Same Faction as Primary is ok if Combined Arms Detachment?

[Kilofix]

This is a 'duh' moment for me but I just realized that you can take any number of Combined Arms Detachments (that are min 1 HQ, 2 Troops) even if they are the exact same Faction as your Primary Detachment.

 

So you could have like 4 Daemon HQs if you have 4 Daemon Troops, or 6 Daemon HQs if you have 6 Daemon Troops, etc.

 

Its only Allied Detachments (like with 2 HQ, 1 Troop) that cannot be the same Faction as your Primary Detachment.

 

Right? Or, am I reading it wrong?

[Kristoff]

This is a 'duh' moment for me but I just realized that you can take any number of Combined Arms Detachments (that are min 1 HQ, 2 Troops) even if they are the exact same Faction as your Primary Detachment.

 

So you could have like 4 Daemon HQs if you have 4 Daemon Troops, or 6 Daemon HQs if you have 6 Daemon Troops, etc.

 

Its only Allied Detachments (like with 2 HQ, 1 Troop) that cannot be the same Faction as your Primary Detachment.

 

Right? Or, am I reading it wrong?

Correct in most cases, there are some exceptions. C:SM Detachments internally identify as separate factions based on Chapter Tactics. Black Legion Supplement Detachments can ally to C:CSm Detachments. Just for examples.

 

And I couldn't field Daemon HQs because I don't have them and as a Templar, I wouldn't get them. ;)

[Teetengee]

As for the Combined arms, you can take as many as you want from as many factions as you want though.

[Kristoff]

As for the Combined arms, you can take as many as you want from as many factions as you want though.

Provided they can use them. Inquisition and Imperial Knights can't, but they have their own Detachment types to compensate for it.

[Ozshock]

doesnt a second combined arms detachment have to be the same faction as the first? otherwise it would be an allied detachment wouldnt it?

 

 

As for the Combined arms, you can take as many as you want from as many factions as you want though.

[Grand Master Laertes]

 

doesnt a second combined arms detachment have to be the same faction as the first? otherwise it would be an allied detachment wouldnt it?

 

No, they don't need to be of the same faction, on the rulebook there is no restriction about it

[Kristoff]

 

doesnt a second combined arms detachment have to be the same faction as the first? otherwise it would be an allied detachment wouldnt it?

Models in a Detachment must be from the same Faction, but that has no meaning between Detachments, aside from the Primary-Allied relationship.

[Quozzo]

 

doesnt a second combined arms detachment have to be the same faction as the first? otherwise it would be an allied detachment wouldnt it?

 

No, they don't need to be of the same faction, on the rulebook there is no restriction about it

 

'Tis stupid, but that's the rules.

[tsijben]

That is true.

Maybe it would be better if they renamed Allied Detachment to "Small group from another Faction that is helping you"-Detachment.

That would be clearer and more accurate ;)

[Landrick]

So then can i take Primary Army1 (HQ+2Troops+X) and then Allied Army2 (HQ+Troops) then Allied Army2 (HQ+Troops) and still be Objective Secured?

 

Other example: Grey Knights (HQ+2Troops) then AM(HQ+Troops) and AM(HQ+Troops)

[Kristoff]

So then can i take Primary Army1 (HQ+2Troops+X) and then Allied Army2 (HQ+Troops) then Allied Army2 (HQ+Troops) and still be Objective Secured?

 

Other example: Grey Knights (HQ+2Troops) then AM(HQ+Troops) and AM(HQ+Troops)

Provided that neither "Allied Army" is the same Faction as Primary Army, yes.

 

You could also go Grey Knights Primary Combined Arms Detachment (Warlord HQ + 2 Troops +), Astra Militarium Combined Arms Detachment (1 HQ +2 Troops +), and Astra Militarium Allied Arms Detachment (1 HQ + 1 Troops+)

[Landrick]

 

So then can i take Primary Army1 (HQ+2Troops+X) and then Allied Army2 (HQ+Troops) then Allied Army2 (HQ+Troops) and still be Objective Secured?

 

Other example: Grey Knights (HQ+2Troops) then AM(HQ+Troops) and AM(HQ+Troops)

Provided that neither "Allied Army" is the same Faction as Primary Army, yes.

 

You could also go Grey Knights Primary Combined Arms Detachment (Warlord HQ + 2 Troops +), Astra Militarium Combined Arms Detachment (1 HQ +2 Troops +), and Astra Militarium Allied Arms Detachment (1 HQ + 1 Troops+)

 

Interesting. Where is this in the rulebook? (I have the big one if you know the page) Thanks!

[Kristoff]

 

Provided that neither "Allied Army" is the same Faction as Primary Army, yes.

 

You could also go Grey Knights Primary Combined Arms Detachment (Warlord HQ + 2 Troops +), Astra Militarium Combined Arms Detachment (1 HQ +2 Troops +), and Astra Militarium Allied Arms Detachment (1 HQ + 1 Troops+)

Interesting. Where is this in the rulebook? (I have the big one if you know the page) Thanks!

Sure, make me get my book out of the car... *Walks out to still warm concrete and 98 degree air, bare foot* Be warned, it's a bit spread out, largely because of how 7th Edition's format is set.

 

Generally starting in the Choosing Your Army chapter, starting on page 116, then for Page 117:

-"Battle-forged Armies

A player using the Battle-forged method must organise all the units they want to use into Detachments. Detachments are made up of units that conform to various requirements."

 

-"THE PRIMARY DETACHMENT

Every army has a Primary Detachment. If you organise your army using the Battle-forged method, whichever Detachment contains your Warlord is your Primary Detachment"

 

Page 118, is about Detachments:

-"There is no limit to the number of Detachments a Battle-forged army can include and you can use any mixture of Detachments you have available, within the restrictions of the rules that follow. However, all of the units in your army must belong to a Detachment and no unit can belong to more than one Detachment. If you choose to use a Battle-forged army, you must tell your opponent what units belong to what Detachments and what Command Benefits each will receive (if any) before you start deploying your army."

 

Now, in 6th, it was around this part where they said that all Primary Detachments must be from the same codex, and a little later where they say that all Allied Detachments must be from the same codex as well. In 7th, it does not show up here at all. As far as I've read and other people have reviewed, this same restriction never shows up at all.

 

Later, on Page 120:

-"SELECTING DETACHMENTS

You can include any number and type of Detachments in a Battle-forged army provided you have sufficient units. Simply select a type of Detachment and organise some or all of your units so that they fit within the restrictions and limitations detailed on that particular Detachment."

 

We see it reinforce the stipulation that you can include any number and types of Detachments you can take. Again, we see no restrictions.

 

Now, Detachments are supposed to have Restrictions, which page 121 says -"This section of the Detachment lists any additional restrictions that apply to the units you can include as part of this Detachment. If an Army List Entry does not adhere to a particular restriction, it cannot be included as part of this particular Detachment. For example, in order to include a Combined Arms Detachment, all of its Army List Entries must have the same Faction. If a Detachment does not list any Restrictions then it has none." Note, these Restrictions only apply to the Detachment itself, and not to any other Detachment your army may include.

 

Now, let's look at the standard Detachments restrictions.

 

Combined Arms Detachment:

-"Restrictions

All units chosen must have the same Faction (or have no Faction)."

 

Allied Detachment:

-"Restrictions

This Detachment cannot be your Primary Detachment.

Your Warlord can never be chosen from this Detachment.

All units chosen must have the same Faction (or no Faction).

All units chosen must have a different Faction to any of the units in your Primary Detachment (or no Faction)."