Inquisitor Kravin Posted April 17, 2014 Share Posted April 17, 2014 Firstly, if you've not seen the cover art for the new Visions of Heresy book I highly recommend you check it out. It's a new take on pretty much the defining moment of the Heresy era. Secondly, once you have seen it, there is an interesting point about the background. A poster on Bell of Lost Souls (Majere613 - credit where credit is due) pointed out that there appears to be a big space battle in the background but by this point the traitors were supposed to be well into the ground based siege of the palace so wouldn't the space battle be long over? Here were a few possible explanations I could think of: 1. Like Calth where space and ground battles occurred concurrently, just because the troops are well established on the surface it doesn't mean that the Traitors have complete space control. 2. It's a post battle ship graveyard with burning debris still drifting around. 3. The loyalists reveal additional orbital defence batteries on the palace held in reserve that are firing into space to disrupt resistance to the Emperor's boarding action. 4. The imminent arrival of the Dark Angels and/or Space Wolves to lift the siege will be clarified to be so imminent that they actually arrive in orbit whilst the battle rages aboard the Vengeful Spirit. I particularly like the last notion. I don't know if Black Library have thought that far ahead but if not I hereby call dibs on the idea and hope they come up with something even better (they usually do). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/289705-implications-of-the-new-visions-cover-art/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshall Bretton Posted April 17, 2014 Share Posted April 17, 2014 I think in reality the war will be fought on the ground and in space at the same time, all the traitors would need is control over the space near the palace to deploy their forces for an assault, and it would be extremely difficult for either side to force the other from orbit given the size of the forces. The other option is that that loyalist fleet fell back from the engagement and then launched a counter assault to coincide with the emperors boarding action, this is what i would do. I do like the idea of it being the remaining loyalists arriving in orbit though, wolves ultramarines and all the rest so everyone was there for the final battle (the original fluff said that the arrival of all the remaining loyalists was imminent after all, not just wolves and angels) Can anyone see lion el poking his head around the moon in that picture to try and figure out which side he wants to join? :p Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/289705-implications-of-the-new-visions-cover-art/#findComment-3655673 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted April 17, 2014 Share Posted April 17, 2014 Another implication would be that after a certain "defining moment" in the battle, the Loyalist fleet(s) retreated and then pushed concurrently with the Emperor's boarding action. IIRC, the IA article did have the Emperor teleporting onto the Vengeful Spirit through the Sky Fortress, so somewhere up there, something was still fighting. Or at least being left alone. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/289705-implications-of-the-new-visions-cover-art/#findComment-3655701 Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Foes Remain Posted April 17, 2014 Share Posted April 17, 2014 Another implication would be that after a certain "defining moment" in the battle, the Loyalist fleet(s) retreated and then pushed concurrently with the Emperor's boarding action. IIRC, the IA article did have the Emperor teleporting onto the Vengeful Spirit through the Sky Fortress, so somewhere up there, something was still fighting. Or at least being left alone. I thought the Sky Fortress was destroyed earlier on in the siege by a traitor Imperator Titan? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/289705-implications-of-the-new-visions-cover-art/#findComment-3655705 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted April 17, 2014 Share Posted April 17, 2014 "Rogal Dorn had commandeered the Sky Fortress, a huge gravitically powered bastion, to re-enter the palace. The combined powers of the Imperial Fists and Blood Angels Librarians were directed by the Emperor to counter the Thousand Sons sorcerers. The opposing psykers were stalemated, Horus' forces stood poised for the final attack but the Ultimate Gate remained closed to them." And then it starts out in the section titled "Endgame" which explains how Horus, sensing the Dark Angels and Space Wolves on their way, dropped the shields to his battle-barge so the final confrontation would play out. EDIT: Keep in mind, the above is from the original IA article. According to Lexicanum, the new Visions of Heresy puts it this way: Meanwhile, Magnus the Red and the Thousand Sons finally joined the battle on the Traitor side, attacking the Ultimate Gate of the inner sanctum of the Imperial Palace in conjunction with a horde of Khorne Daemons and World Eaters.[2] As traitorous hordes swarmed towards this final bastion of defense, Sanguinius himself became locked in mortal combat with a mighty Bloodthirster of Khorne, Ka'Bandha, the daemon he had battled at Signus Prime. After a protracted and bloody airborne struggle above the Ultimate Gate, the Primarch broke the Daemons back over his knee.[1c] The defending Blood Angels and Custodes forces were reinforced by the Imperial Fists led personally by Rogal Dorn, which disembarked from the great Sky Fortress, a massive fortified gunship. Though it managed to deliver withering fire and much-needed reinforcements to the loyalist forces and stopped an attempt by Thousand Sons Sorcerers to destroy the inner sanctum in an arcane ritual[2], in the end the Sky Fortress was shot down by the Titans of the Death's Head legion. The ensuing crash detonated the ships great plasma reactors, creating an explosion that ripped a forty three kilometer wide crater outside the palace. Though the blast had wiped out massive numbers of traitors, the loyalist forces now realized that they were cut off from the rest of Earth.[1c]So it was destroyed near the end of the Siege. Still, means something was up there. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/289705-implications-of-the-new-visions-cover-art/#findComment-3655718 Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Foes Remain Posted April 17, 2014 Share Posted April 17, 2014 Then where did I read that the Sky Fortress was killed by a titan..... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/289705-implications-of-the-new-visions-cover-art/#findComment-3655724 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xin Ceithan Posted April 17, 2014 Share Posted April 17, 2014 Hate to be a party pooper here, but with regards to artistic freedom and rule of cool in how an artist Approaches his work, are there any real implications here? After all, one could imply by this line of thinking that no other colours than red, yellow and black survived into the 41st millenium if you Look at John Blanche's art... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/289705-implications-of-the-new-visions-cover-art/#findComment-3655784 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted April 17, 2014 Share Posted April 17, 2014 Hate to be a party pooper here, but with regards to artistic freedom and rule of cool in how an artist Approaches his work, are there any real implications here? After all, one could imply by this line of thinking that no other colours than red, yellow and black survived into the 41st millenium if you Look at John Blanche's art... Considering most of everyone tends to have a shade red, black and/or yellow, it wouldn't be an inaccurate statement to say those are the primary colors of 40K. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/289705-implications-of-the-new-visions-cover-art/#findComment-3655800 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inquisitor Kravin Posted April 17, 2014 Author Share Posted April 17, 2014 Hate to be a party pooper here, but with regards to artistic freedom and rule of cool in how an artist Approaches his work, are there any real implications here? After all, one could imply by this line of thinking that no other colours than red, yellow and black survived into the 41st millenium if you Look at John Blanche's art... Not party pooping, a fair comment. It certainly satisfies Rule of Cool but there are plenty of things in 40k that have come about because an writer noticed some random detail of a piece of artwork and decided to run with it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/289705-implications-of-the-new-visions-cover-art/#findComment-3655815 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xin Ceithan Posted April 17, 2014 Share Posted April 17, 2014 Not party pooping, a fair comment. It certainly satisfies Rule of Cool but there are plenty of things in 40k that have come about because an writer noticed some random detail of a piece of artwork and decided to run with it. Well, Life imitates Art after all. And I do love it when some one picks up a detail or a part of something and turns it into something else. My point simply would be along the line: If you would have had only the box art of the old Epic 40 000, you could imply that the Blood Angels are into decorating their armour with beast furs and tend towards plasma weapons . Or even more simplistic: Don't read too much into it. But I am also convinced that there a lot more details and stories in and around the Siege than we know of at this point. It's perhaps the most pivotal turning point from the heresy to Imperium of the 41st millennium after all. And I am really looking forward to it. And enjoying the path towards it in the meantime. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/289705-implications-of-the-new-visions-cover-art/#findComment-3655956 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Rohr Posted April 17, 2014 Share Posted April 17, 2014 Personally I'd love it if everyone made it to the Siege so I could make A little bit of each legion. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/289705-implications-of-the-new-visions-cover-art/#findComment-3656369 Share on other sites More sharing options...
hisdudeness Posted April 17, 2014 Share Posted April 17, 2014 Well, if a commander only cared about the ground assault and just stalemating in space; control of the space above Terra would not be needed. It is a common tactic used today with American Air Assault units. Push past the ring of defenses to the rear of the line with enough helicopters (in 40K, assault drop ships) and drop troops. Horus could have done the same by sending in his fastest cruisers to sponge fire while the smaller assault ship hit atmo and kick out the pods and gunships. Then the entire fleet can focus on the space battle instead of dropping troops. I would also think that if Horus controlled space he would just drop orbital shots as needed before sending troops. Even drop Virus bombs again. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/289705-implications-of-the-new-visions-cover-art/#findComment-3656406 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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