Malefic Shopping List

[MaliGn]

So, I'm trying to decide which daemonic units to prioritise in terms of purchasing order. I'm keen on the idea of a Word Bearers daemonologist but don't want to field one without sufficient daemons to summon. Taking the powers separately what should I buy in each category?

 

Summoning: I'm thinking initially horrors and bloodletters, maybe followed by more horrors and some flesh hounds I reckon 3 units would be more than enough to cover a game.

Incursion: bloodcrushers then screamers, maybe fiends again three units.

Conjuration: herald of tzeentch, then nurgle? Also what should I spend the thirty points on?

Possession: bloodthirster, then waiting to see if plastic kits arrive?

 

This seems like a lot of cash to fork out for a psychic power, but it will net me most of a daemon army along the way. What do you think?

 

Maybe pick up a battle force to start with and go from there? Gives enough options to use summoning and conjuration, but is it the best value for money? Could add in a bunch of heralds and a bloodthirster after that and top out at about 150gbp

[Hellrender]

i would do daemonnettes instead of bloodletters. Daemonettes are faster, and can be very deadly. Agree with the pink horrors. Also consider a unit of Plague bearers for cover objective camping, which can be very good in Maelstrom missions.

 

For possession you want to look at a Lord of Change. Melee FMC are quite hard nerfed, and the Lord of Change comes as a psyker. Still, a bloodthirster spawning midgame if still very deadly.

[Leif Bearclaw]

This seems like a lot of cash to fork out for a psychic power, but it will net me most of a daemon army along the way. What do you think?

 

I think someone at GW is having a 'Just As Planned' moment.

[Forté]

 

 

This seems like a lot of cash to fork out for a psychic power, but it will net me most of a daemon army along the way. What do you think?

 

I think someone at GW is having a 'Just As Planned' moment.

Yup.

[Xenith]

Hmm. A Word Bearers daemon summoning army, you say?

 

That sounds like a plan I may have to steal. With the daemon item from C:CS.

 

edit: Although....£90 quids worth of book, not including rulebook to run the army? bleargh.

[the jeske]

If you have no demons . you need

6 tzeench heralds , magnetized and at least 4 should be on discs. 

50 horrors ,

6 seekers ,

6 drones.

1 kairos ,

2 GD/DPs ,

10 flesh hounds ,

10 PB ,

20 demonetts.

This more or less gives you a start for a summoning list and , if you like it you may branch out in to a demon FMC  list .

[Forté]

If you have no demons . you need

6 tzeench heralds , magnetized and at least 4 should be on discs.

50 horrors ,

6 seekers ,

6 drones.

1 kairos ,

2 GD/DPs ,

10 flesh hounds ,

10 PB ,

20 demonetts.

This more or less gives you a start for a summoning list and , if you like it you may branch out in to a demon FMC list .

http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/250x250/44072781.jpg

[MaliGn]

If you have no demons . you need

6 tzeench heralds , magnetized and at least 4 should be on discs. 

50 horrors ,

6 seekers ,

6 drones.

1 kairos ,

2 GD/DPs ,

10 flesh hounds ,

10 PB ,

20 demonetts.

This more or less gives you a start for a summoning list aknd , if you like it you may branch out in to a demon FMC  list .

Well that absolutely doesn't answer my question, thanks.

[Forté]

The answer is...there is no answer. It's not a tried and tested power set yet so use proxies for now. You may even find that the power set is over hyped and people learn to counter it quickly.

 

Or you could just drop a ton on daemon minis and find you only use them for a month. But at least you'll have a Daemon army to play with too (as Jeske mentioned so you may want to change your last post as he did answer your question).

[MaliGn]

I'm not going to be dropping a whole bunch of cash on the issue as I simply don't have it to spend, I was more curious as to how the potential in each spell could be best planned for. Jeske provided a full army list to use rather than looking at the summoned section alone. I'm trying to get a feel for the utility of the units that can be summoned in order to best prioritise any eventual purchases. Proxy is probably the best shout for the time being but it is leading me back to an old plan of creating more generic daemonic entities to use as summoned lesser daemons from the last book. That way they would always be 'counts as' so long as I'm clear about what I summon and I don't have identical models being used as say both daemonettes and blood letters on opposite sides of the table.

[the jeske]

So, I'm trying to decide which daemonic units to prioritise in terms of purchasing order

Summoning: I'm thinking initially horrors and bloodletters, maybe followed by more horrors and some flesh hounds I reckon 3 units would be more than enough to cover a game.

Incursion: bloodcrushers then screamers, maybe fiends again three units.

Conjuration: herald of tzeentch, then nurgle? Also what should I spend the thirty points on?

Possession: bloodthirster, then waiting to see if plastic kits arrive?

 

And I listed what to buy . How does it not anwser to question which models to prioritse buying of demon.

 

 

The answer is...there is no answer. It's not a tried and tested power set yet so use proxies for now. You may even find that the power set is over hyped and people learn to counter it quickly.

 

 

Not true . A lot of people had the rule book for a month or so . Sure they had to test builds with FAQin mind [like how would demons codex and summoning would work or how it would errated , but the new FAQ more or less shows that it works the way people tested it]  , but GW was a gracious master this time and demons were touched much by the changes [of the fAQs , the FMC changes alone would have been enough to change some builds].

[Sception]

What's the hate here? Malign asked opinions on what daemons to get, Jeske made his suggestions, forte and Malign jump down his throat? What the warp, guys?

[MaliGn]

I misunderstood jeske's post was all, still don't get where kairos fitted in mind, plus I don't get the magnetisation of the heralds. How many points is a disk? Can a summoned herald even use one as a result? These were the kind of things I was asking for, preferably with a bit of an explanation.

[Sception]

Kairos can be used as a generic lord of change for summoning, or can be run as himself if you ever ally or primary a daemon detachment. Magnetize or otherwise convert your heralds of tzeentch so that you can put them on disks or on foot - use them on foot when summoning them, and on disks if you ever bring them as an allied or primary detachment (hence x4, out of the six or so you'd like to have access to).

 

In general, you want at least some of most everything you can summon, because they have different uses, so it's nice to have options on the fly. You can ditch the 10 letters you might otherwise get for 10 daemonettes, as they're pretty much the same, but rending is more versatile than AP3. However, you want a ton of those options that, when summoned, can then summon more stuff - hence the large numbers of horrors and tzeentch heralds.

 

Frankly, however, conjurations conjuring more conjurations is just hideously broken. But even if that gets killed in future errata, as I expect it to, such units still add to your power pool, allowing your initially purchased casters to spam more conjurations anyway - which will mean allying in those four heralds will be all the more significant.

 

If you're not cheesing out conjuration as hard as possible, you can drop the suggested horrors pool down to around 20, and the suggested tzeentch heralds down to 2 to 4. Maybe add another 10 plague bearers to the list, and maybe heralds for nurgle and slaanesh if you drop the tzeentch heralds to less than 4.

[MaliGn]

Thanks for that, I think I may have hit on a rough plan to begin with then, if I start by only ever taking one roll on demonology and swap for primaris whatever the result, thereby concentrating on the Summoning spell to begin with and picking up a bunch of horrors, then a battleforce since I have about two dozen old daemonettes to use already. that then gives me a good mix to get started with before fleshing out the collection fully for incursion and conjuration, and ultimately possession. At my current purchasing rate we'll be on eighth edition by then anyway.

[Forté]

What's the hate here? Malign asked opinions on what daemons to get, Jeske made his suggestions, forte and Malign jump down his throat? What the warp, guys?

Chill out. I wasn't jumping down anyone's throat but stating that the question was answered even if it wasn't the answer the OP wanted.

 

And due to this taking the usual gaming route of moaning...I'm out. Have fun.

[Tenebris]

Well my plan is the following:

 

The summoning cabal:

 

11 Horrors of Tzeentch, Herald of Tzeentch, these start on the board.

 

As summons are hopefully successful my conjurations will appear in this order. 1. Horrors, 2. Flamers, 3. Screamers, 4. Screamers... then simply recycle the losses. Why Flamers (and I already hear Jeske grumbling in far away Russia), well because they burn things to crisps and are a nice unit if you get to line up those template attacks. 

 

What follows is Screamers and more Screamers, an effective unit which does a nice amount of damage. 

 

If I am to conjure Heralds my option would be first an Exalted Flamer for more burning and then more Heralds. I I get possession then the Lord of Change is my go to option.

 

But overall my buying list should I start from scratch would be the following:

 

2x Horrors of Tzeentch

Burning Chariot (you get the Herald model, 2 Screamer models, 2 Horror models and the Exalted Flamer model all nice and for cheap)

 

Done this part I would move on the following:

 

1x Seekers of Slaanesh

1x Plaguebearers

1x Daemonettes

 

Lord of Change

 

If you have then some money left, buy some Khorne doggies and perhaps some extra Daemonettes.

 

But overall I advise you to always have an unit of Plaguebearers in your bag, the Poison attacks and Hull Points damage can be a real blessing should you be able to get that charge off. A nice precaution should some nasty MC be headed your way. 

 

In the end do not overdo it. Horrors are essential and the Herald of Tzeentch too. The rest is your preference once you learn more about your meta, but you will not go wrong with Daemonettes. 

[Nehekhare]

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_g8OVShPbJA0/S7APpTDiboI/AAAAAAAAAPI/iQkaKsQA17c/s1600/cocbag01.jpg

[Shuggnuggath]

The cynic in me says that once GW feels that everyone has gone hog-wild and bought a massive bunch of daemons to summon, their sales people will be happy. They will then release an errata that caps casting dice pool at a lowish number or adds an addendum that players may only summon one unit per turn (in order to keep most of the non chaos players happy).

 

 

 

I'm old enough to remember the days of the White Dwarf deamons update with the flamers and screamers of tzeentch madness...

[Xenith]

I'm old enough to remember the days of the White Dwarf deamons update with the flamers and screamers of tzeentch madness...

So you're what, two?

[Smurfalypse]

What I am finding in games that I have played, is that if you use your Conjurations toward the end of the game (or when you have nothing else to do) that is the best use of them. Spamming units early just slows the game down and irritates everyone involved. Better to wait till later and support your army with clutch summons at key points.

 

As far as units go, I have a large Daemon army and I tend to just bring my entire case of Daemons when I play now. I go about summoning exactly the unit that would be best suited to the situation. Vs a GK player I started summoning Bloodletters and he backed off a bit and started boltering knowing that the Letters would waste him in CC. Vs an AM player this last weekend I started summoning some Screamers who would Turbo-Boost over his Command Squads (inflicting the hits) and then threaten his back line tanks, forcing him to shoot them. Vs an Ork player last week I summoned some Horrors to use to Flickering Fire his larger units a bit. Just get a unit of each and plug and play whatever is best at that moment, that is by far and away the best way to use them tactically and it also allows you to collect a wide spread of models.

[lfhoule]

  Just to add on a couple of added thoughts. The first is that seeing that Heralds of all types get 30 pts of add ons when the come in, the first one coming in should have the PortalGlyph. 1 D6  a turn of lesser daemons once deployed on a 4+ may not seem like much, but your not risking Perils. The second, to try to save money, would be to try to make Heralds from the basic lesser daemon kits, particularly if you already have lesser daemon of the same type (like daemonettes). I know you can with the daemonette kit (2 in fact), don't about the others. The third would be, depending on your gaming group and / or store, would be to seek out alternate models for the heralds, particularly the Reaper Bones stuff. As others have said, who knows how long this madness will go on before this gets nerfed hard, so why spend $20+  per herald when one can spend $3?