Best 240 point troop combo

[BrainFireBob]

Hello all-

 

Starting playing with new lists again after a break. I always start with troops when I build a.list.

 

Each of these costs 240 points, given your experiences in this edition, which would make the best core?

8 Berzerkers. Icon of Wrath. Champ with melta bombs, 1 l. Claw. VotLW. Rhino.

 

10 CSM. 2 plasma guns. Rhino. Champ with plasma pistol, lightning claw, m bombs.

 

7 plague marines. VotLW. 2 plasma guns. Rhino.

 

10 noise marines. 9 sonic blasters. Icon of Excess.

[TheDevourer]

Of those probably plague marines or normal marines, although I would play a naked champion and save points there.

 

Zerkers would be bad considering transports for chaos and also the need for a khorne lord. 

 

And sonic blaster nm are underclassed compared to minimal camper squads. 

 

Plagues make sense because nurgle lords are common and pm are still fairly decent for theit points. 

 

And low cost 10 man squads of normal csm with dual plasma in rhinos are fairly good also aswell as being flexible albeit expensive

[minigun762]

My vote is

9x Noise Marines, extra CCWs, Doom Siren and single claw Champion in a Rhino.

[Deadman Wade]

I'd take Noise Marines too, maybe they are too expensive to be competitive, but at least they'll reliably beat MEQ troops.

[minigun762]

I'd take Noise Marines too, maybe they are too expensive to be competitive, but at least they'll reliably beat MEQ troops.

In a world of annoying cover huggers, a super heavy flamer isn't half bad. Fearless and I5 is just bonus

[incinerator950]

What about Possessed or Chosen?

[Deadman Wade]

Depends of what weapons Chosen use. 10-man Chosen squad with 5 flamers and combi-flamer in rhino are quite good both at capturing and defending objectives, they draw a lot of firepower and no one really wants to come near them with non-2+ or T6 stuff, but if you give them plasmas or meltas they become quite expensive and you'll get only 6-7 of them, which makes them tricky to use. Also, it's either Abaddon or Black Legion with VotLW upgrage (I take VotLW anyway, but most chaos players don't like that), and VotLW makes even flamer squad very wxpensive.

[Sedekiel]

Some mathhammer that maybe could help

 

Equations taken from this site  http://www.simhammer.com/node/26

 

DPP (Dakka Per Point) is a unit for measuring "effectiveness" of a unit compared to it's cost.

 

PLEASE KEEP IN MIND THAT this is JUST math not actual playing, and I post it here just to give a general idea about the units.

 

 

 

DPP (Dakka Per Point)  VS GeQ (Guard equivalent)

 

Long range

 

UNIT=DPP

 

CSM = 27,45 (double plasma)

Cultists = 21,16 (autoguns)

Plague = 17,01 (double plasma)

Noise = 51,2 (8 sonic blasters)

Chosen = 20 (4 plasma guns)

 

Short range

 

UNIT=DPP

 

CSM = 54,9 (double plasma)

Cultists = 33,06 (autoguns)

Plague = 34,03 (double plasma)

Noise = 53,25 (8 sonic blasters)

Chosen = 40 (4 plasma guns)

 

 

 

DPP (Dakka Per Point)  VS MeQ (Marine equivalent)

 

Long range

 

UNIT=DPP

 

CSM = 15,94 (double plasma)

Cultists = 14,99 (autoguns)

Plague = 8,07 (double plasma)

Noise = 23,04 (8 sonic blasters)

Chosen = 12,51 (4 plasma guns)

 

Short range

 

UNIT=DPP

 

CSM = 31,89 (double plasma)

Cultists = 22,92 (autoguns)

Plague = 16,01 (double plasma)

Noise = 23,96 (8 sonic blasters)

Chosen = 25 (4 plasma guns)

 

[qyntius]

What do you guys think of noise marines with blasmasters instead of sonic blasters? Either a 5 man squad with 1 or 10 man with 2.

[Dallas Drake]

What do you guys think of noise marines with blasmasters instead of sonic blasters? Either a 5 man squad with 1 or 10 man with 2.

They're good. Go read the thread 'Making Noise Marines Scream' in the Slaanesh board. Everything worth saying about Noise Marines has been said there, and some more.

 

As for what's best. It largely depends on what the rest of your list looks like. One thing Noise Marines want now is a Rhino, mobility and getting them to either the right part of the board or within range of the Doom Siren is important & Rhinos provide this cheap.

 

Dallas

[Tenebris]

Well today there was a tourney at Trieste and the first three places went to Ultramarines. Be it Unbound 1st Company, Unbound Veterans (Sternguard) and a Battle Forged with Tyranid Wars Veterans. In short they dominated. It is hard to crack with our troops those TH/SS Terminators, especially when they are spammed.

 

I have always advocated the first setup, the CSM one and I have to give a honourable mention to both the Plague Marines and the Noise Marines, yet if there is a lesson to be learned from today's event is that my local meta would punish all the three setups. The Rhinos were still obliterated by turn one, and the loyalist Land Raiders dominated the scene... it is hard to fight them as we are now. 

 

I think we should begin looking to Unbound for our main choices, namely either Bikers, Terminators or Raptors. Things are getting messy really quick. 

[Deadman Wade]

Well today there was a tourney at Trieste and the first three places went to Ultramarines. Be it Unbound 1st Company, Unbound Veterans (Sternguard) and a Battle Forged with Tyranid Wars Veterans. In short they dominated. It is hard to crack with our troops those TH/SS Terminators, especially when they are spammed.

 

I have always advocated the first setup, the CSM one and I have to give a honourable mention to both the Plague Marines and the Noise Marines, yet if there is a lesson to be learned from today's event is that my local meta would punish all the three setups. The Rhinos were still obliterated by turn one, and the loyalist Land Raiders dominated the scene... it is hard to fight them as we are now.

 

I think we should begin looking to Unbound for our main choices, namely either Bikers, Terminators or Raptors. Things are getting messy really quick.

I really can't see how th/ss terminators are a threat to csm. Our terminators, berzerkers, chosen and even possessed can reliably beat them in close combat, not to mention their slow moving speed and the amount of AP2 we can bring.

Sternguard with combi-weapon is 32 points, and with drop pod they cost as much as our terminators, they are nice, but overpriced unit, and their cost-efficiency is very low.

Tau, eldar and daemons are much bigger problem IMO.

[Prot]

For me it depends on the game. If you're playing Malestrom I love the Plague marines (not sure why you'd take VotLW).

[Dallas Drake]

Yeah, I've had my CS PoTV telepathy Sorcerer and MoK Possessed deal with TH/SS Terminators easily. For a start Terminators do not like Psychic Shriek, cast that & they'll waste their dispel dice trying to stop it, if they don't it's usually 2 or 3 dead for a start. Then cast invisibility. Shear weight of attacks will weather them down. Needing 6s to hit you is so sweet then you have either a 5++ or 3++ if they manage to wound you.

 

Land Raiders still die like default to Deep Striking Obliterators. I've blown up a Land Raider every time I've faces one in 7th. 1 is not a worry, it's when SM (notably BA) bring 2 or 3.

 

Space Marine Tacs are good, combat squad is very cost effective and they have ATSKNF which is one of the best rule in the game. But they're still just T4 3+. CSM have plenty of options for murdering MEQs, we just have to pick the right tools for the job & be careful of nasty match ups (i.e. Don't let Iron Clad Dreads get near Noise Marines etc).

 

Dallas

[Iron_Within]

I've been wanting to try Noise marines in combination with an Biomancy Sorcerer with Endurance and Noise Marines. The ability fire with Relentless would be an excellent combo on a 9 man Noise marine unit blasting out firepower.

[Dallas Drake]

I've been wanting to try Noise marines in combination with an Biomancy Sorcerer with Endurance and Noise Marines. The ability fire with Relentless would be an excellent combo on a 9 man Noise marine unit blasting out firepower.

It's just a gamble getting it though. Admittedly it's a 50% chance for a L3 but what if you roll up Iron Arm, Warp Speed & Haemorage? I'd say you're better of buying them a Rhino to move them 18" (then zip off to combi-melta or contest) to where they can camp the rest of the game. Placing a dakka unit of Noise Marines is so important as you really don't want to be moving them. Salvo is such a drag & GW's cheek at charging 3 points to upgrade a bolter to a sonic blaster is just annoying. Personally, I wouldn't invest more points into the unit just to try to cure the issues of sonic blasters.

[Iron_Within]

It's all about list building, yes you can never eliminate the gamble. But I would intend to take 3 Level 3 Sorcerers, one with Divination, 1 with Biomancy and 1 with Biomancy or Telepathy. With two Biomancy Sorcerers one should get Endurance and the other part of the list will be built with other Biomancy skills in mind.

[the jeske]

yeah , but if a death star like that is build around endurace your opponents will stop the cast and there is no IF in w40k .

 

IMO better go melee , triple tele for a invisi star . 3 dudes with force weapons , 1 syren lots of I5 and 2 blast masters that fire on the move. Costs a lot , but that is what deathstars do. If only huron worked the way he did in 6th.