alpha legion the strongest

[PassionFruit Power]

are alpha legion the strongest, they defeated ultramarines on their homeland even though the ultra's attacked the when they were unprepared. during siege of terra the alpha legion stoped the space wolfs getting there. are alpha legion the strongest

[Conn Eremon]

Nope.

[Wade Garrett]

Is Alpha Legion strong Legion?

 

HA! I LAUGH AT YOU, MAN OF FRUIT POWER!

 

Alpha Legion Primarch is little Primarch. No lift Titan like press of military. Angron lift Titan! Angron laugh at little Alpha Primarch! ANGRON STRONG PRIMARCH!

 

Eaters of Worlds laugh at Alpha Legion. Alpha Legion fight with weapon, with chainsword and bolter.

 

XII Legion no need weapon! Captain Khârn take shield of Ultramarine with bare hands and punch in fat mouth! Sergeant Tagore break Custodian armor with bare hand and pull out spine! WORLD EATER KILLS WHAT HE SAY HE KILLS!

 

World Eaters no need weapon. World Eaters IS WEAPON! World Eaters strong Legion with STRONG Primarch! Laugh at little Legion with little Primarch say they strong!

[Balthamal]

are alpha legion the strongest, they defeated ultramarines on their homeland even though the ultra's attacked the when they were unprepared. during siege of terra the alpha legion stoped the space wolfs getting there. are alpha legion the strongest

 

Take yourself outside and have a quiet word about such a ridiculous statement

[helterskelter]

Hulk smash *obligatory lou ferigno flexing pose*

[Týr]

To sum this thread up:

 

http://img.pandawhale.com/38211-Troll-gif-JXuw.gif

[Phoros]

Is Alpha Legion strong Legion?

 

HA! I LAUGH AT YOU, MAN OF FRUIT POWER!

 

Alpha Legion Primarch is little Primarch. No lift Titan like press of military. Angron lift Titan! Angron laugh at little Alpha Primarch! ANGRON STRONG PRIMARCH!

 

Eaters of Worlds laugh at Alpha Legion. Alpha Legion fight with weapon, with chainsword and bolter.

 

XII Legion no need weapon! Captain Khârn take shield of Ultramarine with bare hands and punch in fat mouth! Sergeant Tagore break Custodian armor with bare hand and pull out spine! WORLD EATER KILLS WHAT HE SAY HE KILLS!

 

World Eaters no need weapon. World Eaters IS WEAPON! World Eaters strong Legion with STRONG Primarch! Laugh at little Legion with little Primarch say they strong!

 

It's... it's beautiful.

World Eaters confirmed to all be the Heavy Weapons Guy.

[The_son_of_Dorn]

Problem with Alpha legion is their strength is their weakness, when sabotage and false impressions are your specialty, you would have to start wondering, even though you share a body.......would a hydra eat one of its own heads......................

[Vesper]

Is Alpha Legion strong Legion?

 

HA! I LAUGH AT YOU, MAN OF FRUIT POWER!

 

Alpha Legion Primarch is little Primarch. No lift Titan like press of military. Angron lift Titan! Angron laugh at little Alpha Primarch! ANGRON STRONG PRIMARCH!

 

Eaters of Worlds laugh at Alpha Legion. Alpha Legion fight with weapon, with chainsword and bolter.

 

XII Legion no need weapon! Captain Khârn take shield of Ultramarine with bare hands and punch in fat mouth! Sergeant Tagore break Custodian armor with bare hand and pull out spine! WORLD EATER KILLS WHAT HE SAY HE KILLS!

 

World Eaters no need weapon. World Eaters IS WEAPON! World Eaters strong Legion with STRONG Primarch! Laugh at little Legion with little Primarch say they strong!

 

I laughed because I'm a bad man.

 

[Kol Saresk]

are alpha legion the strongest, they defeated ultramarines on their homeland even though the ultra's attacked the when they were unprepared. during siege of terra the alpha legion stoped the space wolfs getting there. are alpha legion the strongest

No. Stalling a Legion isn't that great. After all, the Night Lords spent three years stalling the Dark Angels and the worst they ever got was one-fifth of the fleet at Sheol confirmed to have been destroyed. There were worse casualty rates at Istvaan III and Calth.

 

The reality is, no one Legion is the strongest. Each one has its own checks and balances that makes it equal to another.

[Kais Klip]

Kol’s word is solid, although I would add to his point that as all the legions are so similar to one another in the overall sum of strengths and weaknesses, the only differentiating factor left is that of Astartes numbers. Therefore to my mind, the biggest legion be the strongest. 

[DuskRaider]

The strongest Legions were the II and XI Legions... they were so powerful, the Emperor had to destroy them.

[Kol Saresk]

Kais Klip, on 10 Apr 2014 - 12:22, said:

Kol’s word is solid, although I would add to his point that as all the legions are so similar to one another in the overall sum of strengths and weaknesses, the only differentiating factor left is that of Astartes numbers. Therefore to my mind, the biggest legion be the strongest.

Calth. And the Shadow Crusade. The events that gave the Ultramarines a bloody nose and kept them busy for at least two years. Proper tactics can nullify an advantage such as numbers. The Raven Guard survivors on Istvaan V proved that for 70-ish days despite the fact that the entire XII Legion plus Mechanicum forces plus Iron Warriors plus who knows what else hunting them down. Numbers is an advantage, yes. But it isn't the end all be all. If an Ultramarine force of 2,000 went against an Emperor's Children force of 3,000, do the Ultramarines get a bonus for being a larger Legion? The answer is no. Because those numbers can't always be brought to bear. So numbers are kind of an "eh" detail since they are variable and therefore differ from battle to battle.

[Hyaenidae]

Pinpoint strikes, terrorism, 'poison the well' tactics, and small-unit hit and fades are only effective to a point. When factoring in the levels to which a Legionary can survive, and the mentality of a transhuman, such actions do even less. The Alpha Legion are good at what they do, no doubt. But the best? Nah.

 

That title belongs to the Luna Wolves/ Sons of Horus, and during and after the Scouring, the Ultramarines. That's it. Period.

[Kol Saresk]

Pinpoint strikes, terrorism, 'poison the well' tactics, and small-unit hit and fades are only effective to a point. When factoring in the levels to which a Legionary can survive, and the mentality of a transhuman, such actions do even less. The Alpha Legion are good at what they do, no doubt. But the best? Nah.

 

That title belongs to the Luna Wolves/ Sons of Horus, and during and after the Scouring, the Ultramarines. That's it. Period.

Not best, strongest.

[Hyaenidae]

Nitpicking words means nothing. The strongest are the best, who are the Sons of Horus.

[Kais Klip]

Aye but my point rather was that given each legion's... speciality would be cancelled out by its counterparts (AL disruption vs Guillimans back up logistics, Night Lord psyops vs Salamander fortitude etc), numbers (both of arms and men, in the case of the X's reserves) would be the last thing left with which to compare each legion, since quantity isn't a specific trait owned by one legion over another.

 

Otherwise, if I take your point to its logical extreme, you are implying but leaving unsaid certain legions having an edge over others (concentrating force while disrupting the enemy), thereby making them superior, no?

 

Edit: for further clarification, yes I agree the legions are more or less balanced, like the primarchs in the FW books, but the primarchs are also given different point costs, implying micro superiority, if not macro (Angron is easier and more effective to field than Y).

 

So which legion would cost the most points, and the least? I believe the most expensive (best) to be the Ultramarines, and the most efficiently utilised to be Night Lords or Raven Guard.

 

Heresy Risk ftw

[Kol Saresk]

Aye but my point rather was that given each legion's... speciality would be cancelled out by its counterparts (AL disruption vs Guillimans back up logistics, Night Lord psyops vs Salamander fortitude etc), numbers (both of arms and men, in the case of the X's reserves) would be the last thing left with which to compare each legion, since quantity isn't a specific trait owned by one legion over another.

 

Otherwise, if I take your point to its logical extreme, you are implying but leaving unsaid certain legions having an edge over others (concentrating force while disrupting the enemy), thereby making them superior, no?

 

Edit: for further clarification, yes I agree the legions are more or less balanced, like the primarchs in the FW books, but the primarchs are also given different point costs, implying micro superiority, if not macro (Angron is easier and more effective to field than Y).

 

So which legion would cost the most points, and the least? I believe the most expensive (best) to be the Ultramarines, and the most efficiently utilised to be Night Lords or Raven Guard.

 

Heresy Risk ftw

What I'm saying is that certaon Legions' pluses, make up for the lack of numbers , which I count as a negative. For example, take Armatura. That fits into your theory of numbers equaling an advantage as the Ultramarines outnumbered the XII and XVII forces. And they utilized this numerical advantage by defending multiple key strong points simultaneously. But when the XII attacked as a single horde moving from one defense point to another, the horde outnumbered each individual garrison. The method trumped the numbers. If the Ultramarines had put everything they had into one single stand and used their edge in tactics, they would have outmaneuvered, outnumbered and outgunned the horde. But because that numerical advantage was destroyed, they were overwhelmed even though they were the more coordinated and more numerous force.

 

That's my point. Numbers don't equal a certifiable guarantee to victory. They're just a battlefield advantage, and one that can be broken.

 

EDIT: An inverse example of the above would be Istvaan III. The Loyalists, through tactics, were able to survive despite being outnumbered and outgunned. Even Angron's horde couldn't beat them. Eventually Horus just had to bombard them into dust.

[Aristeo]

Are the Alpha Legion the strongest?  I don't know about that, but I feel confident in saying that they think they're the best (you know, the whole pride thing).

 

The Alpha Legion are the best at what they do though, so they may not necessarily be good at doing things the way other legions do.  Their mindset is what really sets them apart.  They're probably the smartest legion in the sense that they're thinking more moves ahead than their average foe.  They're playing the long game, so if you beat them they're going to be back and when you least expect them.  I'm not saying their losses are all pre-planned (like in the sense that they wanted to lose an engagement, although it is possible), but that every loss is acceptable.

 

The fact that they've managed to live within the Imperium for 10,000 years goes to show how good they are at what they do.

[Legatus]

 

What I'm saying is that certaon Legions' pluses, make up for the lack of numbers , which I count as a negative. For example, take Armatura. That fits into your theory of numbers equaling an advantage as the Ultramarines outnumbered the XII and XVII forces.

 

Weren't the Ultramarine forces on Armatura at the numerical disadvantage? I thought it was just the regular garrison force, not a proper Legion force, as would later intercept the traitors on Nuceria.

[A D-B]

 

 

What I'm saying is that certaon Legions' pluses, make up for the lack of numbers , which I count as a negative. For example, take Armatura. That fits into your theory of numbers equaling an advantage as the Ultramarines outnumbered the XII and XVII forces.

 

Weren't the Ultramarine forces on Armatura at the numerical disadvantage? 

 

Incredibly outnumbered.  

[Brother-Chaplain Kage]

After reading this thread and seeing where it's headed:

 

http://i.imgur.com/pR75LKI.gif

[Kol Saresk]

 

 

 

 

What I'm saying is that certaon Legions' pluses, make up for the lack of numbers , which I count as a negative. For example, take Armatura. That fits into your theory of numbers equaling an advantage as the Ultramarines outnumbered the XII and XVII forces.

Weren't the Ultramarine forces on Armatura at the numerical disadvantage?

Incredibly outnumbered.

I hate to have to disagree with you since you are the author after all, but IIRC, at one point you wrote Khârn listing off just the planetary forces and saying they were outnumbered and another point where Magnus made a note that they were outgunned in orbit until the Blessed Lady and the Trisagion made an appearance. I'll look up page numbers and quotes when I get home, but that won't be for another three hours at least. Unless it went unwritten that those Abyss-class kingships added a serious number of troops as well as firepower.

[Perrin]

 

 

 

 

 

What I'm saying is that certaon Legions' pluses, make up for the lack of numbers , which I count as a negative. For example, take Armatura. That fits into your theory of numbers equaling an advantage as the Ultramarines outnumbered the XII and XVII forces.

Weren't the Ultramarine forces on Armatura at the numerical disadvantage?

Incredibly outnumbered.

I hate to have to disagree with you since you are the author after all, but IIRC, at one point you wrote Khârn listing off just the planetary forces and saying they were outnumbered and another point where Magnus made a note that they were outgunned in orbit until the Blessed Lady and the Trisagion made an appearance. I'll look up page numbers and quotes when I get home, but that won't be for another three hours at least. Unless it went unwritten that those Abyss-class kingships added a serious number of troops as well as firepower.

 

I assume Khârn was including the equivalent of PDF and other forces, rather than just astartes, which is what this discussion is about.

[A D-B]

 

 

 

 

 

 

What I'm saying is that certaon Legions' pluses, make up for the lack of numbers , which I count as a negative. For example, take Armatura. That fits into your theory of numbers equaling an advantage as the Ultramarines outnumbered the XII and XVII forces.

Weren't the Ultramarine forces on Armatura at the numerical disadvantage?

Incredibly outnumbered.

I hate to have to disagree with you since you are the author after all, but IIRC, at one point you wrote Khârn listing off just the planetary forces and saying they were outnumbered and another point where Magnus made a note that they were outgunned in orbit until the Blessed Lady and the Trisagion made an appearance. I'll look up page numbers and quotes when I get home, but that won't be for another three hours at least. Unless it went unwritten that those Abyss-class kingships added a serious number of troops as well as firepower.

 

I assume Khârn was including the equivalent of PDF and other forces, rather than just astartes, which is what this discussion is about.

 

M'yeah, there was a minimal (in Heresy terms...) garrison of Ultramarines, against many, many, many Word Bearers and World Eaters, including their two primarchs.