b1soul Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 If you were the Emp. Of course you also benefit from 20/20 hind sight. Your goal is to keep their loyalty. I'm hoping for detailed answers. I believe some answers are more obvious than others Lorgar Horus Magnus Perturabo Alpharius Mortarion Fulgrim Curze Angron Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/290302-how-would-you-have-handled-the-traitor-primarchs/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 The problem with Magnus is that if you stop him from selling out to Tzeencht to save his Legion, you'll be left with a Primarch untainted by daemonic bargains and an XV Legion that is essentially semi-sentient goo in power armor. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/290302-how-would-you-have-handled-the-traitor-primarchs/#findComment-3667590 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scribe Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 I gotta sleep, but I believe the easiest. Lorgar, Magnus - Tell them the truth. The full truth. Show them before the Daemons do, and yes I think they stay loyal. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/290302-how-would-you-have-handled-the-traitor-primarchs/#findComment-3667618 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Rewriting: Conceive the Primarchs, use them to create the gene-seed and then commit a merciful act and terminate them before they are born so they never have to suffer the agonies of life and I, as the Emperor, never have to suffer the agony of my empire being torn asunder at the hands of my own children. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/290302-how-would-you-have-handled-the-traitor-primarchs/#findComment-3667620 Share on other sites More sharing options...
spu00sed Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Lorgar Let him worship, explain what chaos is Horus Logar doesn't turn, Horus is saved Magnus Explain the dangers of the warp, actually look into the gene problem before finding Magnus Perturabo Horus hasn't turned, perturbo is saved. Remember to rotate garrison duties between legions Alpharius Never turned in the first place. Smoke and mirrors Mortarion Horus hasn't turned, mortarion is saved Fulgrim This one is tricky as it was a simple mistake, picking up a pretty sword. Curze Let him be crazy, never really did anything wrong. Just ensure his fleets don't end up at planets that want to join the imperium Angron Let him finish his rebellion, give him the warhounds to crush the high riders Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/290302-how-would-you-have-handled-the-traitor-primarchs/#findComment-3667639 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plague Angel Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Yeah for a lot of these, the answer as external readers is pretty easy. We know, for the most part, why the primarchs betrayed because of what the Emperor did or did not do, so with the benefit of hindsight we could just not do, and do, those things respectively. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/290302-how-would-you-have-handled-the-traitor-primarchs/#findComment-3667647 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Actually Curze's fix(provided we're not going with execution) would be to keep Nostramo under control and take some one on one time with Curze. Maybe have him train under Dorn, Perturabo or Ferrus, you know, one of the more conservative Primarchs, rather than a looney bin like Fulgrim. As for Fulgrim, teach him humility. That while it is commendable to have a role model, he should know that no one is perfect as perfection is a fool's folly and he should not aspire to reach an unattainable goal. Oh, when he reaches a planet called "Laer", he should commence an immediate orbital bombardment. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/290302-how-would-you-have-handled-the-traitor-primarchs/#findComment-3667652 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saphrael Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Do what the abortion-supporters do and just never let them be born. It would seem to fit in with the Emperor's personality. Wow... did you actually just equate the pro-choice movement to a facist intentional euthanasia of undesirable people? That's... just... wow. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/290302-how-would-you-have-handled-the-traitor-primarchs/#findComment-3667654 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Do what the abortion-supporters do and just never let them be born. It would seem to fit in with the Emperor's personality. Wow... did you actually just equate the pro-choice movement to a facist intentional euthanasia of undesirable people? That's... just... wow. I can't think of a response to that. EDIT: Let me clarify that the comparison was unintentional. Just that I thought the Emperor is the kind of person who knows if it will present a serious problem down the road, he will terminate it while he can. And since he needs the Primarchs to build the Space Marines, once he has the gene-seed, he'll no longer need them. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/290302-how-would-you-have-handled-the-traitor-primarchs/#findComment-3667657 Share on other sites More sharing options...
mc warhammer Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Simple. The Emp can keep whatever he wants from the Primarchs and piss them off however he wants for all his mysterious reasons but since he alone is aware of chaos and how it works and that his "sons" have big targets on their backs, he could have built chaos watch dogs into each legion. A Malcador of sorts or a type of Primarch assigned chaplain to monitor for any signs of corruption and to reverse or contain it. Or at least report early signs. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/290302-how-would-you-have-handled-the-traitor-primarchs/#findComment-3667671 Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagicMan Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 For someone who is aware of Chaos, the big E didn't really do much to protect his assets other than hope ignorance is bliss. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/290302-how-would-you-have-handled-the-traitor-primarchs/#findComment-3667765 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 How exactly would these watch dogs operate? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/290302-how-would-you-have-handled-the-traitor-primarchs/#findComment-3667777 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balthamal Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 I think the best thing the Emperor could have done for Curze would have been to strip away his precognitive ability. Most of his outright crazyness seems to have come from knowing everything he did would end up as ashes regardless of his actions or intentions. That and put the galaxies largest police station with a big red button that could summon the Night Haunter home at the first sign of trouble. That threat alone would keep generations pliant if nothing else As for the rest? Sit Lorgar and Magnus down, together. And explain the nature of the universe to them. You save these two and you save the Galaxy. For all his faults, the Emperor wasn't stupid by any stretch of the imagination. He betrayed the Chaos Gods without any intention of honouring an agreement with them, like He knew they wouldn't either. Then set the human race on the path to effectively stripping them of their power. Gods without worshippers are not gods for long Even if Angron got his wish and fought with his slaves could he ever be the loyal honourable son with the Nails chewing through his every waking moment for a further 100 years? Alas we'll never know. Perturabo and Mortarion turned primarily because of Horus. As for Horus himself, disregarding Lorgar deliberatly entrapping him, before departing for Terra, tell him, no matter what comes, He is still the best and brightest, and that he'll never fail him because really it's his pride and ego that open up the potential for Erebus to swing him. Fulgrim? Several pimp slaps and a warning to pay more attention to Sanguinius. Humility is never a bad thing. Alpharius? The Emperor is really Alpharius Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/290302-how-would-you-have-handled-the-traitor-primarchs/#findComment-3667781 Share on other sites More sharing options...
mc warhammer Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 i'm no emperor, but i imagine they'd be covert. they'd officially be an advisor or equerry or head of something something on board each flagship...hell they could be the chef. but each is a trained and trusted operative that watches and reports and possibly acts in the event of possible corruption. they could be human or astartes, an individual or a group (like an anti-lodge). if chaos is a real threat then he shouldn't have just relied on ignoring it till it went away. a few well placed and educated eyes with each legion would have made a huge difference. 99% of the time they are their cover job. the 1% when signs of chaos show is when they take up their true task. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/290302-how-would-you-have-handled-the-traitor-primarchs/#findComment-3667786 Share on other sites More sharing options...
A D-B Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Edited / Deleted. Thanks, Kol - really appreciate the edit. Hot buttons, etc. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/290302-how-would-you-have-handled-the-traitor-primarchs/#findComment-3667792 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Apologies for any frustrations I've caused. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/290302-how-would-you-have-handled-the-traitor-primarchs/#findComment-3667803 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greyall Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Lorgar is a tricky one...allow him to spread the Imperial faith and you have a religious dictatorship to add to the rest...forbid him and...well, you know...Maybe a glimpse of the Warp's horrors would work, but Lorgar is too much into worship to be left with said knowledge. Same with Magnus, to be honest. He's like History's first fire-juggler, someday he was bound to get burned by something he doesn't really know. Ignorance has the bliss advantage, but is too risky in case of emergency (as Magnus demonstrated when he dropkicked into the Emperor's bathroom). So a gradual learning of how crazy the Warp is would be the best bet. Angron - the Emperor descends to aid his son, they wipe a whole army by themselves, Angron respects the man who saved him and his brothers while being a major badass. Everybody happy. Alpharius - Keep him occupied with crazy missions. Really, hire a whole psychiatric hospital to just come up with things for him to do. Horus - Regular phonecalls for my 200 year-old special little boy...sigh. No, but maybe a holo-meeting every now and again to counsel the guy would be nice, at least for his first years as Warmaster. Curze - As was said above, throw him exclusively at the very worst so no one will feel sorry. Also, no joint missions with other Legions. Also, keep the Wolves ready to kill the bastard, eventually. He's really, really damaged. Perturabo - Some basic HR knowledge is all it takes. Thank the guy, if he's that needy. Give him some different missions every now and then, spread the Irons' fame as a super-reliable Legion. Make Corpse-Grinders acceptable - it's awesome. Mortarion - No clue, I guess keeping Horus happy is the key. Maybe show him the benefit of having psykers and how it's better to manage them than pretend they don't exist and risk BOOOM Fulgrim - Have him finish Philosophy for Dummies, it doesn't take more than a few days observing nature to notice how perfection is a process, not a goal. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/290302-how-would-you-have-handled-the-traitor-primarchs/#findComment-3667819 Share on other sites More sharing options...
helterskelter Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 killing erebus and kor phaeron. it's all their fault, the emperor should have sensed them both and annihilated them with monarchia Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/290302-how-would-you-have-handled-the-traitor-primarchs/#findComment-3667864 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karthak Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Perturabo - Some basic HR knowledge is all it takes. Thank the guy, if he's that needy. Give him some different missions every now and then, spread the Irons' fame as a super-reliable Legion. Make Corpse-Grinders acceptable - it's awesome. The Lord of Iron should have gotted some advice from a certain Lannister: Let me give you some advice, bastard: never forget what you are. The rest of the world will not. Wear it like armor, and it can never be used to hurt you. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/290302-how-would-you-have-handled-the-traitor-primarchs/#findComment-3667873 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greyall Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 That doesn't work all the time for said Lannister, and it didn't for Perty. He tried it, but those who stuff things inside forget there's a limit for human patience. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/290302-how-would-you-have-handled-the-traitor-primarchs/#findComment-3667876 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Fulgrim? Several pimp slaps and a warning to pay more attention to Sanguinius. Humility is never a bad thing. Because slapping Lorgar down and telling him to pay more attention to Roboute worked out so well for everyone involved... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/290302-how-would-you-have-handled-the-traitor-primarchs/#findComment-3667974 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balthamal Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Fulgrim? Several pimp slaps and a warning to pay more attention to Sanguinius. Humility is never a bad thing. Because slapping Lorgar down and telling him to pay more attention to Roboute worked out so well for everyone involved... I think the quest for perfection in war and an obsession with the origin of the universe and the gods in it are separate enough to avoid catastrophe ;) But what do I know, I'm a cynical idealist Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/290302-how-would-you-have-handled-the-traitor-primarchs/#findComment-3667980 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demus Ragnok Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Fulgrim? Several pimp slaps and a warning to pay more attention to Sanguinius. Humility is never a bad thing. Because slapping Lorgar down and telling him to pay more attention to Roboute worked out so well for everyone involved... Yeah, I would have helped Fulgrim get into a war he couldnt win. No outside interference. Just the III Legion and a meat grinder. He would have to see the folly that is pride with his own eyes. No amount of pointing out a narcissisists failings ever works. They have to fall into the water and break their own reflection all by themselves. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/290302-how-would-you-have-handled-the-traitor-primarchs/#findComment-3667999 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kais Klip Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Been a while since Thousand sons, but bear with me as I assume their curse is similar in quantity to the blood angels. I'll start with the moment the Big E decides to Monarchia. Recal Magnus and Perturabo back to terra; put the former under Malcador's guidance and the latter under Magnus authority as the two sort out my damn intergalactic webway highway. Take the time freed up to make a bee line to Lorgar. Spend a year with him, tutoring his legion and coaxing them back into angry militant atheist mode. Make a point of my arrival being flanked by the rout (because I still feel the hangover the last time I got that wrong). At the same time, employ Alpharius and Constantin to weed out Erebus and Kor Pharon. "Now show me your commitment, Lorgar. Show me your faith." That might come back later to bite me in the arse, so I make sure the word bearers operate real close to the space wolves for the next few years to make sure it's not just my cheek that gets bit. Before I head back I check up on Horus, and despite his protestations I take him back to terra for Magnus and perturabo to tell him what great works I am doing. Use Alpharius to shift his complete focus on my so- subjects and their legions, while put Curze and Corax in a tag team to handle any instances of insurrection. Ponder if it's worth sending "that perfect bastard" Russ to monitor Curze, but if rather the former keep his nipples on his chest so I guess I'll just let Curze do with his legion what he wants. If he snaps id rather deal with him then both him and a legion. At this point I'd send some communiques debating with Alpharius the realism of my dream, but I'll get bored and send him the silent sister hot or not list Constantin got his hands on to keep him occupied. Angron, Mortarion and Fulgrim are happy little chaps without their older brothers putting forward patricide. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/290302-how-would-you-have-handled-the-traitor-primarchs/#findComment-3668003 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Fulgrim? Several pimp slaps and a warning to pay more attention to Sanguinius. Humility is never a bad thing. Because slapping Lorgar down and telling him to pay more attention to Roboute worked out so well for everyone involved...Yeah, I would have helped Fulgrim get into a war he couldnt win. No outside interference. Just the III Legion and a meat grinder. He would have to see the folly that is pride with his own eyes. No amount of pointing out a narcissisists failings ever works. They have to fall into the water and break their own reflection all by themselves. The war with the Laer was supposed to be an impossible affair and according to what little is recorded, only the III Legion participated. And look how well that mirror cracked. Its not that the cracking needs to happen, its how it needs to happen. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/290302-how-would-you-have-handled-the-traitor-primarchs/#findComment-3668212 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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