discussions on this board as any of the people engaging in the fluff/history discussions going on that have nothing to do with rules.  The forum is for both.

[depthcharge12]

Don't jump the gun too much on me here HD, I wasn't trying to make WAAC lists but merely trying to address strategy. I think it's facetious to think this is all about that, after all we have threads about different legion tactica. This isn't trying to beat anyone over the head and say use this or else.

 

 

I'm fluff first and foremost, but there shouldn't be a reason why I can't take cool units that match the fluff in addition :) this hobby includes many things, and one of them that appeals to me is strategy on the table top.

 

Trust me HD, if there's any WAACing going on here I'll be the first to grab my torch and pitchfork.

[hisdudeness]

I have no issues discussing tactics, but I don't think you have really looked at AdMech that closely. They are the easiest army to abuse in 30k. I'm also not shutting down the discussion...I'm not Admin so can't do it.

 

AdMech can spam more firepower on high T units then any one. And that is what I predict this thread will become. "How do I shoehorn three 5 model units (all carring lance weapons with a massive range) in to my night lord or Raven Guard force?" When the question should first be, "Would AdMech commonly fight beside a Night Lord/Raven Guard force?"

[depthcharge12]

Why wouldn't the AdMech fight with the Dark Angels? Technically according to the allies chart they are trusted allies (not that that's been abused before).

 

The Dark Angels were the first Legion made. Considering that they had done and seen things the other legions never would and tested a good deal of archeotech weaponry in conjunction with the AdMech, they should be on good terms with them. They piloted a good deal of the AdMechs power armor and weapon systems before the other legions were still being made.

 

 

Let us also consider that the Dark Angels upon Caliban requires a large Mechanicum presence to terraform their planet and research a good deal of their left over dark age technology. So why wouldn't a contingent carry on with the crusading elements in search of more STCs or testing new weaponry?

 

 

 

And if the AdMech lists themselves are so OP at the moment, why can't I dumb it down with a little Legion list?

 

 

Please HisDudeness, let's just go our separate ways on this and trust me that I was looking from a strategy standpoint and not, how can I abuse this standpoint. If it gets to that point, call me out on it.

[Excessus]

5) BECAUSE THEY ARE AWESOME!!! :D

[Hyaenidae]

Speaking for myself, I am a fluff nut. I will not use anything that I cannot create a story around, or weave into. I am also not a fan of mathhammer. But, my opinions are just that. Opinions, of a personal nature. Just like everyone else. Kitwulfen said it best:

 

This game is different things to different people.

 

So let's keep that in mind. If you like fluff, there are tons of threads focusing on fluff. If you like maxing out your army for gameplay, there are threads for that too, including this one. Different boats, peeps.

 

Now, please carry on with the theorizing. The AdMech interests me, and it is fascinating to see some of the combos that come from people's brains, as I just don't think like that when I'm imagining my army.

 

Personally, I'd like to have a Forgelord in Termie armour and cortex controller, surrounded by a Castellax bodyguard, loaded into a Spartan. Any ideas on how to make them lethal?

[Vazzy]

I have no issues discussing tactics, but I don't think you have really looked at AdMech that closely. They are the easiest army to abuse in 30k. I'm also not shutting down the discussion...I'm not Admin so can't do it.

 

AdMech can spam more firepower on high T units then any one. And that is what I predict this thread will become. "How do I shoehorn three 5 model units (all carring lance weapons with a massive range) in to my night lord or Raven Guard force?" When the question should first be, "Would AdMech commonly fight beside a Night Lord/Raven Guard force?"

That's funny. I know a guy who plans to do this....

[Kol Saresk]

The only reason I ever need: Castellax.

[GhostMalone]

I like the idea of my forge lord surrounded by admech thallanx that he treats as brothers with honour markings etc.

 

Man and machine united in brotherhood

[Hyaenidae]

I just love the idea of the Mauler bolters, and i'll (painfully) admit that the Iron Circle in Angel Exterminatus was pretty dang cool.

 

Forgelords and Warsmiths emulating their father with the same tactic sounds righteous to me.  :)

[BassWave]

I play the X. I'm corporately obligated to bring Admech allies :p Best part is I have the ability to include them in my normal FOC.

 

My plan is to have an Admech force and a couple of knights that are attached to a Titan legion. This would allow me to go with other colors other than red and have a cohesive looking force with any titans I build in the very distant future.

 

I'm interested in how well thallax do with heavy chainswords in CC, as I want a unit that can keep up with my knight so it never goes in CC alone as it can get bogged down easily. That and the possibilities for conversions for said thallax would be badass.

[GhostMalone]

Exactly ;)

 

I think the occasional squad is fine.

Even a tech priest magos in charge of ensuring calculations for phosphex munitions are accurate with his legionary counterparts works.

 

Add castlellian bodyguards and there's your artillery support

[Nakuth]

Personally, I'd like to have a Forgelord in Termie armour and cortex controller, surrounded by a Castellax bodyguard, loaded into a Spartan. Any ideas on how to make them lethal?

 

Purely speculation, but I'd say keep it cheap & plentiful. Go with the default mauler pattern bolters, as they are nasty. Spinkle some flamers & power blades to taste. Maybe give the forgelord a thunder hammer/chainfist & volkite charger. Team that up with a Tyrant siege termi squad or 'assault' termi squad in a second Spartan and scare the progenoids out of your oponant.

 

If as you're doing Iron Warriors, maybe add a couple of Medusas & one or two Thanatar automata to keep your enemy ducking. For troops? sprinkle breacher & tax support squads to taste. Fluffy AND brutal.

 

I just wish that you could fit Thallaxi and/or Castellax in a Caestus.....

[Moonstalker]

 

1000heathens, on 01 Apr 2014 - 23:56, said:

Personally, I'd like to have a Forgelord in Termie armour and cortex controller, surrounded by a Castellax bodyguard, loaded into a Spartan. Any ideas on how to make them lethal?

 

Can't.  Page 78 BRB.  Transports can only carry infantry units.  Not big blobs of Monstrous Creatures led by angry terminators.

[Hyaenidae]

Derp. Alright, skip the Spartan then... I'll wait until a Gorgon like vehicle comes out for 30k.

 

Mauler Bolters, power blades, sprinkle flamers. Sounds good.

[ephrael]

I'm slowly building a Mechanicus force purely because I like the look of the models and because some of the guys at my club built a Titan Manufactorum table to play on.  The idea of having two opposing armies fighting over this specific terrain plus the look of the Castellax mini got me hooked.  The pictures of the new FW Knight Lancer sealed the deal for me.  I haven't been this excited to paint and possibly play a game in a very long time.  The fluff and looks are the only reason I'm using them.

[Moonstalker]

Derp. Alright, skip the Spartan then... I'll wait until a Gorgon like vehicle comes out for 30k.

 

Mauler Bolters, power blades, sprinkle flamers. Sounds good.

 

Take a Gorgon.  Per book 2, you can take any imperial superheavy tank you want as your Lord of War, and even pay a few points to give it a space marine crew.

[Ouroboros13]

Hello gentlemen and occasional lady,

I decided I wanted to make a thread based on why you should take Mechanicus units in your detachment (other than fluff, or you can add fluff after) due to the proliferation of new legion rules. Feel free to discuss and add your own thoughts

1.) Magos Dominus- this guy is a cheap buy in for an HQ detachment and comes base with a power weapon and stubborn. He is rediculously customizable to make him more powerful or shooty if you have the points. Stick him in a blob of tech thralls with a conversion Beamer on a backfield objective and let him rip.

The Magos Dominus is not an Independent Character. He walks about solo and can't join units. You can get a (more expensive) Magos Prime if you'd like a IC.

[Iron Hands Fanatic]

Derp. Alright, skip the Spartan then... I'll wait until a Gorgon like vehicle comes out for 30k.

 

Mauler Bolters, power blades, sprinkle flamers. Sounds good.

 

.....Mastodon anyone? :P

 

To be honest, in terms of fluff, AdMech allies are justifiable with all Legions - evidence from the BL books series points to all major expeditionary fleets having Mechanicum components - because all Legiones Astartes forces are themselves part of larger Expeditionary fleets, you'll probably have a number of attached forces, whether these are the Legion's own Auxiliaries or not.

 

Plus, Extermination details the Iron Warrior's own cadre which designs & constructs its own cybernetica - there's even a profile showing a Castellax from the IV Legion's own reserve in Iron Warriors colours. Although, admittedly Legions having their own Cybernetica might be limited to the IV & X (the latter is also noted as having large numbers of servitor support units).

 

Also, the opportunity to give Myrmidon Destructors the sweet-sounding Graviton Imploder seems too awesome to pass up.