Fallen Angels (help!)

[Badaboom]

  Hi Brothers!

 

  I wonder which heraldry and mark of armour should be more fitting for a renegade of the Fallen. Also, for one of them who has not fully embraced Chaos, which level of "chaosyness" do you think would be proper? Skulls, spikes here and there, perhaps parts of salvaged armour from other legions?

[deathspectersgt7]

I would go with MKIV with a pad with one of the Knight orders/skulls.

[Phoros]

MkII always seemed appropriate for Fallen, to me - ties in with the knightly aspect of the DAs, and makes sense with them as having been abandoned and unsupplied on Caliban.

[Badaboom]

Thanks!

 

Also, any reference for their heraldry and rank markings?

[SFH]

In Unremembered Empire Guilliman notes that the Dar Angels heraldry doesn't always conform to what's listed in the Pricipia Bellicosa, if that helps. We'd probably need the FW book for the Dark Angels, and who knows when that is coming out.

[Phoros]

In Unremembered Empire Guilliman notes that the Dar Angels heraldry doesn't always conform to what's listed in the Pricipia Bellicosa, if that helps. We'd probably need the FW book for the Dark Angels, and who knows when that is coming out.

Around this time next year, if FW's schedule holds up.

[Conn Eremon]

Aren't they after Extermination? I seem to recall people who went to the Weekender saying that Prospero got pushed back, and the Blood Angels/Dark Angels pushed up and tentatively scheduled for Christmas.

[Phoros]

Really? Huh. Okay then.

[Conn Eremon]

Something about the rules for the Wolves and Sons being a bit more problematic to produce or something like that.

[Saphrael]

Yeah word on the street was that Prospero was being pushed back. I don't think it was because the rules specifically, but because they weren't far enough along  in the design process (i.e. hadn't finished all the required research and concepts) and that the sculpts weren't going to be done. This makes sense becaues Prospero will not only have 2 of the most divergent legions in terms of models, it also has the Sisters of Silence and Custodes.

 

I don't think we know if the DA/BA/Daemons book will be next as well. I asked in another thread and go no response, so I'd be careful assuming Signus/Sarum is next. It could just as easily be Calth. We also don't know that Prospero was bumped to last in the trilogy, so us DA fans could be very unlucky and the order could be: Calth, Prospero, Signus/Sarum.

 

Anyone in the know able to confirm?

[Marshal Rohr]

Personally I think the artwork more closely resembles legion specific mark 4 pattern, with the special helmet style but that is just my 2 cents.

[Kol Saresk]

Aren't they after Extermination? I seem to recall people who went to the Weekender saying that Prospero got pushed back, and the Blood Angels/Dark Angels pushed up and tentatively scheduled for Christmas.

Do what? NOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

 

Actually, I think a lot of it has to do with the numbers bit that's cropping up due to the early efforts of BL's books being less organized than they are now.

[Saphrael]

Actually, I think a lot of it has to do with the numbers bit that's cropping up due to the early efforts of BL's books being less organized than they are now.

I know these words are English, but I have no idea what you're saying...

[Kol Saresk]

Actually, I think a lot of it has to do with the numbers bit that's cropping up due to the early efforts of BL's books being less organized than they are now.

I know these words are English, but I have no idea what you're saying...

Prime example. In the olden days, Legions were ten thousand strong. From Horus Rising to the First Heretic, the Legions revolved around ten thousand. From the First Heretic to now, the numbers have been retconned to revolve around 100,000.

A Thousand Sons is a book and an audio drama that both narrate the Thousand Sons as the smallest Legion at 10,000. This was before the shift in numbers. So, if Forgeworld wants to do the Razing of Prospero, they have to make one of a few choices.

1.) The Thousand Sons are minuscule compared to even the Salamanders, who are said to be one of the small Legions at 89,000.

2.) There were only ten thousand traveling with Magnus and a much greater number was elsewhere in the Crusade.

3.) Make the number bigger.

[Conn Eremon]

4.) Introduce an event that greatly crippled their numbers. Might conflict with A Thousand Sons, but still an option.

[Saphrael]

Ah, I see what you were talking about now. I don't get why the inconsistencies you describe would cause a delay in a book though. Surely that's just a quick discussion around the design table about what they want the numbers to be and why.

 

Rejigging the schedule for book release is going to result in re-prioritisation of work and potentially generate rework for the lists and writing, I can't see them going through all that just because they can't decide how many zeroes there should be in the Thousand Sons numbers.

[Dragonkin Arenis]

Back on topic...

 

As far as armour goes, assume that the Fallen Angels received some suits of "modern" armour as well, considering that they were stationed on Caliban, which is the Legion's recruitment world. In the later stages of the Crusade, Mk.IV may have been more common among the Lion's half of the Legion, but Luther's half will have received/owned some as well.

As far as modelling is concerned, you make the decisions why your force is armoured in what they own. But personally, a mix of Mk.II and Mk.III (with some of the Iron Hands heads mixed in for flavour and a few more "knightly" modifications to the bland helmets) would suit the Fallen perfectly, as well as mixing in some robed legs and bodies from the upgrade kit. But like I said, more senior members (or alternatively, the new boys) would probably be issued Mk.IV warplate, or at least pieces of it.

 

Heraldry-wise, I suggest you look at the covers of 'Fallen Angels' and 'Descent of Angels', and the 40K Dark Angels' Company heraldry is also a good suggestion to follow. It look like the basic rule is lots of "Goffs-style" chequers, chevrons and other heraldry stripes, etc. Cream seems to be popular for the chequers, and red for chevrons.

 

Oh, and swords. And wings.

 

And the topic of "what is too 'Chaos' and what isn't?" A good method to show this is scavenged/mixed armour plate, molecular bonding studs (Mk.V/VI!) and unusual armour plates, such as helmets, chestplates, shoulders, etc. This means you can mix in any Chaos or Imperial torsos you have lying around and claim it comes under "Mk.V" power Armour, because there's no set idea of what Mk.V looks like - it could be anything at all!

Skulls, chains, etc. just aren't the Fallen's style.

[TheForgottenAngel]

Heraldry for the Dark Angels is very vast. You had all the knight orders before The Order assimilated then all (or destroyed the ones opposed). Once a member of The Order, former knightly orders abandoned their old heraldry for the winged sword of the order.

 

Many Calibanite Dark Angels wore green on shoulder pads, knee pads etc. Also the Calibanite eagle was a prominent icon/omen. Swords, chevron, unit insignia (some turned into successor chapter icons) were worn as well.

 

Dark Angels can be customized heavily due to their long service during the unification and crusader, icons from those would be common on veterans.

 

Also any armor marks are suitable due to the First Legion being a testing ground for weapons and equipment and also their long service history.

 

Know that many Fallen were augmented humans, not astartes. They were small I'm numbers but many of the knights of the order were too old to become a full astartes. As a result many died during augmentation. This also caused rifts between the young knights and their elders in The Order due to the physical differences in ability.

 

If you have questions please ask. Fluff for the Dark Angels is in early development.

[deathspectersgt7]

Skulls fit in Style anytime any where.

[Greyall]

Maybe these fall a bit into the Chaosy side of the spectrum but I find that, once removed the topknot and spikes, and painted accordingly, the Sons of Horus heads make for good 'rogue knights'

 

http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Images/Product/DefaultFW/xlarge/soh-heads.jpg

 

Especially the first variant

 

 

Likewise, the torsos, especially the central and last variant:

 

http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Images/Product/DefaultFW/xlarge/soh-torsos.jpg

[Badaboom]

Actually, I do ask because I´m going to illustrate one of them, not a model, but most of the tips are still pretty useful. I do wonder about the Calibanite Knightly Orders and their heraldry, as well as how the Calibanite Eagle differs from the Imperial Eagle. Does anyone have an example for that?

[Greyall]

Holy crap, mate, sorry, I didn't notice your name the first time I commented. Looking forward to that artwork - much definitely :)

[TheForgottenAngel]

If you look at the disciples of caliban that is one example. Others are Knights Lupus (chaosy order that was annihilated by The Order). Anything that references the great beasts of Caliban are good to go.

[depthcharge12]

@Weber

 

So would certain orders that were wiped out have any marines that might have been relegated to the destroyer company by Johnson? I know he kept Cypher around (as an example) but could he put some of the dishonored knights into the destroyer cadre?

[TheForgottenAngel]

Cypher was the lore keeper, he abandoned his name after he was appointed the position. You could do the destroyers as members of previous members of other knight orders who were not trusted members of the order. A more likely case was that they were terrans who were already trained as destroyers.