New chapter, help

[Gaymer1991]

So, using the D10 system provided by one of the Deathwatch RPG expansions, I've created a new chapter. Yay me.

So these are the rolls I got and their results:

7: was founded because "there are No Marines over here, found a chapter!" (Thinking about ignoring this one)

1: 31st millennium

99: Space Wolves

5: Pure gene-seed

9: Brothers in Battle special rule (still have to look up exactly what the means)

79: No mutations

2: we stand alone (shunned or hermity by choice. Either way, not too many best friends out there)

51: Chief Librarian ([rune master]chapter's major hero)

33: Against Chaos, slew a deamon prince (what he did)

98: Fleet based (home world)

9: 9 non-combat specific ships

8: Battle Ready

3: Stewardship (their rule over home world. They rule the fleet, but don't really get too involved in the affairs of any non space marines on their ships)

6: Drop Pod (speciality)

58: The Emperor above all (chapters "outlook"?)

7: Nominal (chapter size. Most squads are full, chapter as a whole is just above average size.)

80: Inquisition (besties)

57: Chaos Space Marines (Arch nemesis. followers of: )

 

So I haven't worked out all the details, but I figure that they started out as a small fleet, just a small part of the space wolves, that somehow get involved with the inquisition (fight a few deamons for them before GK show up, get drawn into helping some GK and prove their worth battling chaos). So the inquisition desires to keep them around. When the first war of Armageddon comes around they kind if stay out of it, helping both sides in non-combat ways. But in the end they are exiled from Fenris. Forever to roam the stars longing for the only world they can call home, the continue to fight chaos. No longer the leashed dog of the inquisition, but not knowing what else to do that goal so engrained in who they are.

I can't decide if I want to make Nurgle or Khorne their main chaos enemy. Nurgle is my least favorite and Khorne my most.

 

So I guess my question is, is there any fluff, any at all, that is 100% core, no exceptions fluff that would help me to build a more accurate story for them to fit properly in the world of 40K? Anything at all. I love fluff, but I don't have forever to go around reading everything and sifting through thousands if websites to find every applicable detail.

 

Thanks guys!

[Vash113]

Well not really, by the core fluff a Space Wolf successor is simply not possible, the only attempt, the Wolf Brothers, ended in disaster and there are no others, period.

 

Ultimately it's your army and you can do what you want but if you want to be consistent with the fluff I'd suggest re-rolling the choice of chapter.

[Black Cohort]

Well not really, by the core fluff a Space Wolf successor is simply not possible, the only attempt, the Wolf Brothers, ended in disaster and there are no others, period.

 

Ultimately it's your army and you can do what you want but if you want to be consistent with the fluff I'd suggest re-rolling the choice of chapter.

Unless they are one of the lost companies that is trying to settle down far from home and is struggling with dwindling numbers and gene seed rejection.

[KhorneFlakes]

Again I don't think that is likely. Also if they are friendly with the Inquisition, have pure gene seed etc, then what reason do they have for no friends? 

[Gaymer1991]

Ok, so was a bit courious: why would GW make SW an option for chapter cration in one of their books if it's impossible for there to be one. Downloaded the codex, looked at fourms, yada yada yada. So It looks like (so far) there is no "Known" chapters, and I have yet (thought not impossible) to find anywhere that says there cannot be a successor chapter, just that the Imperium nor SW have any inclination to try again after the WB. But in spite of that, some changes are going to be made for the chapter, though I realllly wanna keep SW. (chapter selection is on a roll of D100, and you have to get 99 for SW. So a 1% chance, yeah, even if I have to break some fluff, I'm gonna go for it. But I'd like to do as little damage as possible along the way.

 

I'm hopeing to take this as far as I can and run this force one day. But I don't want to take up too much forum space with it. But I deffinately want to continue to get any input I can and even maybe a bit of brainstorming on what would make the most since, and I can't seem to think of a better way to do that other than to either continue this one or start a new topic and just have anyone who would like to help me with this project to subscribe to whichever one it is.

 

What do y'all think? This Topic, new topic, or is there a better place to be able to do that?

[Vash113]

Ok, so was a bit courious: why would GW make SW an option for chapter cration in one of their books if it's impossible for there to be one. Downloaded the codex, looked at fourms, yada yada yada. So It looks like (so far) there is no "Known" chapters, and I have yet (thought not impossible) to find anywhere that says there cannot be a successor chapter, just that the Imperium nor SW have any inclination to try again after the WB. But in spite of that, some changes are going to be made for the chapter, though I realllly wanna keep SW. (chapter selection is on a roll of D100, and you have to get 99 for SW. So a 1% chance, yeah, even if I have to break some fluff, I'm gonna go for it. But I'd like to do as little damage as possible along the way.

 

Of course GW is not going to say "this is impossible," they don't do that for anything. But that doesn't mean any given idea is going to be generally acceptable either, like female marines. There are two missing legions and tons of people like to have their chapter be one of those, is it possible? Sure, but generally fans of the fluff do not like such armies and they are hardly going to draw any praise from the community most of the time.

 

While GW isn't going to say it's impossible for a Space Wolf successor to exist, the fluff does strongly incline against it, the Wolf Brothers fell apart due to genetic instability, including, at least for some, abhorrent and twisted mutations. One theory to explain this is that the Space Wolf gene-seed is just no longer, if it ever was, tenable with individuals recruited from any other planet than Fenris. Of course there are a number of other theories.

 

I'm hopeing to take this as far as I can and run this force one day. But I don't want to take up too much forum space with it. But I deffinately want to continue to get any input I can and even maybe a bit of brainstorming on what would make the most since, and I can't seem to think of a better way to do that other than to either continue this one or start a new topic and just have anyone who would like to help me with this project to subscribe to whichever one it is.

 

What do y'all think? This Topic, new topic, or is there a better place to be able to do that?

 

There are lots of things you could do, you could have a chapter that believes they are successors of the Space Wolves despite no proof to that effect and the disbelief and denial of the wolves themselves. Or a chapter like the Red Wolves who some mistake to be a Space Wolves successor but they aren't really, but in doctrine they have similarities.

 

You could also do a Lost Company in a variety of ways. A Lost Company that's only just returned from the warp thousands of years after they vanished, you could do a Lost Company that voluntarily left the Fang and has managed to endure by maintaining a steady population of serfs taken from Fenris or perhaps even raiding other Fenresian ships for recruits and slowly building their strength to near chapter level. You could also perhaps do a Cursed Founding Chapter with notable similarities to the Space Wolves but whose actual gene-seed sources is unknown and/or likely a hybrid between two or more sources. Perhaps an attempt to use the Space Wolf gene-seed by merging it with more stable stock like the Ultramarines, Imperial Fists, or perhaps even the White Scars in an attempt to gain the best traits from both of the more barbaric chapters.

 

There are lots of little nuanced ways to make something fit in the fluff, just as long as it's not too direct. In the 40k universe mystery, secrets and obliqueness are well in keeping with the fluff and more than adequate for justifying most things you want to do.

[Growler67]

The Wolf Brothers were Eradicated due to instability of the geneseed as well as a higher rate of mutation than was deemed desirable and so they were so marked for their fate.

 

I would recommend one of the options Lore-Master Vash has offered about a Lost Company or perhaps one that the Wolf Lord had a falling out with the Great Wolf and left the fold to continue the fight for the Imperium of Mankind but not hold allegiance with the Fang.  Such a Company would eventually be in dire need for resupply and other support and could have shown themselves to be worthy to an Inquisitor directly or indirectly and thus they received repairs and resupply (arms and munitions) but still dwindle in numbers due to the curse of the Canis Helix within them and the resulting lack of new recruits to replenish their ranks.

[Leif Bearclaw]

Another idea to go with the very good ones Vash has had. As you have an early founding, you could be based off a Lost Company that was lost before the Thousand Sons invaded Fenris. The company's Wolf Priest knew of the Tempering being undertaken on Fenris (forget the name of the WP doing the work). Once the Company is cut off from Fenris, the Priest takes a shot at the Tempering himself to allow the company to sustain its numbers easier. Being fleet based, this work is either not noticed by the Sons, or they're unable to pin them down and destroy this 2nd Tempering like they did on Fenris (the attempts could also tie in with the 'Against Chaos' bit). Having enabled successful recruiting, the Company is able to grow to Chapter strength over the next 9000 or so years. This could possibly explain their shunned status, they don't want anyone to know what ther Priest did to sendure the Company/Chapter's survival, as they don't even have the pedigree of the Wolves any more to deflect Imperial wrath.

[CatSmasher]

I'm pretty sure there was a battle on Fenis over a newly upgraded gene seed between the wolves and thousand sons. You could say that some of the new gene seed was moved off planet during the battle and was used covertly to generate another company. You could use these circumstances to your liking because it fit with fluff to a certain extent, and enough time has passed

[Grey Mage]

So, using the D10 system provided by one of the Deathwatch RPG expansions, I've created a new chapter. Yay me.

So these are the rolls I got and their results:

7: was founded because "there are No Marines over here, found a chapter!" (Thinking about ignoring this one)

1: 31st millennium

99: Space Wolves

5: Pure gene-seed

9: Brothers in Battle special rule (still have to look up exactly what the means)

79: No mutations

2: we stand alone (shunned or hermity by choice. Either way, not too many best friends out there)

51: Chief Librarian ([rune master]chapter's major hero)

33: Against Chaos, slew a deamon prince (what he did)

98: Fleet based (home world)

9: 9 non-combat specific ships

8: Battle Ready

3: Stewardship (their rule over home world. They rule the fleet, but don't really get too involved in the affairs of any non space marines on their ships)

6: Drop Pod (speciality)

58: The Emperor above all (chapters "outlook"?)

7: Nominal (chapter size. Most squads are full, chapter as a whole is just above average size.)

80: Inquisition (besties)

57: Chaos Space Marines (Arch nemesis. followers of: )

 

So I haven't worked out all the details, but I figure that they started out as a small fleet, just a small part of the space wolves, that somehow get involved with the inquisition (fight a few deamons for them before GK show up, get drawn into helping some GK and prove their worth battling chaos). So the inquisition desires to keep them around. When the first war of Armageddon comes around they kind if stay out of it, helping both sides in non-combat ways. But in the end they are exiled from Fenris. Forever to roam the stars longing for the only world they can call home, the continue to fight chaos. No longer the leashed dog of the inquisition, but not knowing what else to do that goal so engrained in who they are.

I can't decide if I want to make Nurgle or Khorne their main chaos enemy. Nurgle is my least favorite and Khorne my most.

 

So I guess my question is, is there any fluff, any at all, that is 100% core, no exceptions fluff that would help me to build a more accurate story for them to fit properly in the world of 40K? Anything at all. I love fluff, but I don't have forever to go around reading everything and sifting through thousands if websites to find every applicable detail.

 

Thanks guys!

Sounds like to me, theyre a lost company.

 

They went into the eye, or similar, chasing Russ... and after eight thousand years theyve just had to adapt. Their doggedness in hunting down any rumors of a warp rift and propensity for showing up when the fur is about to fly has put them on good terms with the inquisition.

 

Over the millenia, the campaign badge/great company symbol has become the 'chapter' heraldry. The actual origin is known, but a closely held secret by the brothers of the taskforce.

 

They refuse to go home, even though theres no one left save a small group of dreadnaughts- perhaps one of thems that Rune Priest you mentioned?- who have any memory of Fenris. Honor is at stake, they will bring their primarch home and they will kill every thousand son they can find to help him on his quest.

Because they are the Sons of Russ, they are the grandchildren of the Emperor, and they know their duty.

 

Brothers in battle- all marines are our brothers, but those who cant keep up, mortal humans, are not and are not to be trusted.... this ties in with the chapters secret, and with the feeling of those who would have been founded by legions and then cut off from the fold. How does this work with the hermity, not really having allies outlook? Simple: other Astartes will know their pain, and their pride. They have little contact with regular humans, outside of the occasional military dispatch, and thus keep their words close to their chest. Grim.

 

 

With a chapter sized disposition theyll need a forgeship- for war material to keep the fight going- and a battle barge- simply for room and training facilities- with the rest of the ships likely comprising 1-2 strike cruisers and a half dozenish escort sized craft. *note: escorts are over a kilometer long in 40k*

 

The funny part is, theyve figured out how to adapt the gene-seed, perhaps using gene-stock of terran descent from the veteran cadre that led the great hunt as the mainstay of their gene-lines. Theyd be undoubtedly welcome to return with this miracle in hand, but they no longer have the knowledge, or the context, to come to this realization- if they ever did at all.

 

They are dogged hope. They are the howl in the darkness. They are the Void Hunters, the farsriders, the closers of gateways. They are the Kerberian Cupitores- the Seekers of Cerberus. And they will watch the gateways to hell until they have fulfilled their oath.

 

*shrugs* Just a thought.

[Gaymer1991]

Sounds like to me, theyre a lost company.

They went into the eye, or similar, chasing Russ... and after eight thousand years theyve just had to adapt. Their doggedness in hunting down any rumors of a warp rift and propensity for showing up when the fur is about to fly has put them on good terms with the inquisition.

Over the millenia, the campaign badge/great company symbol has become the 'chapter' heraldry. The actual origin is known, but a closely held secret by the brothers of the taskforce.

They refuse to go home, even though theres no one left save a small group of dreadnaughts- perhaps one of thems that Rune Priest you mentioned?- who have any memory of Fenris. Honor is at stake, they will bring their primarch home and they will kill every thousand son they can find to help him on his quest. Because they are the Sons of Russ, they are the grandchildren of the Emperor, and they know their duty.

Brothers in battle- all marines are our brothers, but those who cant keep up, mortal humans, are not and are not to be trusted.... this ties in with the chapters secret, and with the feeling of those who would have been founded by legions and then cut off from the fold. How does this work with the hermity, not really having allies outlook? Simple: other Astartes will know their pain, and their pride. They have little contact with regular humans, outside of the occasional military dispatch, and thus keep their words close to their chest. Grim.


With a chapter sized disposition theyll need a forgeship- for war material to keep the fight going- and a battle barge- simply for room and training facilities- with the rest of the ships likely comprising 1-2 strike cruisers and a half dozenish escort sized craft. *note: escorts are over a kilometer long in 40k*

The funny part is, theyve figured out how to adapt the gene-seed, perhaps using gene-stock of terran descent from the veteran cadre that led the great hunt as the mainstay of their gene-lines. Theyd be undoubtedly welcome to return with this miracle in hand, but they no longer have the knowledge, or the context, to come to this realization- if they ever did at all.

They are dogged hope. They are the howl in the darkness. They are the Void Hunters, the farsriders, the closers of gateways. They are the Kerberian Cupitores- the Seekers of Cerberus. And they will watch the gateways to hell until they have fulfilled their oath.

*shrugs* Just a thought.

 

 

 

 

 

 

You are amazing.

 

ok, so I forgot to mention that I'm fairly new (only played about 6 games. Would have won the last two by technicality of points but I am still struggling to focus on objectives instead of team deathmatch style gameplay). So would you mind answering a few questions just so I better understand? Though some of them have less to do with that and more to do with just wanting to make sure I understand what you're saying.

 

1) I know it's a basic sentence and I should be able to understand what it means, but could you flesh out your 1000% exact meaning for "The actual origin is known, but a closely held secret by the brothers of the taskforce."?

 

2) Did I miss something? Which seceret? Their origin? "this ties in with the chapters secret"

 

3)"and with the feeling of those who would have been founded by legions and then cut off from the fold"?

 

4)"perhaps using gene-stock of terran descent from the veteran cadre that led the great hunt as the mainstay of their gene-lines" I know your talking about stabalizing the gene-seed because of what happened to the WBs. But what exactly gene-stock of terran (earth right?) descent or any of the rest of that REALLY means, I'm a bit lost.

 

5) I wonder if the SW may look upon them and whatever they've done to stabalize the gene-seed as a personal form of heresy and sort of spitting in the face of the WBs.

 

6) SWs in general are fairly norse in their fluff, I think we can all agree. I was thinking about making these guys a tad more Gaelic (many norse assimilated into the gaelic culture and brought some of thier own culture with them, making them similar matches) or other culture similar but not quite 100% as norse like as the SW are. Just so they aren't just SWs lost in space, but have their own culture based off of SW but different enough (after so many thousands of years) that they are their own thing.

 

But yeah, thank you so much man. That makes so much more sense than anything I would have come up with.

[KiltedMarine]

Grey Mage is pretty reliably awesome. You'll learn to appreciate the depth of his awesome as you hang out here more.

I think the amount of emphasis some folks put on "there are no successor chapters of the SW" occasionally gets a bit excessive. At the end of the day, it's your army. Fluff does say that the SW don't officially recognize the existence of any successors, and if you said "O yeah, Logan Grimnar totally knows about us and we're his besties," then that's a blatant violation of the agreed-on canon. Based on what you rolled, though, I agree that the "lost company who have concealed their heritage and are pursuing the Long Hunt on their own" is a pretty bad- backstory.

But then, I'm kind of a heretic in these matters myself, as you can probably tell from my .sig.

[mactire]

You could also say that they fell out with Grimnar the GW over his stance on the Inquisition and left Fenris but continue to fight for the Emperor. This could explain "we stand alone" also you could ally them with GK's due to their friendship with the Inq and this could again justify the deamon hatred. It would also allow them to keep being supplied from forge world's, or maybe even by the GK's themselves, rather than have to return to Fenris like the other great companies. To keep up company strength maybe Grimnar allows some recruits or troublesome/unruly claws or hunters to join the company. The reason being that even though Grimnar and your Wolf Lord cannot work together the GW recognises the value of full strength GC's come the wolftime.

[Gaymer1991]

ok, I'll think on it and get back to you guys. lots of great ideas!

[Grey Mage]

 

1) I know it's a basic sentence and I should be able to understand what it means, but could you flesh out your 1000% exact meaning for "The actual origin is known, but a closely held secret by the brothers of the taskforce."?

Basically that they know theyre a lost company, but they dont publish that fact, because they dont want to be recalled, or their continued failure to find Russ to reflect upon their chapter. Its been so long, so far, so much has happened.

 

2) Did I miss something? Which seceret? Their origin? "this ties in with the chapters secret"

 

 

Its the humans, who run the government- called the administratum- and their fear of marines that keeps the SWs from being a legion, like in good old days. Since this company left when those things were common knowledge, and very close to the heart, theyd still hold it against mortal men perhaps.

 

 

3)"and with the feeling of those who would have been founded by legions and then cut off from the fold"?

 

Simple enough- every chapter would have at one point been part of a legion, each legion had a primarch... and none of them are now with us. All either dead protecting the emperors dream, or lost as lesser men screwed it up. There is a longing in a marines heart for their primarch, they are designed to follow them and protect them above all else.

 

 

 

4)"perhaps using gene-stock of terran descent from the veteran cadre that led the great hunt as the mainstay of their gene-lines" I know your talking about stabalizing the gene-seed because of what happened to the WBs. But what exactly gene-stock of terran (earth right?) descent or any of the rest of that REALLY means, I'm a bit lost.

 

Before the emperor found Fenris, there were still Space Wolves... they were recruited from Earth, Terra, and implanted with the same gene-seed later used on native fenrisians. Which proves it *can* be done. It isnt done anymore, because the complications that arise when gene-seed is used on non fenrisians is usually fatal.

 

But why? Perhaps, for sake of argument, its because it was changed once it was implanted in fenrisians but something in their genetic structure. Which has further and further specialized it to work with those people, and further and further away from the rest of humanity.

 

5) I wonder if the SW may look upon them and whatever they've done to stabalize the gene-seed as a personal form of heresy and sort of spitting in the face of the WBs.

 

Unlikely that they would know- unless they destroyed one or more of the implants, its also unlikely theyd be upset. Priests were working on doing this on Fenris itself, in the Fang before the thousand sons wrecked much of it. I imagine theyd actually be quite excited.

 

6) SWs in general are fairly norse in their fluff, I think we can all agree. I was thinking about making these guys a tad more Gaelic (many norse assimilated into the gaelic culture and brought some of thier own culture with them, making them similar matches) or other culture similar but not quite 100% as norse like as the SW are. Just so they aren't just SWs lost in space, but have their own culture based off of SW but different enough (after so many thousands of years) that they are their own thing.

 

 

Sure, why not? Maybe in that region of space red hair is more common, and they favor rougher worlds where people tend to raise flocks and fight raids on each other. Wouldnt be hard to describe. Space Marines like a hardy people- and it doesnt get much hardier than the Scots ;)

 

[Nrthstar]

Technically would of won... bah, I beat you fair and square, sure if the shop wasn't closing you would have won in the 7th, but that's variable game length for ya! Grey knights... just so damn hard to kill.

 

Be easy on him, he's a local to me, and new, although I did warn him about the fang haha. I didn't realized when we were talking before that this started with Deathwatch. You got space wolves as a roll here because that book isn't even written by GW, it's by Fantasy Flight with GWs approval, so there can and will be fluff gaps in this. But GM and the boys have you on the right path with a lost chapter.

[Gaymer1991]

Yeah, not perfect. I'm a dude, prone to exageration. And, as I said, it was partially because I still got TDM stuck on the brain instead of objectives. lol.

 

That makes alot more sense. Though I am still planning on pushing forward with them. Nothing is set in stone with it, but I'm really liking them so far.