1.5k Imperial Fists

[Phalanx Warder]

So I run fists as you may well know, I have an upcoming game @ 1500pts against the much hated (and loved) Iron Warriors.

 

My opponent is running something along the lines of:

 

Warsmith tooled out

 

10 breacher marines

20man blob

 

X2 Predator Auto cannon w/ LC sponcens and a slick Predator w/Auto Cannon

 

X 10 ML heavy support squad

Scorpious WW

 

And I think a full vet aquad tooled for CC

 

He also had a rhino filled with 10 more vets(I think, either way they were aggressive and came forward)

 

I currently have:

 

MoS

 

Comtemptor mortis, Kheres

7 templars w/rhino

Contemptor with MM and DCCW w/Heavy Flamer

Rapier Quad Mortar

 

X2 15 man blob squads

 

Sicaran w/LC

Predator Plasma turret

 

I am thinking about putting a conversion beamer on one of the MM Contemptor, I also have another pred hanging around that I could take, I also have 10 breachers ready to go.

 

Any sugestions?

[Slips]

The thing I'd change after having asked the question myself, is the Transport the Templars are in. They NEED to be able to assault out of a vehicle because that's where they shine : Chopping up space marines like its nobodies business. To that end, you'd have to run them in a Land Raider (since they can't take a Spartan end even then, that'd be hard to justify)  to put the assault vehicle rule to good use. If they're in a rhino, when they disembark, they'll just stand there and at most shoot their pistols at the nearest thing and even with Artificer armor, their liable to getting gunned down by Fury of the Legion at that point.

 

 You'd, therefore, need to shave off enough points throughout your list to be able to fit a Land Raider in and at 1500 that's a challenge in and of itself.

 

So a couple of questions : What would the Contemptor with MM and DCCW role be in your list? Anti Armor? Horde Control? Character Stomping?

For AA, You've got the Sicarian, CMortis and a Plasma Pred, which should be sufficient, also take note that almost everybody (especially from what you can see on this forum) takes Armored Ceramite (if they can) for their vehicles, greatly reducing the effectiveness of the MM.

 

For Horde Control, you'd just need to sick your templars on them and they're more than capable of chewing through MEQ's what with all those power weapons (and the option of having a Solarite Power Gauntlet - which is Ap 1, MC, Sx2 and unwieldy)

 

For Character Stomping, again, your Templars would be good enough, but will probably struggle VS Terminators - Barring lucky/unlucky rolls on both ends.

 

What is the main reason behind taking the MoS? Sticking him with one of the 15 man blob squads and potentially upping their BS to 6 (don't know if it stacks with the IF Legion rule of +1 BS for bolter weapons) to Fury of the Legion enemy squads to the High Heavens? I don't think you'll encounter many fliers so I doubt you'll be using the +BS much on the Mortis to Skyfire / Interceptor since the blob squads should provide enough Dakka with Fury.

 

Reason behind using the Quad Mortar over Graviton Battery? The Grav would help you in terms of area denial, especially since you've stated that he goes Aggro with one of the Vet squads in a Rhino - forcing Difficult Terrain could be greatly advantageous.

 

Those are, for the time being, that I can point out as being iffy in to my eyes.

 

Edit : If you wanted replace the MoS, you could, instead take a Primus Medicae and take Artificer Armor + Power Weapon for +25 points and roll him with your 7 Templars to give them FNP and make them an even tougher nut to crack while allowing him to keep up with them in terms of kill power and armor save. Its still no Invuln Save though but hey :p

[Phalanx Warder]

Slipstreams thank you for having a good look at my list I am going to attempt to answer your questions.

 

With the MM Contemptor I am going to be remove the MM and replace it with a Conversation Beamer this and the MoS along with the Quad Mortar now create my base of fire. The quad mortar is going after blob squads is support of those reduced tac squads of mine. The MoS can now apply his buff to either one to keep their shots closer to on target for character sniping, plus at some point he can drop his barrage attack on those 3 Predators or Missile Launcher heavy support marines. They concern me the most about his list.

 

The Templars are a late replacement to a squad of destroyer marines I had in that rhino who were going to use it as a mobile platform for their ML, I guess I wanted to run a legion specific unit (they were also an addition based off of a 2v2 game I played so its not a must take unit). Knowing the limitations of deployment out of the rhino I planned to use sneaky deployment/vehicle placement, then next turn tank shock the enemy to force them into assault range.

 

 

Hope that clears up my list a little

[Slips]

Hmm, since you're going to use the MM-now-HCB Dread as a gunline unit with the rapier and MoS, why not make him a HCB mortis instead, drop the Kheres, and get a Graviton Rapier -if you can? Since the HCB, will be pumping out 5" templates, the Mortar (3"?) too, why not add on another 5" template with the gravitons which then turns that 5" template into Difficult AND Dangerous Terrain for the next turn. You can also take 1-3 rapier batteries per elite slot, I believe, thus freeing up the option of maybe keeping the Kheres Dread or adding in an Apothecarion Detachment for your blobs.

This would help keep the blobs you want dead in relatively the same location and more or less render them unable to move all the while getting templated to death by 3 units on top of the possible MoS Barrage for added kick. They'll also be firing at ~36" since that the Gravs max range.

Graviton battery also has the added benefit having Concussion and Haywire, thus being the bane of vehicles and any attempts of charging out of it into combat nearby (since init would be reduced to 1 for the survivors).

IMPORTANT: I am unsure if you CAN field a Heavy Conversion Beamer Mortis since its a Template weapon that needs the Firer to not have moved prior, but that gives the Mortis Skyfire and Interceptor - unsure how these rules mingle if at all. In the event that you can't HCB with DCCW + Grav, plasma or even the Heavy Flamer like you want would be the best.

The tactic you would employ for the Templars almost seems like a one-trick-pony since after the first success and your opponent realizing how devastating Templars can be are unlikely to fall for it again. And them being a rather hefty points cost it would be a shame for them to get obliterated before they ever got to do their job (since rhinos are AV 11 and with all the HH goodies, relatively easy to pop). So I'd still recommend in investing into a Land Raider for that AV 14 and making them a really tough nut that, along with the aforementioned Template Dispensers, make target priority for your opponent a choice between a rock and a hard place.

Its at this point that I feel I have to mention that I think I'm trying to min-max your list too much and that, for friendly, casual, non-tournament games, this might not be all that fun to play against (since both you and your opponent having fun is what matters!), unless that is, they enjoy the challenge of trying to break tough lists

I will however, defer judgement to Kitwulfen since he seems to have it down in terms of getting the best bang-for-your-buck suggestions, and I'm not even sure if my suggestions would still fit into a 1500pt list since I haven't thought about calculating any of that :X

[depthcharge12]

I think as a future reference, you should take a 10 man veteran squad with 2 heavy bolters and the sniper rule. That way, you have BS5 across the whole squad and can try doing lots of rending shots with weight of fire.