Paint markers for detail/small areas

[Noxnoctis22]

I've always had a bit of a problem doing the eyes on Space Marines, even with a 000 brush I still can't get the precision I'm looking for.

 

Someone recommended me to use paint markers and after doing a bit of research I think these might be the solution.

 

Sharpie Oil-Based Paint Marker - Extra Fine Point

 

Does anybody have an experience with these or paint markers like these? My biggest concern is that the "extra fine point" might not be same enough for what I need it to do.

[Forté]

None sorry. I actually find a size 1 brush with an excellent point works better than a 000. Paint dries too quickly I find on a tiny brush.

[Castellan Cato]

I haven't used an oil-based one.  I haven't seen one of those before.  But a regular fine-tip sharpie has problems adhereing to model's paint.  I dont see why oil-based would improve this.

[Kastor Krieg]

I use SAKURA Pigma Micron 005 (0.20mm) pens. They write well on paint and primer and the results are very good. They are also awesomesauce for any writing (think parchment, oaths and so on) and for minute details like eyes.

[Subtle Discord]

I always found that painting eyes a bit sloppy first and then 'cutting' the shape from the outside was the best method to get clean eyes. Not as easy an option if there's a lot of blending effort put into the surrounding area, but if it's solid colour it works really well. And, I agree a 0 or 00 should come to an acceptable point for eyes and the paint dries much slower in that size; it's true that tiny brushes can dry so fast that it makes the job harder. Be sure to thin the paint a bit more if you are using a small brush.

 

That said, 005 Pigma Micron markers are a great investment for all sort of jobs, even if they don't work out well for eyes. Excellent for lots of extremely small details with lots of control.

[Noxnoctis22]

I stopped by the local art supply store at lunch and took a look at the SAKURA Pigma Micron 005 pens but I wasn't sure if they would actually be permement on the models/paints. Granted they work well on paper work but can it be smudge or rubbed off the models themselves?

[Lord Commander Scrymgeour]

Try painting the eyes before the rest of the face, I've found it helps

[Subtle Discord]

Make sure to double check any marker you might be trying to use, they will clearly say (usually in tiny writing somewhere) if they are waterproof. That's what you'll want. Even if they are waterproof, you are right that you should take care; the ink will take longer then you might expect to dry, so just left it sit for a good long while. It's also best to use a bit of vanish to lock it in place; even dry it will tend to rub off. The layer of pigment it adds is very thin.

[Tranc]

I haven't had success with the markers/pens, but I highly recommend the Loew Cornell 18/0 liner brush.  I use it for all my detail work (and have been for years).  Just make sure not to get the 18/0 script liner brush, those are not rigid enough.

[Trevak Dal]

maybe 'seal' the marker job with a wash/shade?

[Subtle Discord]

Yep, wash is really just an acrylic satin varnish with a diluted amount of pigment suspended in it. I was mixing my own years before it became popular as an off-the-shelf product, and that's all I used; flat or satin acrylic medium thinned and coloured to taste.

[Bryan Blaire]

I'd second the idea of painting the eyes first, and also, don't use pure white for the sclera (whites of the eyes), because these are rarely pure white, or if you do, give them a very light glaze with something sepia (very light), at least in the corners. I usually try to use an undercoat of Rakarth Flesh with a bit of Ulthuan Grey across the center, then paint a simple black pupil mark in the center (and this doesn't have to be perfectly circular, you rarely see a perfect circular iris and pupil area that fits completely in the eyes when opened normally), with a single dot of thin Seraphim Sepia at the corners of the eyes. Also, not sure you really need to use a color pupil, because you aren't really going to be able to see much at 28mm scale from across a table, but you could try.

 

Edit: I also don't paint faces much at all (only done one satisfactorily), because I don't really like unhelmed Marines, so my advice doesn't have that much weight. Here's my only satisfactory set of eyes: http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/224240-stoneburners-etl-3-dws-company-master-wstorm-bolter/?p=3395727

[Noxnoctis22]

I think I might give one of those Pigma Micron pens a shot. I'd be using a wash/shade on them after they're completely dry.

 

Also I should have been more clear, I'm looking more for options for lens on the Space Marines, not that it makes all that much of a difference.

[Subtle Discord]

Bryan Blaire makes very good points about actual eyes, don't make them too white or they tend to look a little... manic. Micron pens are excellent for doing actual eyes for the final iris/pupil dot, and they make them near-round every time. Paint a 'slice' of White for the eye, wash with a pale colour that fits with the feel you want, add a dot with the pen, then 'cut' the outside shape of the eye to refine it. Then paint the face carefully around the eye/s. As Bryan said, it's one thing to say it, it's another thing to actually do it. With practice it gets easier, but in many cases you can even skip eyes (eyes, not lenses in helmets - those you can't skip without detracting) if the face is painted reasonably well.

[Kaedes Nex]

If you can find a Sakura Pigma Micron with the right color, you should use that. But honestly all you need is a fine brush that isn't complete garbage and can hold a tip while wet and some practice.

 

Lenses are ridiculously tiny at first but it gets much easier with exposure and time. Give it at least 20 or 30 helmets before you give up. If you're lucky, and your colors permit it, you can also try painting in the lens sockets with shades instead of paint. Anyone with white helmets or faceplates will let you do this easily, or if you have especially dark lenses over a bright color.

[Andromonoid]

I have no experience with paint markers, so my suggestion would be to cut off parts of a brushes bristles until you get just a few to paint with, then you can do details like never before.

[Noxnoctis22]

I ended up picking a 5/0 angled spot brush and a Sharpie oil based paint marker with an extra fine tip. I'm going to give them both a test. Let's hope the angled brush can improve my paint work. Hopefully the extra fine tip on the Sharpie will be good enough.

[Bryan Blaire]

Noxnoctis, I discussed how I do the "crystal" style lenses in this post in my paint comparison thread. I usually use a Windsor & Newton full size (not the "Miniature" line) 00 brush to do my lenses, and I try to do them when I only have the base color on the helmet (when possible), so that when I get a bit sloppy, which I always do, I can go back and clean up around the lens area more easily, only using one color. The other thing I do is to very carefully touch up with black/a very dark version of the helm color just under the "brow" of the helm above each lens as part of the clean up as well.

 

Good luck however you choose to do them, and let's see some results from your marker trials!