Iron_Within Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 So 7th Edition everyone will have Daemonology, including us. That's quite scary in one way and not in another, I do sincerely hope such things would benefit TS players, The thought of TS Aspiring sorcerers being used as a delivery system for Greater Daemons is scary. Doubt it will work. Is there anything you are hoping for/dreading for Chaos with the current 7th edition rumours? Especially Daemonology (i've like to think that we'd get a bonus for it... HA!) I do hope there isn't any shenanigans where a Greater Daemon can summon another Greater Daemon in it's place if it's nearly dead,. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forté Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 Yup. Other armies using Daemonology. Can understand if it's used for combating Daemons but the thought of Eldar summoning daemons (especially Slaanesh) screams no. Same with anything Imperial apart from the odd Inquisitor who is about to be excommunicated anyway. Tau...no. Orks...like they care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 It's a new psychic lore. And while it does sound cool and exciting for chaos players, unless the rules for selecting powers is significantly changrd, including rewriting codex restrictions, which hasn't been mentioned so far and seems, imo, unlikely, then aspiring sorcerers won't have access, as they will be required to select a tzeentch lore spell instead, and tzeentch marked sorcerers will be worse at it than anyone else, including loyalist psykers, for the same reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incinerator950 Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 Didn't read on it, waiting to see it when the book comes out.That said, it sounds like something I won't take advantage of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forté Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 Didn't read on it, waiting to see it when the book comes out. That said, it sounds like something I won't take advantage of. I like your style. Ignore the rumours and wait to see it in print. Think I'll join you there. After all. Look at the Crimson Slaughter codex and the reaction before that came out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lepaca Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 They better make sure that it is plainly better for Chaos armies than for loyalists and xenos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forté Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 They better make sure that it is plainly better for Chaos armies than for loyalists and xenos. Likely to be one of those Chaos get a lower chance of being attacked by the summoned Daemon. If I was a Bloodthirster summoned by a librarian, I know who's heads would be mine first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenebris Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 Well in the article there is word of a Bloodthirster but I think an Imperial player would simply put down St.Celestine and be done with it. In such a way it will be fluffy and not even remotely lore breaking. Also at long last GW is acknowledging the font of magic, its manifestation depends on the invoker yet all it is invariably daemonic, or warp magic. In our case I am overjoyed. I have a deep love for sorcerers and I have all the three ones in metal (staff, sword and axe), Ahriman, the Terminator Sorcerer and the new Finecast one. I am packed with magic wielders and I cannot wait to field them one or two in every battle. On the Thousand Sons front I am also happy but here I will simply go evil and ally them with Daemons of Tzeentch for even more warp charges. The psychic part was always my favorite part in 40k and in Fantasy. I am sucker for all things magic and even if it is game breaking I couldn't care less, I want to murder things with psychic powers, I want to unleash the Warp, corrupt the reality and summon legions of daemons to do my bidding. The loyalist dogs can have their fun, provided that I had mine first. Hopefully it will be bloody Ahriman time...! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noctus Cornix Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 I look forward to seeing what they do with this, nothing more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fibonacci Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 Well in the article there is word of a Bloodthirster but I think an Imperial player would simply put down St.Celestine and be done with it. In such a way it will be fluffy and not even remotely lore breaking. Now THAT is a cool idea. In a similar way, it would actually fit Draigo's fluff to come in this way or maybe one of several primarchs who are out on a walk-about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 Alternatively, being able to summon actual daemons to the table via allies rules was the principle thing keeping me from jumping ship to a loyalist book. If I can get actual daemons in a space wolf army simply by bringing a rune priest or two, that would be one less reason not to jump on the counts-as bandwagon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clone Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 This is one of those things that sounds great and hopefully will be balanced to the fluff. It shouldn't be easy to summon a greater daemon, there should be some kind of downside to trading a 100 point model for a 250 point daemon. Also, if a librarian or farseer summoned any daemon at all, why would said daemon fight on their side? And why would the rest of the army be OK with this? Surely a grey knight army would gun down any inquisitor even attempting to summon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 A too few casters to creat a big enough power dice pool to reliably summon demons [we technicly could run 2 sorc and 1 BL for mastery 4 , but it just costs too much. We would need elite casters to pull that off. or be able to ally in 1-4 heralds in one HQ slots , like demons can in their primary]. B I have this bad feeling inside that only Chaos demons players will be able to summon demon dudes without exploding themselfs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incinerator950 Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 Well in the article there is word of a Bloodthirster but I think an Imperial player would simply put down St.Celestine and be done with it. In such a way it will be fluffy and not even remotely lore breaking. Also at long last GW is acknowledging the font of magic, its manifestation depends on the invoker yet all it is invariably daemonic, or warp magic. In our case I am overjoyed. I have a deep love for sorcerers and I have all the three ones in metal (staff, sword and axe), Ahriman, the Terminator Sorcerer and the new Finecast one. I am packed with magic wielders and I cannot wait to field them one or two in every battle. On the Thousand Sons front I am also happy but here I will simply go evil and ally them with Daemons of Tzeentch for even more warp charges. The psychic part was always my favorite part in 40k and in Fantasy. I am sucker for all things magic and even if it is game breaking I couldn't care less, I want to murder things with psychic powers, I want to unleash the Warp, corrupt the reality and summon legions of daemons to do my bidding. The loyalist dogs can have their fun, provided that I had mine first. Hopefully it will be bloody Ahriman time...! I don't want it more game breaking. I want them to finally start realing in the codex writers and actually get a larger test pool for these write ups, which will never happen because GW has more issues than EA does. If you want more stupendous things at the cost of balance and something not to devolve into a Console-based RTS, I want Armored Cores and Kojima Particle shields for Titans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excessus Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 Do we know who has access to what yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incinerator950 Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 Don't know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Castellan Cato Posted May 8, 2014 Share Posted May 8, 2014 The WD page says everyone. But there has to be some caveat to that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incinerator950 Posted May 8, 2014 Share Posted May 8, 2014 I was thinking, instead of just Chaos Demons, what about other Warp entities like Enslavers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plague Angel Posted May 8, 2014 Share Posted May 8, 2014 We also know that Daemonology is actually two lores, Sanctic and Malefic. While everyone can take Daemonology, those two branches may only be open to certain armies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daboarder Posted May 8, 2014 Share Posted May 8, 2014 so ezekiel summoning a bloodthrister is fine? but radical inquisitors or chaos Knights? leave!! GG GW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brother_contagion Posted May 8, 2014 Share Posted May 8, 2014 We also know that Daemonology is actually two lores, Sanctic and Malefic. While everyone can take Daemonology, those two branches may only be open to certain armies. I was thinking the same thing. I'm thinking Sanctic = Satanic or Saintly? So, a "good" version of Daemonology while Malefic would be "evil"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incinerator950 Posted May 8, 2014 Share Posted May 8, 2014 Well this is assuming they're referring to Demonology in a form of plane summoning. Hence the two trees, although in 99% of the case GW refuses to make any form of benevolent entity from the warp. Given that 40k doesn't actually have anything benevolent, I'm assuming it could refer to warp infused saints up to non-chaos warp entities. This gave me an insidious idea to have a Enslaver Cult Alpha Legion group, it's a shame that Belekor is the only one that comes to mind, and I don't want a DP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daboarder Posted May 8, 2014 Share Posted May 8, 2014 We also know that Daemonology is actually two lores, Sanctic and Malefic. While everyone can take Daemonology, those two branches may only be open to certain armies. I was thinking the same thing. I'm thinking Sanctic = Satanic or Saintly? So, a "good" version of Daemonology while Malefic would be "evil"? sanctify /sanctuary would be what they are referencing id say Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenebris Posted May 8, 2014 Share Posted May 8, 2014 Consider the ahem "santic" as a sort of divine magic, most probably an echo of the faith in the Emperor resonating in the Warp. It would be interesting to see this two lores counter each other, with summon spells for Chaos and banish spells for the Imperials. It could work in my book. The thing is that with all this rumors of new psychic powers and a new psychic phase (though some old folks in my club remember it from 2nd Edition) I would love to see an increase in the number of available psykers to every army. Making the Sorcerer entry as a HQ option and a 1-3 Aspiring Sorcerer entry as units outside the FOC, much like the heroes in WFB. As I have said I am a vocal supporter of the "lieutenant" class of characters, they give spirit to an army. Now with Daemonmancy I expect maledictions, minor summons and major summons as the theme, with perhaps a shapeshifting spell in there as the ultimate power. Overall Chaos should be very, very strong in the psychic phase for bar Khorne (and some would argue even him) the majority of the Chaos forces is saturated with magic power, infused with the very thing that is the Warp so I expect some boost either via FAQ or another codex in the future that would bring Chaos on fluff levels when comes to psionics. I always had the impression, be it in WFB as well as in 40k that the most powerful psychic races are either elves or chaos because the two are actually an extension of magic itself. The first were created to harness it, the second actually become it. I cannot argue enough but a Tzeentchian Sorcerer should be the ultimate spellcaster regardless of setting, sadly it is not so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoomulusPrime Posted May 8, 2014 Share Posted May 8, 2014 Consider the ahem "santic" as a sort of divine magic, most probably an echo of the faith in the Emperor resonating in the Warp. It would be interesting to see this two lores counter each other, with summon spells for Chaos and banish spells for the Imperials. It could work in my book. The thing is that with all this rumors of new psychic powers and a new psychic phase (though some old folks in my club remember it from 2nd Edition) I would love to see an increase in the number of available psykers to every army. Making the Sorcerer entry as a HQ option and a 1-3 Aspiring Sorcerer entry as units outside the FOC, much like the heroes in WFB. As I have said I am a vocal supporter of the "lieutenant" class of characters, they give spirit to an army. Now with Daemonmancy I expect maledictions, minor summons and major summons as the theme, with perhaps a shapeshifting spell in there as the ultimate power. Overall Chaos should be very, very strong in the psychic phase for bar Khorne (and some would argue even him) the majority of the Chaos forces is saturated with magic power, infused with the very thing that is the Warp so I expect some boost either via FAQ or another codex in the future that would bring Chaos on fluff levels when comes to psionics. I always had the impression, be it in WFB as well as in 40k that the most powerful psychic races are either elves or chaos because the two are actually an extension of magic itself. The first were created to harness it, the second actually become it. I cannot argue enough but a Tzeentchian Sorcerer should be the ultimate spellcaster regardless of setting, sadly it is not so. Yet sadly, both Tzeentchian lores in 40k are woefully underpowered. At least the Daemon lore of Tzeentch has a relatively good primus power. Thousand Sons sorcerers got boned though. My Lords of Change are better as CC monsters then they are with mind-bulletry, and it breaks my heart the Fateweaver is really a 2++ gimmick or Warp Storm anchor :*( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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