Storm Raven as assault transport

[minigun762]

The single biggest problem with this idea for me is the threat of a crash wiping out the embarked unit.

 

To that end, would it be reasonable to put squads with Storm Shields inside to mitigate that risk?

 

This means either Hammer Terminators, Vanguard or a Command Squad .

[Augustus b'Raass]

Nope, as Storm Shields do not provide cover against this. Plus, why fear the crash? The Storm Eagle is a 12 all round flyer. Just swoop in, land en disembark. The risk is so slight (and is beaten by the power of cool) that you don;t have to worry about it.

[Kilofix]

Also with 7th, you can come in from initial Reserve (but not Ongoing Reserve) with a Flyer in Hover mode if you want to.

 

But, I have had a Flyer shot down by a Firestorm the turn in came in. Just avoid the dedicated Skyfire / Interceptors.

[Stickeh]

Maybe not as an assault transport, but what about a transport for a 5 man scout or tac squad with melta gun/combi? Cheap enough not to be a huge loss if the raven goes down, but annoying in their own right as an AT scoring unit. I've seen a couple of people play without any objective secured units holding their back objectives, could be a game winner against such opponents.

[minigun762]

Nope, as Storm Shields do not provide cover against this. Plus, why fear the crash? The Storm Eagle is a 12 all round flyer. Just swoop in, land en disembark. The risk is so slight (and is beaten by the power of cool) that you don;t have to worry about it.

Why wouldn't it provide a save?

[Acebaur]

Nope, as Storm Shields do not provide cover against this. Plus, why fear the crash? The Storm Eagle is a 12 all round flyer. Just swoop in, land en disembark. The risk is so slight (and is beaten by the power of cool) that you don;t have to worry about it.

Why wouldn't it provide a save?

It would. Crash and Burn! is a S10 AP2 hit, so a SS would allow you to take a save.

I think it's worth the risk unless your opponent has an ungodly amount of AA. I'd probably Zoom on, shoot some stuff, jink the next turn if necessary and then switch to hover mode and unleash hell on something the next turn. Alternatively if you have a sky shield landing pad you can start the game on it in hover mode and have a 4+ invul against shooting, then proceed to wreak havoc as you see fit

Edit: Another tactic depending on the durability of the unit you are transporting(and if shooting for a turn would benefit them)is you can deepstrike them using the Skie's of Fury rule. If you have a locator beacon you won't scatter as long as you deploy near enough to the Raven.

[minigun762]

Maybe not as an assault transport, but what about a transport for a 5 man scout or tac squad with melta gun/combi?.

I think that's the more reasonable option, it just doesn't fully utilize the assault ramp on the Raven.

[netminder69]

I wouldn't use Skies of Fury if it's an Assault oriented group. You can't assault after doing that since it is Deep Striking so you're leaving them sitting ducks until the next turn.

 

I have always used my SR as an assault platform with a unit of 5 TH/SS Termies and Asterion Moloc or Enkomi.

[minigun762]

I wouldn't use Skies of Fury if it's an Assault oriented group. You can't assault after doing that since it is Deep Striking so you're leaving them sitting ducks until the next turn.

 

I have always used my SR as an assault platform with a unit of 5 TH/SS Termies and Asterion Moloc or Enkomi.

How often have you lost your squad in a crash?

[Cornelias]

I'd go with a full 10 man assault scout squad, it's still not that expensive, they are scoring and can jump out safely without slowing the raven down.

[Augustus b'Raass]

Nope, as Storm Shields do not provide cover against this. Plus, why fear the crash? The Storm Eagle is a 12 all round flyer. Just swoop in, land en disembark. The risk is so slight (and is beaten by the power of cool) that you don;t have to worry about it.

Why wouldn't it provide a save?

It would. Crash and Burn! is a S10 AP2 hit, so a SS would allow you to take a save.

I think it's worth the risk unless your opponent has an ungodly amount of AA. I'd probably Zoom on, shoot some stuff, jink the next turn if necessary and then switch to hover mode and unleash hell on something the next turn. Alternatively if you have a sky shield landing pad you can start the game on it in hover mode and have a 4+ invul against shooting, then proceed to wreak havoc as you see fit

Edit: Another tactic depending on the durability of the unit you are transporting(and if shooting for a turn would benefit them)is you can deepstrike them using the Skie's of Fury rule. If you have a locator beacon you won't scatter as long as you deploy near enough to the Raven.

You're right. Sorry, I keep forgetting they made the SS unbelievable beardy and the most unrealistic thing in 40k. Back in 2nd you would get a 4+ save in a 90 degree arc in front only. Yes, I am an old fart. Blasts were out of the question unless coming from within that arc.

[Ishagu]

I put cheap little units in my Raven to score objectives.

I have seen it used for assault with great effect though.

[netminder69]

How often have you lost your squad in a crash?

 

Never. Truthfully, I'm fairly new to 40k and don't play tournaments. I come on towards the target of my assault, hover next turn (jinking if I need to) and disgorge the troops. Also, since I always run the Storm Wing, I can run interference with the Stormtalons to keep the targeting off the Raven. I'll come on hovering if the enemy target is close to my board edge. Also I utilize the terrain as I can. Going behind tall buildings, etc. to get cover on top of putting the talons between the Raven and the enemy skyfire unit.

[Acebaur]

 

How often have you lost your squad in a crash?

 

Never. Truthfully, I'm fairly new to 40k and don't play tournaments. I come on towards the target of my assault, hover next turn (jinking if I need to) and disgorge the troops. Also, since I always run the Storm Wing, I can run interference with the Stormtalons to keep the targeting off the Raven. I'll come on hovering if the enemy target is close to my board edge. Also I utilize the terrain as I can. Going behind tall buildings, etc. to get cover on top of putting the talons between the Raven and the enemy skyfire unit.

 

 

Just remember that you can't assault the turn you come in from reserves ;)

[Black Marshal]

actually I have lost my Death Company so many times that I started running it empty. But with an improved jink and the fact that I don't have to come on zooming means if the enemy has a lot of AA I just come in hovering and don't have to worry about my unit being blown to little tiny death company bits.

[GreyCrow]

It all depends about your list and what you're trying to do with it. I've seen Stormravens played as a delivery means for Assault units played to great extent, or failed miserably.

 

<-- An example of a beardy with Assault units.

 

<-- What happens when it crashes

 

IMHO, it all depends about your army and the role you expect to have for the Stormraven and the units it transports. I think there are at least 2 effective ways to play the Stormraven :

1) You mainly have a shooty defensive army that slowly advances up the field while making hell rain on your opponent, and the Stormraven is used as a breach vehicle so you can make a decisive push by dropping units right in the heart of the opponent. In which case, you want your units to be damaging enough or resilient enough so they can soak up fire from the rest of your force and allow it to move more freely. A Stormaven with 5 Terminators and a Dreadnought should cost about 600 points with a few upgrades.

 

2) You have a very aggressive army that uses rules like Scout, Deep Strike, Drop Pods heavily, and the Stormraven is used as a vehicle with immense firepower that can keep up with the rest of your force and bring the heavy weapons in their territory. In cases where the enemy firepower would damage your unit, then the Stormraven doubles up as a shield to deliver assault units that would be fast already (Jump Infantry, Motorized infantry) but that would be whittled down in the first 2 turns.

[minigun762]

I think what I'm trying to do is force a Raven to behave like a land raider when it would just be easier to use a land raider in the first place.

Bring the Raven as a gunship and maybe with a small squad for objectives.

[GreyCrow]

Perhaps, what exactly are you trying to deliver ? Assault Termis ? A Command Squad ? Vanguard Veterans ?

 

Reach is to the Stormraven what durability is to the Land Raider. If you're planning to deliver anything midfield, the Land Raider is probably a better bargain, but if you want to target anything backfield, then the Stormraven is a superior choice ;)

 

One other thing that differentiates the Raven from the Raider is that it can transport Jump Infantry. Which brings its reach even further !

[SyNidus]

I've actually gotten a lot of mileage from a stormraven transporting a fully kitted out 10 man tactical squad. Whether I go into hover or use skies of fury, this is such a great way to deliver a full squad of Bolter death along with providing some supporting fire. It's quite funny actually, managed to take Belakor from full to dead on the turn the stormraven comes in. The Raven grounded Belakor before my tactical squad unloaded everything at him.

 

As for an assault platform, I haven't tried that much because i find that it arrives too late to get the guys into effective assault.

[knife&fork]

Wouldn't a podded tac squad work just as well?

[Iron Father Ferrum]

Probably, but this way he doesn't have to worry about scatter.

[knife&fork]

But if he is to bring down a flying DP and then hit it with the tac squad, that means the raven is not in skimmer mode and thus the taq suqad can only deploy using skies of fury. 

 

Using a pod and only need to get within rapid fire distance you'd have to be extremely unlucky to scatter out  range. 

 

 

Of course this assumes we have multiple pods but why not? They are awesome.

[minigun762]

Perhaps, what exactly are you trying to deliver ? Assault Termis ? A Command Squad ? Vanguard Veterans ?

 

Fair question and the answer is I'm not sure.

Would be some sort of non-Terminator retinue for my HQ, that's all I got right now.

[SyNidus]

Well the purpose wasn't to bring down the DP, it just so happens it was the best option at that point in the game. By right the tactical should've stayed in the Raven until the last turn, after my Air Force has destroyed/weakened enemy threats, then my tacticals would come in to mop up and grab objectives.

 

I did have pods actually, but I dropped them empty for that game because I needed to keep my tacs safe until I could bring down their heavy firepower (I.e. Belakor and another DP).

[Azash]

The Raven as an assault transport is far from its hay day back in 5th mainly due to assault and transport nurfs over the last two editions.

 

If it comes on from reserve in turn 2 you can't assault till turn 3. Which is not any real improvement over deep striking terminators. Since you can't disembark from a transport that has moved more than 6" your range is limited on turn 3. This gives opponents time to react and essentially get out of the way. Against fast armies trying to assault out of the raven can be like trying to nail jello to the wall.

 

Then there is the issue of assault units and surviving a crash. The only unit that can survive a crash is ss/th termies. What do we use them for? Essentially they are good against rip tides and wraith knights/lords. Everything else that takes that many hits at that high of str is flying and can easily evade the assault attempts. The two units they are effective against grav can cut down in a round of shooting. Any sort of blob or high numbers unit and these guys are gonna bog down.

 

Units good against a blob run the risk of during if the thing lawn darts. So honor guard (no ss cause you want max attacks vs a blob), honor guard, command squad, and assault squads all make the raven a choice target with them inside.

 

Ironclads and other dread naughts just add to reasons to shoot and since the crash is ap2 they can still explode.

 

To much risk for to little reward. A land raider makes a better assault transport in this case. It puts your unit in combat on turn 2 and its tougher.

 

If you go hover mode with units inside well your an armor 12 speeder that's 200+ pts and one of the most fire power laden units in the army. Talk about making it a priority for your opponent. Then the 6" movement to disembarking rule kicks in and your still not assaulting till turn 2 (maybe) and your just a more vulnerable target.

 

Its so much more valuable as a gunship than it is as a transport. Personally a squad of bolter scouts are the ideal unit to transport in the raven.