ChaosKen60 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 I am a long time CSM/SM player, and been out of the game for awhile, and was thinking coming back into it and playing Space Wolves. But then I found out about Militarum Tempestus (Storm Troopers), and found out they have own codex now. Saw and love the new figs. Yes even the Taurox :) So Now the question are they a playable army by themselves? Or better as a allies? And BTW I did look up this question on the forums, but did not seem to find a straight answer. And I did not to rez a old posting, so here I am. Alos I am not a big tournament player, just play with local players. And will be facing a lot of horde type armies - Orks, Nids, Dark Eldar. And not sure if this is important I have never played Imperial Guard. Thanks Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/294222-just-a-question/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilofix Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 You can play Scions as part of Codex: Astra Militarum or you can play Scions as part of Codex:Militarum Tempestus (the latter of which is all just MTs, Commisars, and supporting vehicles) The different Codexs provide different sets of Orders. AM has Scions as Elites while MT has Scions as Troops. You can play Codex:MT as the Primary Detachment alone or as an Allied Detachment to Codex:AM or vice versa. Just remember you need the mandatory FOC HQ and Troop for each separate Detachment. If I use MTs, I generally like to use them from its standalone Codex:MT, whether as Primary or Allied Detachment. Mainly because I like the Orders from C:MT and the fact that it makes Scions Troops. Edit - If you are going up against Horde - the First Rank Fire / Second Rank Fire Order from the main C:AM may be more useful though. Then again, if you're going up against Tyranid MC, the Suppression Doctrine or Elimination Protocol Orders from C:MT may be more useful. Either way you could make up any gaps with the right selection of Special Weapons. Maybe add more Plasma Guns if you use C:AM and add more Flamers if you use C:MT. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/294222-just-a-question/#findComment-3755759 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fearlessgod Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 I haven't gotten a look at the codex yet, but as far as I know you can field a pure Militarum Tempestus army. I'll let others with better knowledge give you more details. Hope this helps. lol... Kilofix ninja'd me Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/294222-just-a-question/#findComment-3755762 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark_Apostle_XVII Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 Never played the Tempestus codex but the problem with using them on their own is all they have are scions, scion command squad, commissars, taurox's and Valkyries/vendettas. While good against infantry, particularly heavy infantry (plasma gun spam and ap3 lasguns) they are rather limited in other options. Like tanks, artillery etc. It's up to you though, I am sure they could handle your common enemies well unless the reach combat then it could be a struggle, but may be handicapped against armour. Obviously if you're just playing for fun it's not a problem but might be a good idea to run them with guard allies for Leman Russ' or Space Marines for all their heavy weapons and combat ability. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/294222-just-a-question/#findComment-3755767 Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarriorFish Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 Agreed, while they are fieldable on their own you may find their limitations holding you back, but you can easily ally with them to spice things up. I say go for it, especially if you're not worried about being really competitive all the time :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/294222-just-a-question/#findComment-3755783 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChaosKen60 Posted July 25, 2014 Author Share Posted July 25, 2014 Okay well thanks all it is giving me the advice and alot to think about. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/294222-just-a-question/#findComment-3755790 Share on other sites More sharing options...
march10k Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 They're okay on their own, but they lack melee, horde control, and long-range firepower. That's quite a list of shortcomings. On the other hand, they're really good at close-ranged elites-slaying and have good mobility. They're better as an ally, especially using the air assault formation (which is a really huge "ally," starting around 1000 points. Obviously, you'd want to pair that with a main list that focuses on what they suck at, probably long range shooting and horde control (which can come from the same gun or guns). f you do field them on their own, I would recommend a firestorm redoubt with two battle cannons to give them some ranged shooting and horde control relatively cheaply. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/294222-just-a-question/#findComment-3755830 Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarriorFish Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 Mission accomplished if we've given you some cud to chew! march has experience with them so listen to his wise words, as you're a fresh recruit to the Guard I think it'll be easier for you to jump in to the MT codex and get going as you won't have any "Guardisms" hanging over you. Don't forget to come back if you have any more questions - or better yet some colour schemes for your new Stormtrooper army! :D Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/294222-just-a-question/#findComment-3756025 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fearlessgod Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 To be honest, I look at the lack of certain abilities as a challenge rather than a curse. If I listened to others, I never would have built my Death Company army or even my Deathwing back in 3rd and 4th editions. Look at it this way. With a limited codex (and choices) you get to know the strengths and weaknesses of your army very quickly. As march has said, you will lack in certain areas, So now the responsibility is on you to make this army work against all opponents. I enjoy challenges like this and enjoy bringing an army to the table that takes more than just pressing the "easy button" to get a win. So, after much thought I have decided to start a pure Militarum Tempestus army myself. If it isn't in the Militarum Tempestus Codex, I won't use it. We'll see what I can make of this style of army. I start my army in a couple of weeks. I will start an army building thread here (in the Astra Militarum forum) that will include army building, painting, battle reports and tactics. Looks like my dance card is full now. Emperor Be Praised! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/294222-just-a-question/#findComment-3756177 Share on other sites More sharing options...
march10k Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 I'll be running them solo, too...~1200 points in a maxed out air cav formation,~25 more stormtroopers with 6 plasma guns deployed defensively, and the aforementioned firestorm redoubt. 60 men, 10 plasma and 6 melta guns, four valkyries, a commissar lord, and the firestorm redoubt for 1850... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/294222-just-a-question/#findComment-3756184 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fearlessgod Posted July 26, 2014 Share Posted July 26, 2014 I'll be running them solo, too...~1200 points in a maxed out air cav formation,~25 more stormtroopers with 6 plasma guns deployed defensively, and the aforementioned firestorm redoubt. 60 men, 10 plasma and 6 melta guns, four valkyries, a commissar lord, and the firestorm redoubt for 1850... i like it march. I was thinking of a mechanized list... a Commissar, Militarum Tempestus Command Squad, loads of Militarum Tempestus Scions loaded into Taurox Primes, backed up by Valkyries (for close fire support). I like the idea of the firestorm redoubt with battle cannons. Might have to find a way to work it in. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/294222-just-a-question/#findComment-3756218 Share on other sites More sharing options...
march10k Posted July 26, 2014 Share Posted July 26, 2014 I know stormtroopers are probably 3x as effective with tauroxes as they are without...but I don't like them. I'd love the option of giving them chimeras instead (for the ~650 points that isn't the air assault formation), but given the choice between tauroxes and boots, my boys will just walk...well, actually they'll dig in, lol. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/294222-just-a-question/#findComment-3756275 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fearlessgod Posted July 26, 2014 Share Posted July 26, 2014 I know. When I initially saw them, I hated them. After looking at them, they seem to be growing on me. I'd rather have the option for Chimeras too. Since I don't I'll have to find a way to make the Taurox work. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/294222-just-a-question/#findComment-3756291 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilofix Posted July 26, 2014 Share Posted July 26, 2014 I'm too am going to try to run: Maxed out Airborne Assault (Commisar, Tmpst Cmd, 3 x 10 x Scions, 4 Valks + 6 Melta, 3 Plasma, 1 Med) Ordo Malleus in TDA (joining the Tmpst Cmd) Ordo Hereticus (joining the Tmpst Cmd) Another 10 STs (in one corner) Bunker with Comms Relay (in other corner) Squad of Acolytes w/Bolters (in the Bunker) Vulture Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/294222-just-a-question/#findComment-3756294 Share on other sites More sharing options...
march10k Posted July 26, 2014 Share Posted July 26, 2014 I'll probably most often run my air cav formation as an "ally" of IG, with five man squads so it's "only" 980 points. That leaves 870 points for guard, and you can get a lot of guard for 870 points. Starting with an officer of the fleet (oh, yeah, he comes with a CCS, lol, but they don't matter) for 80 points. Add in some chimeras and veterans (290 for two squads with autocannons and forward sentries and two chimeras), and I still have 500 points for tanks. Say two demolishers and an eradicator? That's much better ground support for the air cav than my pure stormtrooper list! (yes, I know it's a little under 1850) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/294222-just-a-question/#findComment-3756314 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChaosKen60 Posted July 26, 2014 Author Share Posted July 26, 2014 To be honest, I look at the lack of certain abilities as a challenge rather than a curse. If I listened to others, I never would have built my Death Company army or even my Deathwing back in 3rd and 4th editions. Look at it this way. With a limited codex (and choices) you get to know the strengths and weaknesses of your army very quickly. As march has said, you will lack in certain areas, So now the responsibility is on you to make this army work against all opponents. I enjoy challenges like this and enjoy bringing an army to the table that takes more than just pressing the "easy button" to get a win. So, after much thought I have decided to start a pure Militarum Tempestus army myself. If it isn't in the Militarum Tempestus Codex, I won't use it. We'll see what I can make of this style of army. I start my army in a couple of weeks. I will start an army building thread here (in the Astra Militarum forum) that will include army building, painting, battle reports and tactics. Looks like my dance card is full now. Emperor Be Praised! Fearlessgod Wow seems I have started something; my main reason I asked about a pure Militarum Tempestus army myself. I have never been a "Win All" player, I like armies for the fluff, and the MT Codex has nice fluff. If I have fun in a game - like during the good old days of Gamers Underground Store (sad it is gone) that’s is good for me. And I like the small list; to me also it is not a hindrance but a plus, a challenge even. To build a fun and sometimes successful army from this small codex would great. I have played 40K and SM or CSM since Rogue Trader Days; so this Army just seems Fresh, and so different for me. But so different say like the bugs. So that was why I asked my question in the 1st place, but now I am wondering if I should follow in your foot steps Fearlessgod? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/294222-just-a-question/#findComment-3756619 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fearlessgod Posted July 26, 2014 Share Posted July 26, 2014 No my friend, you are not following in my footsteps. I got the idea from you. To be honest, I play for fun. I like playing fun lists that may or may not be effective. My days of playing this game competitively (was a dedicated tournament player)are far behind me. I play for the enjoyment of the game and the friendships made with the guys (and gals) I play with. There is nothing more frustrating than looking at a codex and only focusing on how to squeeze the last drop of effectiveness out of it instead of just enjoying the ability to try new units/combinations. That's why I love playing my AM army... the ability to use and have fun with EVERY unit... be they Ratlings, Ogryn, Hellhounds, Sentinals, Penal Troops, Conscripts or even Catachans. So really, I should be thanking you for the idea of starting a new fun army to play. I can't wait to get the codex (as soon as Mrs Fearlessgod gives me the ok) and start looking at the fluff. BTW, I find that the fluff builds my army more than picking "effective units" do these days. Funny how that works out. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/294222-just-a-question/#findComment-3756746 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChaosKen60 Posted July 27, 2014 Author Share Posted July 27, 2014 So really, I should be thanking you for the idea of starting a new fun army to play. I can't wait to get the codex (as soon as Mrs Fearlessgod gives me the ok) and start looking at the fluff. BTW, I find that the fluff builds my army more than picking "effective units" do these days. Funny how that works out. Well wish me Luck fearlessgod; I just got the Codex for them so here i go again. And later I am write the fluff for my unit, and which I am going to base my off a R/L unit that I served along (NO I was not member) with while I was in the US Navy Amphibious Fleet - SEAL Teams. Some bravest men I know of. And now the HARDEST BATTLE talking Mrs. Chaos into buying figs Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/294222-just-a-question/#findComment-3757140 Share on other sites More sharing options...
march10k Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 Good luck with that part (convincing the MRS)...LOL. I think leveraging the contents of "stronghold assault" will make the army viable. If you can't have long range shooting on an infantry platform and you only have valks and roxies for vehicles, well, EVERYONE gets access to shooty buildings, I don't think it violates the "only stormtroopers" limitation. The firestorm redoubt could be a continental headquarters or something... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/294222-just-a-question/#findComment-3757266 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChaosKen60 Posted July 27, 2014 Author Share Posted July 27, 2014 Good luck with that part (convincing the MRS)...LOL. I think leveraging the contents of "stronghold assault" will make the army viable. If you can't have long range shooting on an infantry platform and you only have valks and roxies for vehicles, well, EVERYONE gets access to shooty buildings, I don't think it violates the "only stormtroopers" limitation. The firestorm redoubt could be a continental headquarters or something... Well I think I am going after the big box set - (IF Mrs ) Two Roxies, One - Val, One Command , and Two Troop. I got stuff to sell so hoping that will help convince the Mrs. --- please Baby, please Baby, please Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/294222-just-a-question/#findComment-3757304 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kontakt Posted July 28, 2014 Share Posted July 28, 2014 Well I think I am going after the big box set - (IF Mrs ) Two Roxies, One - Val, One Command , and Two Troop. I got stuff to sell so hoping that will help convince the Mrs. --- please Baby, please Baby, please Just got my box set...want another one now.... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/294222-just-a-question/#findComment-3757669 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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