New player list question.

[Vich]

Hey all new guy here. After trying a few different armies paint schemes I decided to go with DA (it's all about the robes). I then proceeded to buy whatever I could cheap. So do far in my possession I have 3 tac squads 4 dv terminator squads the bikes and commanders from tge dv set. 2 venerable dreadnaughts a standard dread and adrop pod. I am planning on doing a deathwing based list. What I am after is peoples opinion on what I should be buying next/aiming for and if I can make a list with what I have. I'd like to include the dreadnaughts if possible as love the models and would also like some dwathwing knights in there uf possible(again they look awesome). Will be playing at 1500 points at first hopefully up to 2k in time. Thanks in advance.

[aura_enchanted]

I'd start with a lower number but that's just me:

 

Deathwing are a funny army, and simply spamming dv termies is nog enough to get a job done.

 

Bringing the dreads will help in that respect but the big thing your going to want is assault terminators (hammers and shields & lightning claws mixed togeather).

 

Another thing your going to want is belial. Belial makes all your terminators troops choices. Equip him however, most give him a hammer and shield as well but you do as you wish.

 

As for the dreads. If your going to field them it should be something like so:

 

1 ven dread in a pod with p fist, flamer and mm

 

1 normal (or ven) dread on foot with missles, and lascannon

 

 

Dread one drops safely behind cover and then plods up to the enemy and smashes the first toys he can reach

 

Normal dread is a tank hunter blasting vehicles from a distance, he can also supply a few powerful shots when he has the opportunity.

[Vich]

Cool cool. The dv termies were cheal I wasn't planning on spamming them just stating what I had :) will transport come in handy for termies? Or is that later on? And by lower number you mean points? Or model count? Is a death wing army still viable by the way? Or am I being slightly ambitious? Sorry for all tge questions. Vich.

[Vich]

Cool cool. The dv termies were cheapI wasn't planning on spamming them just stating what I had :) will transport come in handy for termies? Or is that later on? And by lower number you mean points? Or model count? Is a death wing army still viable by the way? Or am I being slightly ambitious? Sorry for all tge questions. Vich.

Damn double post. ..

[aura_enchanted]

Cool cool. The dv termies were cheal I wasn't planning on spamming them just stating what I had :) will transport come in handy for termies? Or is that later on? And by lower number you mean points? Or model count? Is a death wing army still viable by the way? Or am I being slightly ambitious? Sorry for all tge questions. Vich.

Transports would be useful yes, terminators can only be transported in land raiders(with an upgrade) and drop pods.

 

The deathwing "pure" army is viable in casual matches. I wouldn't field them in competitions simply because of the way it works and the amount of hard counters those armies will have.

 

Also deathwing knights are a viable unit, they tend to be delivered via a drop pod.

[Disciple of Caliban Sgt]

Deathwing Knights can't fit in a Drop Pod. Besides why would you drop pod Knights they Deep Strike anyway.

 

Exception to this is the Space Wolves get Terminators in Drop Pods. As far as I know they are it.

 

DoC

[Disciple of Caliban Sgt]

Vich,

 

To add something besides negativity to the discussion here goes. Deathwing only armies will work but I've found only at around 2000pts. Lower than that and you just run out of guys fast. Aura has the right of it about there being a lot of hard counters to DW. Remember we are slow being termi's and they don't exactly shoot a ton. They all have Power Fists at the very least but they usually go last. So if you can survive the onslaught you can usually pulp a few of your enemy. This problem is that most of our DW only have two attacks so max of three on the charge. 5 guys that's 15 attacks on the charge with the Sarge having a power sword to thin some guys out first. Not exactly stellar Close Combat there. This does fine if you look at it as a one on one scenario. Say one Tac Squad vs a 5 man termi unit you might actually win (this is all ignoring shooting I'll get to that in a minute) but it will take probably two turns if you are lucky. Against a dedicated assault unit you probably will get slaughtered by weight of attacks.

 

The standard "answer" to terminators by most armies especially in 6th and probably in 7th edition is to shoot them off the table. Once again you can only make so many 2+ saves and then your five man 250 pts unit just got erased vs some guard guy bringing 50 - 70 guys for the same 250 pts. Guard "flashlights" or lasguns are the worst for taking out my Termi's.

 

So what does this mean? DW are a good "elite" army and probably do mass terminators better than anyone else. But you will probably have one of two types of games when you play.........either a very hard fought win or you will probably get annihilated rather quickly. At least that's what usually happens to me when I play them. DW make you learn the game a little more I like to think. The reason is unlike other armies you don't have "throw away" units. You either sacrifice them to murder something of the opponents that cripples his army or you just "wasted" that unit is often how I find it to work. Once again movement is pretty limited with DW as well so it makes you think about the game in terms of not just next turn but two or three turns ahead.

 

So it is a tough army and can be frustrating. My learning curve was huge the first couple of years I played with them. They also don't allow a lot of room for the fancy fun toys that you might want to bring. Bringing a Ravenwing and Deathwing or Dualwing lets you have an answer for your mobility and I find it is a good answer for my Melta anti tank at range needs. Add to this the bikes have teleport homers which lets me deepstrike without scatter so I can fit those termi's in tight spots and not worry so much.

 

If you want a good dedicated assault unit for DW look at the Deathwing Knights. One of the best Assault units in the game I've found.

 

A good army to start with if you have patience and can stand losing a lot until you figure out exactly what you are doing with them. But completely different playstyle than what you get with MEQ.

 

Hope that helps

DoC

[Vich]

Cheers for the long reply doc. I think I may try a mixed army and go from there. I have so far been recommended dw knights black knights and devastators so they may all be good boxes to pick up and just see what I prefer. Deathwing was what I wanted to play but can see the lack of mobility being an issue. Away from the whole Deathwing idea can anyone reckon a good starter list of say 1000 points? Hopefully using some things I already have. Thanks again. Voxh

[Disciple of Caliban Sgt]

Vich,

 

From what you listed two squads of tac's would be good (whatever wargear fits) one or both of the Commanders from the DV set are good. Run the Libby as a basic libby max ML2 nothing else special but maybe a PFG and then a regular Company Master if you want one. Keep in mind your Tac's will be your "heavy lifters" meaning they should be what you count on for weight of fire etc. You have a pod so a Dreadnought could be fun to throw in as well. Last one unit of Deathwing or Bikes depending on what you have points wise wouldn't be bad. I try and take at least one troop for every 500 points I play and it seems to work well. If you are playing with something with a lot of objectives then you can combat squad and get four troops out of them. Bikes if you are playing, needing or wanting the mobility or let your Deathwing Deepstrike in off your drop pods locator beacon (if you pay the points for it). One squad of Deathwing and a Dreadnought should be a nice little problem for your opponent to deal with. If you know what kind of army your opponent is bringing I could give some more advice but I would try something like that and see what units you actually really enjoy.

 

No matter what you read on the net (yes including here even, though B&C is the best forum I've found for advice) nothing beats actual game play with lots of units. Speaking of practice with those units a lot. I mean at least 6 - 10 games each unit and you will get a good idea of how to play them and what they are good at.

 

DoC

[Vich]

Perfect thanks again doc. What is an ML2 librarian? And a pfg? With a plain libby 2 tacs with plasa gun/cannon combo, a venerable dread, a drop pod with a homing beacon and a termy squad with ac and chain fist I'm at 820 points. My next question is what weapons should I be taking on the dread? And how to fill in the last points? Thanks again.

[Aradiel]

Mastery Level 2 librarian, Power Field Generator

[Vich]

Cheers Aradiel.

[Aegnor]

You can use the captain from DV as Azrael and he'll make your Terminators and Bikes troops as well. With his Lion Helm he also makes the unit you stick him a bit harder to kill.

[Disciple of Caliban Sgt]

Sorry Vich should have spelled that out.

 

But Azrael takes you 35 pts over. So you can go with Azrael or just a plain ole Chapter Master. Give him artificer armor and a Power weapon and a combi plasma and you'll still have points to spare. You could give him a few relics though. I always like the Monster Slayer of Caliban but keep in mind it is very random and many people don't like it. I will admit it is expensive for 45 pts but a lot of fun if you roll well with it on the table 2+ strength is a lot of fun. Also you can have the Lion's Roar which is the combi plasma small blast weapon. So if you attach him to a Tac Squad for one round of shooting you'd have a Plasma Gun and two small blast plasma shots. If you have extra points after that Melta Bombs are a good back up on the Sergeants in case they run into something like your dread.

 

For kitting out my Dread in a pod I always add a Heavy Flamer instead of Storm Bolter the Flamer always does way more for me than the bolter. I like Assault Cannons personally as they are good against light transports if you need him to also it has a enough high strength shots to really hurt a unit. Having him venerable also helps make sure those four shots hit. A lot of people like to Muli Melta the drop pod dread so it kills a tank. My problem is it usually either misses or I don't do well enough on my vehicle damage roll to do much. If I am lucky enough to kill my intended target after that I have a one shot Strenght 8 gun that doesn't do a lot for me.

 

I like to use my dreads as support as for my Tac Squad. They give a few shots to what the Tac's shot at hopefully maybe even flamer it then they can charge with a Strength 10 Dreadnought Close Combat Weapon and smash it. By this time the unit bugging your Tac Squad should be dead or very little threat.

 

Anyway I keep hijacking the thread so I'll leave someone else to give you other inputs.

DoC