Abnett's Rout vs. King's Space Vikings

[GrandMagnus]

I'm just utterly psyched to see what FW does with the Wolves. I see a horde of new SW fans in the near future....

Oh I will most likely revisit my original 40k force when they do :D

[SW1]

I'm cautiously approaching the SW's at the moment. Just selecting the SW models in appropriate armour for HH to start with. Then will be adding resin models to the mix. I might even let my metal 40k SW's go if the HH force gets too big.

[Chaplain ChonkE]

Both versions are good. Just like all the versions of the Conan properties (except the Khal Drogo one) had moments; the comics (which range from lifted from the Howard pages to Kull the Conqueror), Conan the Adventurer cartoon's phoenix pet parrot talking, Arnie going "Crom!" with that bewildered look. I love all of that stuff. Then again I love Toho Godzilla flicks and John Carpenter movies. Still, the King version as stated earlier is so much lighter in tone and likely written for a younger audience (with more stereotypical hooks/themes) than Abnett's book. Abnett was keeping it gritty and real and as ADB said the version of tribal superstition and warfare on the ice plains of Fenris was freaking awesome. So awesome. Just like Conan, both iterations of the Wolves are worlds apart in so many ways but carry that purity of "barbarian" life versus the corruption of civilization (ADB's post explained that beautifully btw) which is a theme that sings to me and if you can carry that, you pretty much got me hooked.

 

King spun enjoyable mind fodder books on the Wolves; tales of blood and thunder with your typical over-the-top lead. Abnett spun a tale semi-mired in history/reality (cheekily referred to in the book) tied in with the Space Opera of 40k and kept his Wolves nitty gritty in the HH framework. I enjoy both iterations! Sometimes you want a bit of badassery and grim dark and sometimes you want a little fun. While I might skip through the parts in King's Wolves where Sven cracks jokes about his farts making the Warp Translocation quicker I will still champion Grey Hunter as one of the more tightly written BL books around. I would be curious as to how King would handle Lemon[sic] Russ. Abnett is top drawer and Horus Rising is just a monster novel and probably the best in the library. That was like 400 pages of dynamite.

[Hyaenidae]

I'm just utterly psyched to see what FW does with the Wolves. I see a horde of new SW fans in the near future....

Oh I will most likely revisit my original 40k 30k force when they do

Fixed that for you.

:P

[Frosco Toppings]

 

 

Would love to see a skilled authour develop the BA. James Swallow just doesn't do it for me. There was almost no legion-building in Fear to Tread. The BA came across as bland, vanilla marines in red power armour who get angry sometimes. 

 

 

A real shame that as they are my favourite legion. I guess he's just another author that can't breathe life into space marines - I really liked his assassin characters in Nemesis

[Leif Bearclaw]

Why did you have to remind me Nemesis happened???

 

It was shocking. The worst non Goto BL book I've read, and 3/4 of the reasons why I'm not a fan of Swallow (the rest being his inability to count in his 40k BA series), yet his SoB books were alright....

[b1soul]

I haven't been impressed by anything by Swallow. I have heard that Master of Mankind will feature a BA main character. I'll keep my fingers crossed.

[Daddywarcrimes]

I have to acknowledge that Eisenstein wasn't bad.

[b1soul]

I have to acknowledge that Eisenstein wasn't bad.

 

Was that the one with Decius? Yeah...couldn't get through it. Different strokes for different folks. 

[Aegnor]

Eisenstein and the Garro audio. Are head and shoulders James Swallow's best stuff in my view.

[mc warhammer]

Eisenstein is the only Swallow I've read, and I found it so empty headed that I had to force myself to finish it.

 

As for SW, I only know the rout take but that is probably due to Abnett's writing immersing me in their "culture" , something I find he does better than other BL authors so far. They seemed so familiar and totally alien at the same time.

[b1soul]

Eisenstein is the only Swallow I've read, and I found it so empty headed that I had to force myself to finish it.

 

As for SW, I only know the rout take but that is probably due to Abnett's writing immersing me in their "culture" , something I find he does better than other BL authors so far. They seemed so familiar and totally alien at the same time.

 

Eisenstein is just bland IMO

 

...and Decius is annoying as hell

 

 

As for SW, I only know the rout take but that is probably due to Abnett's writing immersing me in their "culture" , something I find he does better than other BL authors so far. They seemed so familiar and totally alien at the same time.

 

Aye...I didn't like Legion and Prospero Burns upon first reading. I liked them upon re-reading. I might even re-read PB yet again as I find Abnett's work really rewards repeated reading. I'm a quick reader but sometimes I find myself reading to quickly without absorbing all the details

[Perrin]

It's a weird coincidence that both this thread and the Mortarion one have both ended up discussing FotE at the same time

FotE is one of the best books of the series for me. Sure it doesn't give much in the way of an actual Legion theme for the Death Guard, but the scene where Dorn see's the memory video of Horus and finally realises that his brother has turned, most powerful scene of the Heresy so far imo.

[Chaeron]

 

I don't see why Abnett's Wolves would not light pyres and WET LEOPARD GROWL for fallen comrades. It wouldn't be out of character for them.

Fixed that for you.

 

 

Out of likes, but I had to comment as I laughed out loud.

[Wade Garrett]

If I can go back a couple of pages:

 

I think there's a tendency to swing the pendulum too far the other direction when people start discussing how the Danes, Norse, Mongols etc were not just hairy murder machines fuelled by alcohol and blind rage.

 

Yes, there were many aspects to these cultures, some of them quite sophisticated....but they were still cultures where warfare and bloodshed were not just commonplace but actively sought out, to attain riches, rise up the social ladder, and gain the favor of the gods.

 

How can I articulate this....let's say that you and I, with our modern sensibilities, were making a list of the pluses and minuses of raiding the Hill People.

 

Among the pluses we'd put "Attain grain, livestock, and other resources" and in the minuses "Many bloody battles".

 

Someone like Uhtred Uthredsson would put both of those as pluses.

 

(Which is not something that was limited to those civilizations commonly viewed as 'barbarian' look at the Romans, violent hicks who lived in a swamp and never met a problem they didn't try to solve with stabbing things.)

[Dantay VI]

Uhtred Uhtredsson, as in Bernard Cornwell's character?

 

And I agree with your view, but I don't think its the part about pushing the pendulum too far, I feel its more about changing the stereotypical view people have of the mongols, the nordic people etc and say that there is more to them than most people realise.

 

I am not saying they were all fluffy bunnies or anything like that. Yes they were violent raiders and adventurers, who viewed non warrior castes as inferior. But that is what draws a lot of people in, all the saga's and the derring do etc.

 

Its just good to point out that they had more to them than simply being bloodthirsty killers.

 

And Dan Abnett did that brilliantly with Prospero Burns, the masks they make and wear, the fact that they can play on peoples perceptions of them, that they don't run heedlessly into battle but use a lot of intelligence gathering first, tjat despite their appearance they are disciplined warriors that do have a concept of honour.

 

He made them more than their traditional stereotype.

[Daddywarcrimes]

I wouldn't say Eisenstein was great.  Not by a long stretch.  But it did its job of advancing the storyline and was an entertaining read.  I'd rather that Garro had vanished into the pages of history, but that might be a side effect of him coming along after Loken and Tarvitz had already beaten the "loyal member of a traitor legion" thing to death.

[GrandMagnus]

It's a weird coincidence that both this thread and the Mortarion one have both ended up discussing FotE at the same time

FotE is one of the best books of the series for me. Sure it doesn't give much in the way of an actual Legion theme for the Death Guard, but the scene where Dorn see's the memory video of Horus and finally realises that his brother has turned, most powerful scene of the Heresy so far imo.

Although I must agree that it is one of the most powerful scenes in the heresy books I still believe that the most powerfull moments in the books is when the betrayal is discovered by the loyalists on Isstvan III. The raw emotion of discovering that their brothers have betrayed them and the white hot burning rage and hate it evoces is truly the most powerfull moment in the entire series. Every other moment of betrayal after Isstvan III is just bland and boring compared to the dread of Loken, Torgaddon or Tarvitz.

[Perrin]

It's a weird coincidence that both this thread and the Mortarion one have both ended up discussing FotE at the same time

FotE is one of the best books of the series for me. Sure it doesn't give much in the way of an actual Legion theme for the Death Guard, but the scene where Dorn see's the memory video of Horus and finally realises that his brother has turned, most powerful scene of the Heresy so far imo.

Although I must agree that it is one of the most powerful scenes in the heresy books I still believe that the most powerfull moments in the books is when the betrayal is discovered by the loyalists on Isstvan III. The raw emotion of discovering that their brothers have betrayed them and the white hot burning rage and hate it evoces is truly the most powerfull moment in the entire series. Every other moment of betrayal after Isstvan III is just bland and boring compared to the dread of Loken, Torgaddon or Tarvitz.

Taking the whole scene into account I totally agree, but when Dorn says "Horus?" when he finally realises that Garro isn't lying, that one line can't be beaten by any single Istvaan moment.