Wolf Scouts?

[Urauloth]

I had a really neat conversion planned out for my wolf scouts. See,  went with the boltgun/bolt pistol scout kit because my plan was to load my pack up with bolters and a meltagun (hence the conversion idea). I knew a lot of people abandoned them completely when they lost the ability to charge from reserves, but I remaine a staunch advocate of metla scouts outflanking with behind enemy lines.

 

Problem is, of course, they can't do that any more either.

 

I have a couple of questions in this thread; firstly, what should I do with my scouts (which, thanks to my backlog and slow working rate, are still unassembled and unconverted) and second, what are you going to do with yours, and what role do you see for them in the 7E codex? Are they worth fielding at all now as anything but snipers?

[logun]

my sniper team will be making a comeback for sure, objective holders mainly. i know they don't have objective secured but could be be quite hard to shift in cover with the cloak upgrade. 

[Urauloth]

For people who have sniper scouts, I can definitely see that being worth it. Cheap rifles and acces to cloaks makes them pretty decent in that role now. Are they good enough at it to be worth investing in for people who don't already have them?

 

I think what I'll do with my standard scouts is shelve them for now and use them as troops when I get around to my planned Blood Angel allied detatchment. Can't see the sense in boltgun, pistol or shotgun wolf scouts, personally.

[Valerian]

I had a really neat conversion planned out for my wolf scouts. See,  went with the boltgun/bolt pistol scout kit because my plan was to load my pack up with bolters and a meltagun (hence the conversion idea). I knew a lot of people abandoned them completely when they lost the ability to charge from reserves, but I remaine a staunch advocate of metla scouts outflanking with behind enemy lines.

 

Problem is, of course, they can't do that any more either.

 

I have a couple of questions in this thread; firstly, what should I do with my scouts (which, thanks to my backlog and slow working rate, are still unassembled and unconverted) and second, what are you going to do with yours, and what role do you see for them in the 7E codex? Are they worth fielding at all now as anything but snipers?

 

My Wolf Scouts were my favorite go-to units in 5e.  I loved them so much, I had two large packs of 8 plus a dedicated WGPL for each.  However, with changes in 6e and 7e, and then more recent changes in our 7e codex, they will remain on the shelf.  Without BEL or assault from Reserves, they simply aren't worth the current price point.  Anything that I could do with them, I can do more reliably with Hunters via Drop Pod, and they'll have much greater Survivability than the Scouts.  So, to answer your question, my Scouts are sitting out their second edition, and will wait to see what 8e brings.

 

I'm not saying, however, that there is no place in a list for Sniper Scouts.  I could see folks making that work, although I still think the price point is high to equip them for that.  I'd go with other options for long-ranged Base of Fire, but at least Sniper Scouts could work for a list designed for that.  My 16 Scouts, however, aren't assembled as Snipers, so this isn't an option for me.  Thus, at the bottom of the transport case they shall remain.

 

V

[Perpetual Dawn]

Too many other good elite choices for me I'm afraid. I don't have any sniper scouts which I think is their best role now maybe.. Still thats 5 spaces for the new stuff to go in the box :(

[skeletoro]

what's better? A 3+ and 4+ cover or a 4+ and a 3+ cover?

 

I mean, ignores cover is 'common' but is it as common as AP3? Depends wildy on your opponent, I guess.

[Nadir]

I would say the 4+/3cover is better. Most weapons ignoring cover are up to 24", so you have to keep scouts behind your lines and just snipe the big boys.

[Squark]

From a purely competitive standpoint? Wolf Scouts are a nonentity. Being 3 points cheaper and having objective secured puts codex scouts so far ahead of wolf scouts it's not even funny (BS 4 < more shots thanks to a larger unit)

 

As for camo-cloaks... Why exactly can't you long Fangs hold you home objective? Frankly, at 17 points a model, wolf scouts with camp cloaks aren't exactly cheap, especially since you can have nearly 3 code scouts w/o cloaks for the price of 2 wolf scouts with them (or, for that matter, you can reinforce the ruin/add telion and give the codex scouts camp cloaks and rock a 2+ cover save).

 

Now, I'm aware a lot of people here dislike allies, but they're part of the game now, so, when I'm speaking from a competitive standpoint, I do have to bring them up, especially when the opportunity cost for Codex Marine Allies is so low.

[skeletoro]

fair enough.i pretty much agree actually,I am just trying to play devil's advocate here. Also I bought 5 scions to build into wolf scouts before the codex hit and now I am trying to figure out what to do with them. Perhaps I should just make some scions that look a bit like wolf scouts and run them with scions rules (but call them wolf scouts)? Could say that the hotshot lasguns are actually frostshot lasguns ;)

note though, it's 16 for a scout with cloak. Were you including the 1 point for rifle?

[Squark]

Yeah, because that's the only weapon I could see someone running on "objective squatting" wolf scouts. If you want just cheap, you could take bolter Grey hunters or even blood claws and have objective secured.

[Frater Cornelius]

Losing OBEL probably was their death sentence. Given our excellent melee power from TWC, TW lords, shooting in form of Helfrost and also our dreadnoughts that can do both we really do not need snipers to take out MCs (especially since they do not have rending anymore since 7ed thus making them useless against mech). And even if, snipers are not very reliable to begin with.

Also given the easy access to codex snipers (and veterans) there really is little reason to take wolf scouts. Sure, they can outflank whereas GH can not most of the time (unless you are playing WUD), but their arsenal is not good enough to justify such maneuvres. GH bring much more bang with drop pods or WUD outflanking.

 

Probably the reason why they did it because OBEL is pretty darn strong and anunusual ability, but they also did not want to move scouts to troops because that is not fluffy.

[MalachiOfRuss]

I too lament the complete nerf that Wolf Scouts got.  The only use I can think for them now is a "plasma caddy" where you have 5 Scouts with a Plasma Gun and 2 Plasma Pistols.  I think that's about 110 points.  It's probably still too much though.

 

It's really too bad though, the "winter camo" paint scheme I did for my Wolf Scouts was something I was really proud of.

[Brother Amarel]

They can move a huge amount around the table with Infiltrate and Scout (I've pretty much sacrificed a unit of Codex Sniper Scouts before to claim an early Objective). If your Elite Slots aren't already used up, then a minimum unit with just a Meltagun still have a use, imo. 

[skeletoro]

Well, we have no shortage of elite slots, with appropriate formation use. lone wolves and WGPLs don't use an elites slot either.

[Pariah Mk.231]

Since I'm planning a full deepstrike army, I had planned on including bolter scouts as being the guys who found the enemy and called in the pods, adding more bolter/plasma shots to help out my first wave grey hunters. This way they can get into a decent position and not require a drop pod, so won't disrupt my first wave.

 

But then, I've never been a very competitive player, I just like building armies and I had a bunch of scout bits that I wanted to use. They might not make the cut for smaller games, but they're still going to be part of my great company.

[logun]

maybe they're not great from a competitive veiw. and maybe i just like a bit more variety than most. but a unit of 6 with camo, snipers and a heavy weapon isn't that expensive, and can still add a little bit of fire support at 36 inches. 

[Valerian]

Since I'm planning a full deepstrike army, I had planned on including bolter scouts as being the guys who found the enemy and called in the pods

Too bad they don't have access to Locator Beacons to actually help with this task.

[Pariah Mk.231]

 

Since I'm planning a full deepstrike army, I had planned on including bolter scouts as being the guys who found the enemy and called in the pods

Too bad they don't have access to Locator Beacons to actually help with this task.

I know, that would have been perfect and given bolter scouts a decent role, with sniper scouts picking out specials/heavies and combat scouts outflanking with melta.