Winning the Long War in 7th! We can do this!

[battle captain corpus]

Athrillay Vilas!

 

Just being a bit heretical here, but what are we thinking is going to excel for us in 7th?

 

I really want this to be a positive and constructive thread to help supply those of us with hobby in our hearts to hunker down and enjoy Chaos in 7th Edt! :)

 

Lets really crank it up a gear! Lets get those juices flowing and have some cool ideas on how 7th can make Chaos the greatest we have seen them!

 

So as I have asked:

 

What will we excel at in 7th and why?

 

BCC

 

(Oh and extra kudos cookies to the internet hero who can remember what my greeting means ;) )

 

[GreyCrow]

Heldrake unbound armies !

Damn you Heretics !

EDIT : That was tongue in cheek, I actually like the concept of Unbound, and being a Space Marine player, I would totally enjoy playing against a full Heldrake army. That'd be pretty awesome Dragon Hunting

[Dam13n]

I'm quite liking the Idea of Crimson Slaughter: Tzeentch Mutilators, Khorne Possessed and Tzeentch Warp Talons.  With a ML3 Voices Malefic Sorcerer and an Allied Malefic Herald of Tzeentch (to hopefully get at least one Cursed Earth) they could be a beastly combat army.

 

Those turns where you get lucky and the possessed have a 2++, the Warp Talons don't scatter (and land in the Cursed Earth zone, so have a 3++ save).  Could make for a fun assault list.  Doubly so if you can charge out of a stationary Rhino again.

 

You'd also have some summoning power, for those extra units of Bloodletters to truly combat saturate, Horrors for extra Warp Charges, Plaguebearers for objective camping and Daemonettes for objective grabbing.  Not to mention the more specialised Daemon packs you can summon.

 

If the rumours about consolidation into other units is true, it could be quite horrible when the claws sink in.

 

Who'd have thought that my first idea would contain 3 units that were utterly reviled in 6th... certainly not me (a few weeks ago).

[the jeske]

Demon rule gives +5inv and fear. buff to oblits and possessed that are not CS.

Mass Shoting good. Chaos can mass shot with the best of them , by spawning more shoting units.

Shoty FMC got better . Chaos has realy good shoty FMC[Kairos , lash armed slany DPS, Belfegor].

On high density terrain tables we can actualy use biomancy and FMC to assault.

Unbound buffs casual lists under 1999. Which means that GW listens to people that test their army books .

Nerf to D , makes our death stars safer and better thent they were in 6th.[the dawn of tau]

We hace cheap units so sacrfice , no one plays the psychic game as good as chaos and very few armies play it just as good [without unbound].

That pre errate Helldrake .

 

As long as someone doesn't want to use csm or csm class models 7th looks awesome for chaos players.

 

 

Those turns where you get lucky and the possessed have a 2++, the Warp Talons don't scatter (and land in the Cursed Earth zone, so have a 3++ save).

 

I would like to point out that unless MoT gets errated we won't get 2++. on tzeench marked models

[Dam13n]

I was referring to the Slaves to the Voices giving a 3++, improved by Cursed Earth to a 2++.

 

No MoT, but MoK to make them hit a little harder when they hit.

[Prot]

I'm quite liking the Idea of Crimson Slaughter: Tzeentch Mutilators, Khorne Possessed and Tzeentch Warp Talons.  With a ML3 Voices Malefic Sorcerer and an Allied Malefic Herald of Tzeentch (to hopefully get at least one Cursed Earth) they could be a beastly combat army.

 

Those turns where you get lucky and the possessed have a 2++, the Warp Talons don't scatter (and land in the Cursed Earth zone, so have a 3++ save).  Could make for a fun assault list.  Doubly so if you can charge out of a stationary Rhino again.

 

If the rumours about consolidation into other units is true, it could be quite horrible when the claws sink in.

 

Who'd have thought that my first idea would contain 3 units that were utterly reviled in 6th... certainly not me (a few weeks ago).

 

The assault rumours were false.... so we are still looking at a very pro-shooty edition.

 

That being said, the rumours about Divination/Prescience were also false so Yay Crimson Slaughter psycher (my favourite unit in the 'dex).

 

The false rumour of 'remove cover' being 'reduced cover' maintains the Bale-Drake but what about the nerf to Vector strike on a non-monstrous creature?

 

I always wish we had drop pods for even more scoring action in 7th BUT at least the Rhino just got a little bit more useful (when transporting troops) for 'objective secured'.

[the jeske]

Technily possible in choir lists , but against most normal 7th list one of those is going to be stoped. + IMO demons should always be the primary army for any chaos list . Kairos+3-4 tzeench heralds are like oblits and 2DPS in 5th or cultists in 6th.

[minigun762]

Drakes AP2 vector strikes makes them better tank busters and can pick on Riptides now. You still can murder whole squads with them.

[Sception]

Tzeentch daemons seem like the big winners overall.

 

On the CSM side, the princes took a big nerf (the assault restriction cuts their melee threat out from under them, and the persistence of power restrictions on aligned casters in CSM lists means our princes don't have the support utility of C:CD princes to make up for it).

 

That would immediately lead me to believe Crimson Slaughter will be the way to go, since their main drawback was lacking quality melee weapons for their princes, and that no longer matters.  Yes, all of CSMs get divination now, but Crimson Slaughter gets that and daemonology without the extra perils threat - though they can only hide such a character in a possessed unit, so... eh?

 

All in all, I think it's going to be a lot like it has been for us, only without the mace princes, but I certainly am not the type to really grasp things without seeing them play out a few times.

[Prot]

Drakes AP2 vector strikes makes them better tank busters and can pick on Riptides now. You still can murder whole squads with them.

 

So old vector strike rules still apply? I heard we didn't get the bonus anymore (reserved for M.C.s).  Picking on Riptides is something I can benefit greatly from. I think I'll add an additional one to my lists in 7th.

[minigun762]

 

 

Drakes AP2 vector strikes makes them better tank busters and can pick on Riptides now. You still can murder whole squads with them.

So old vector strike rules still apply? I heard we didn't get the bonus anymore (reserved for M.C.s). Picking on Riptides is something I can benefit greatly from. I think I'll add an additional one to my lists in 7th.

Not sure on the extra d3 yet but just the fact that AP2 matters now for destroying a vehicles helps.

[Trevak Dal]

Much like the excellent short story in Treacheries of the Space Marines, we 'win' the Long War by not fighting it and doing our own thing.

[Sception]

I think the real question is not whether we can win the long war against the Imperium, but whether the B&C forums can win the long war against their server and database issues.

[Spaz431]

Vector lost the d3+1. It is now 1 hit vs landbound & d3 vs flyers or FMC.

[Sception]

But it's AP2, so it's sort of a wash against fliers. Against ground it's nowhere near as effective, but balefire is still amazing. You do need to come up with something else to pop transports before burning the contents now, but it's not like predators, auto or las havocs, and obliterators were bad or unpopular choices anyway.

[TheDevourer]

I'm really liking some of the spells belakor can now knock out in combination with deathstars, be they csm or daemons. Making them reach opponents gun lines reliably with good cover saves and only being hit with snapshots seems kind of great

[Kilofix]

Buff to vehicles (and Helbrute formations got even better as a result) - since you can't one shot them without Lascannon / Melta.

 

Buff to all our HQs with large number of Attacks in Challenges.

 

Nurglings now are Scoring (Swarm no longer says cannot Score), have Objective Secured and are cheap.

 

With the right HQ, Cult Units / Chosen can be Troops with Objective Secured.

 

Buff to Thousand Sons Cult Units with Aspiring Sorcs.

[incinerator950]

Yeah, its starting to... sound good. 

[RapatoR]

Also ability to have quite a big number of HQs in Battleforged armies is also a huge boon. Also it seems that thanks to this we will be able take more than 2 types of cult units as troops (before you could take max 2 HQs).

[TheDevourer]

I'm totally in love with nurglings now being fairly good :). Now I can finally start building the models, nurgle bless their bare buttocks :P

[tbone]

Just thought a Tzeentch Mace Daemon Prince with Be'Lakor maybe a nice combo.  'ol Be'Lakor can keep the Prince shrouded giving him a 2+ rerollable :D

[Xenith]

^^ Invisibility doesn't work like that now: snapshots only instead of shrouded/stealth.

 

And your TZ prince cannot swoop and charge in the same turn.

[Zhukov]

Hate to say it, but I'm afraid CSM is pretty damn bad in 7th. Daemons gotta do the heavy lifting even more. We still lack efficient units, especially now that the Heldrake (and FMC's in a different way) is nerfed. Heldrakes their vector strikes were really needed against Wave Serpents for example. I feel we cannot any longer compete with at least Eldar, maybe others too, but time will tell.

 

Oh, what we excell at? Honestly, I got no clue. I guess we still excell at killing infantry with Baleflamers? Lol.

[TheDevourer]

I still like the idea of a maulerrush list with belakor and some daemon allies, possibly run as cs for the lord.

 

But thats about all the ideas I have for a csm list.

 

Daemons on the other hand have a lot more interesting options, will be play testing some chariots soonish and seeing how well one can run nurglings as troops.

[tbone]

^^ Invisibility doesn't work like that now: snapshots only instead of shrouded/stealth.

 

And your TZ prince cannot swoop and charge in the same turn.

Pretty sure "shrouding" does shrouded now ;) 

Just have to keep him within 6 inches though...which is somewhat limiting