Legion Glaive / Fellblade / Falchion

[Slips]

 

I'm just worried that the glaive got a stealth nerf now that Titans ignore haywire attacks now.

 

Only Reavers and above though I thought? Or did the Warhound also get the Ignore Haywire?

 

The Warhound got it too.

 

Though really, trying to kill a Warhound and above with a Glaive isnt its best use so its not really a nerf. More of a Buff to titans.

 

It also gives the Falchion a role now.

[Hesh Kadesh]

Nope, Warhound got it too. it is a nerf in the rules, but not so much the meta. Few people are able to bring a 750pt titan (requiring a 3000pt game). As I read the Void shield rules though, the Void Shield is classed seperately from the titan 'hit scored against the titan will instead hit a void shield' but only the titan is immune to the effects of Haywire, so you can near autostrip HP While 14/13/12 without armoured ceramite is still. Susceptible to meltastripping.

[DietOfLiquor]

So with the warhound in mind. Does that make the falchion or fellblade the more versatile tool?

[Ishagu]

Guys, has anyone considered using the alternative D weapon rules available in the Horus Heresy?

 

Imo, actually superior. Makes the Falchion the most attractive option. Instant Death, ignore cover, force invul re-rolls? Yes please.

 

Do the rules have to be agreed by both parties?

[Slips]

Guys, has anyone considered using the alternative D weapon rules available in the Horus Heresy?

 

Imo, actually superior. Makes the Falchion the most attractive option. Instant Death, ignore cover, force invul re-rolls? Yes please.

 

Do the rules have to be agreed by both parties?

Haven't yet.

 

Yes they do.

[Ishagu]

They are so much better in terms of balance...

 

Vehicles don't get ruined as much, powerful MCs are hurt more, no chance of removing a 400+ point super heavy /Gargantuan in a single hit

[Charlo]

They are so much better in terms of balance...

 

Vehicles don't get ruined as much, powerful MCs are hurt more, no chance of removing a 400+ point super heavy /Gargantuan in a single hit

 

Aye - they're there to make everything a little more tame.

[Ishagu]

D is a funny beast.

The regular rules might fail to remove a single gretchin model from play one turn, then one shot a Warhound Titan the next.

 

The Forgeworld rules for D are so much more predictable and generally effective, without the crazy over the top effects based on luck...

[PastelAvenger]

D is a funny beast.

The regular rules might fail to remove a single gretchin model from play one turn, then one shot a Warhound Titan the next.

 

The Forgeworld rules for D are so much more predictable and generally effective, without the crazy over the top effects based on luck...

Apart from now you have a hard time destroying a flare shielded Spartan something a Flachion should have no trouble munching through. Im not saying it should 1 shot it rather that it should be able to reliably Penetrate it which it can't with the 30k rules.

[Flint13]

I dunno, Str10AP1 with sunder will penetrate AV14 pretty reliably.

 

Plus then you have d3+1 hull points in damage on top of the pen chart result.

[Ishagu]

 

D is a funny beast.

The regular rules might fail to remove a single gretchin model from play one turn, then one shot a Warhound Titan the next.

 

The Forgeworld rules for D are so much more predictable and generally effective, without the crazy over the top effects based on luck...

Apart from now you have a hard time destroying a flare shielded Spartan something a Flachion should have no trouble munching through. Im not saying it should 1 shot it rather that it should be able to reliably Penetrate it which it can't with the 30k rules.

Are Voidshields common?

I expected to see them in tournament play prior to their nerfs.

I think they create boring games, and would expect an opponent to actually own the Voidshield model and the book it's rules are in.

 

The only time I've seen them used have been through all too conveniently small proxies!

[PastelAvenger]

I dunno, Str10AP1 with sunder will penetrate AV14 pretty reliably.

 

Plus then you have d3+1 hull points in damage on top of the pen chart result.

You still need a 6 to glance a flare shielded Spartan which is what I was talking about

[Ishagu]

Ah yes, sorry. I was distracted as I read the replies.

 

You're right, and it's definitely a concern in that regard but it would do great work against comparatively overpowered Mechanicum lists that make use of multiple MCs and tough multi-wound infantry.

[PastelAvenger]

Ah yes, sorry. I was distracted as I read the replies.

 

You're right, and it's definitely a concern in that regard but it would do great work against comparatively overpowered Mechanicum lists that make use of multiple MCs and tough multi-wound infantry.

I did wonder what you were on about haha

[Flint13]

 

I dunno, Str10AP1 with sunder will penetrate AV14 pretty reliably.

Plus then you have d3+1 hull points in damage on top of the pen chart result.

You still need a 6 to glance a flare shielded Spartan which is what I was talking about

You do not.

 

Flareshields specifically say they do not affect StrD or close combat attacks. So your attacking vehicle remains Str10 with sunder.

[PastelAvenger]

It's not St D then it's St10 as you are swapping the rules

[Slips]

Lets see what the book has to say:

 

LA:CAL Page 9:

 

Optional Age of Darkness Rule: Destroyer Weapons

In Age of Darkness games, players may opt to reduce the power of Destroyer (S:D) weapons by introducing a random element [...]

• ​Destroyer Weapons count as being S10 and have the Instant Death, Sunder and Ignores Cover special rules. In addition successful invulnerable saves taken against hits from Destroyer Weapons must be re-rolled.
• Each unsaved wound from a Destroyer weapon inflicts D3+1 wounds. Each penetrating hit from a Destroyer weapon causes D3+1 Hull Points/Rolls once on the appropriate vehicle damage chart

 

So, no, you do not swap the Weapon Profile of Strength: D to Strength: 10 when using these rules. It just counts as S10 for the purposes of Wounding/Penetrating.

Therefore, Flare Shields would not reduce them since the Weapons actual Strength is still S:D and not S10.

[Lord Blackwood]

Man I wish I wasant on my phone this requires a suplex gif really bad.

[PastelAvenger]

I read have read it as swapping the profile and it has just been referred to as a D weapon to confer the extra rules. If the general consensus is that it isn't the case then I will obviously change how the role is used in future games.

[Ishagu]

The effect of the "D" is different, but it's still a D weapon as far as I understand. Though I don't have the book in hand right now...

 

Remember even regular D is counted as Str 10.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Due to how it's written a case could be made its no longer SD but I think the intent is clear.

[Flint13]

^That case would be pedantic and a little silly at best.

 

Slips quoted the relevant rules directly. Str D counts as (not is) Str 10. 

 

If it makes it more solid, don't refer to it as Str D (maybe that's why FW doesn't) think of it as "Destroyer Weapons" 

 

Flare shields don't effect Destroyer Weapons, Destroyer Weapons roll to penetrate armor @ Str10. 

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

S10 vs AV14... 4 to glance.. 5 or 6 to 5.

[PastelAvenger]

To be honest the problem with the Falchion is its low rate of fire it should be two shots really. The fact it's 1 coupled with it using the Destroyer table which gives it a tendency to fluff its attacks are what makes it the worse out of the 3 Legion Baneblade chasis.

 

The 30k Destroyer rules just make it worse at Pen'ing AV14 which it should have no troulble doing.

[God-Potato of Mankind]

S10 vs AV14... 4 to glance.. 5 or 6 to 5.

3 to glance 4 to pen, it's AP2. Is that right? It'd not even AP1? Blerg