Wolf Guard Void Claws

[Valerian]

You can always magnetize those arms, in case you change your mind later, but I really don't see a downside.  They're Elites, so wouldn't be able to take advantage of Objective Secured anyway, so might as well get your Weapon Skill 5 pack of shredding goodness, that also happens to help with your Reserves.

[Tuckles]

Proxied these guys in a all reserves 3 drop pod, 3 flyer list. Kitted out at min 5 with 5 pairs of WCs and CML. Kept them far away from the bulk of my enemy's eldar force for fear of rending and weight of dice. Didn't run them which made them almost die to a fire prism shot for not much more than a glance to a WS. They did really well with the reserves though, allowing my whole army to come in at turn 2. The void claws did not get into combat.

 

When i run them again, i'm dropping the CML and just running them towards the nearest LoS blocker.

 

8/10. Good unit. Would field again.

[MagneticFreak]

Just asking: If an independent character in TDA, joins the Void Claws unit, dont they lose their abilities, like first turn deep strike?

[Squark]

No. Why would they?

 

I assumed the Stormstrike formation's rule superceded Drop Pod assault, so the pod just goes in regular reserves and isn't even part of the Drop Pod "pool"

[MagneticFreak]

I am saying : Since the character isnt a part of the formation, he should not benefit from the rules they gain. Thus, putting, say, a rune priest in the void claws would prevent them from using their deep strike rules.

[CatSmasher]

I'm wondering if the void claws have access to the +1 modifier for WG. Since they exist as their own formation, they are outside the great company. Bummer.

[Valerian]

I'm wondering if the void claws have access to the +1 modifier for WG. Since they exist as their own formation, they are outside the great company. Bummer.

 

The special rules for the Void Claws includes: 

 

• First Among Equals,
• Kingsguard,
• Sagaborn
• Coordinated Assault
• If Needs Must
• Spearhead Strike

 

Kingsguard is the rule that provides a +1 to the Weapon Skill of various Wolf Guard and TWC.

[Valerian]

EDIT:  If you look through all of the Formations in the CoF supplement, every Formation that actually includes any Wolf Guard have Kingsguard, so it's something you're going to get regardless of whether you use the Detachment or the Formations.  Or any combination of them.

[MadCamel]

I am thinking about joning Arjack to the Void Claw formation. Could be a lot of fun.

[Squark]

I am saying : Since the character isnt a part of the formation, he should not benefit from the rules they gain. Thus, putting, say, a rune priest in the void claws would prevent them from using their deep strike rules.

While it might be worth an FAQ, the pack wouldn't lose the rule unless it specifically said characters joined to the unit caused them to lose the rule. Precedent: Joining characters to Grand Master Mordrak and his Ghost Knights

[MagneticFreak]

 

 

I am thinking about joning Arjack to the Void Claw formation. Could be a lot of fun.

 

You see, I feel this is not possible unless Arjac joins them later in the game, because if he does, the formation requirements are not fulfilled (the description specifies which models/units must be included, and only those). Thus, I dont think Arjac could join the Void Claws before the game and benefit from first turn deep strike ("Spearhead Strike"). Another example would be a WGBL joining the Wolf Guard Thunderstrike: he would not benefit from the Twin-Linked rule. 

 

I tried to find some clarifications about this in the rulebook, but I havent found anything yet...

[magnusthetraitor]

You won't find any clarifications, because you're looking for rules preventing something that isn't against the rules. 

If there were rules preventing it, ala joining an IC to an Infiltrating unit, then there would be a rule there saying you can't do it. As it is, a formation is a collection of models that you must take in a certain manner. They are no different than a normal unit of Wolf Guard Terminators with Wolf Claws, except in the few extra rules they receive. Since there is no rule saying that you cannot join ICs to them either before or during the game, then you can, just like that normal unit. 

Arjac can't normally fly in the sky, but he can if you put him in a Stormwolf. Arjac can't normally teleport in first turn, but he can if you join him to Void Claws.

Try it! Its fun.

 

[Squark]

The formation doesn't include Arjac, no. But nothing stops an independent character from joining the unit before deployment and being deployed with them- so Arjac would get to arrive with them. He would not, however, grant you the reserves re-rolls if the unit was destroyed but he survived.

[MagneticFreak]

I am actually struggling with p. 166 of the rulebook, which says:

 

" When an independent character joins a unit, it might have different rules from those of the unit. Unless specified in the rule itself (as in the Stubborn special rule), the unit special rules are not conferred upon the independent character, ..."

 

 

The formation gives rules to a unit of 5+ WG equipped with lightning claws. The way I interpret the ruling above, I do not see any IC benefitting from rules of a formation, unless explicitly written in the formation description and/or rules granted by the formation.

 

I do not see much room for a debate (although I'd LOVE to see it work!)...

[Lord Ragnarok]

 

 

 

I am thinking about joning Arjack to the Void Claw formation. Could be a lot of fun.

 

You see, I feel this is not possible unless Arjac joins them later in the game, because if he does, the formation requirements are not fulfilled (the description specifies which models/units must be included, and only those). Thus, I dont think Arjac could join the Void Claws before the game and benefit from first turn deep strike ("Spearhead Strike"). Another example would be a WGBL joining the Wolf Guard Thunderstrike: he would not benefit from the Twin-Linked rule. 

 

I tried to find some clarifications about this in the rulebook, but I havent found anything yet...

 

I read it that all WG had to meet the Req's. Nothing about IC's. WG has to be 5 models or more. WG have to have WC's. 

[Squark]

It does seem ambiguous enough that an FAQ might be needed. Given sticking ICs with Deepstrike in Mordrak's Ghost Knights worked in the past, though, I'm pretty sure you should be fine scticking arjac with them.

[Valerian]

I agree that it is ambiguous enough to warrant an email to the FAQ Team and at least request they provide some guidance.  Would be nice to have something definite either way.

[TopToffee]

Desperately hope that is allowed. Arjac coming in with them would be downright scary.

 

Suspect it probably wouldn't be permitted though.

[Urauloth]

I'd want clarification before I felt comfortable attaching characters to the formation, personally. I plan on running them anyway, though, because they're pretty great by themselves.

[magnusthetraitor]

I agree that it is ambiguous enough to warrant an email to the FAQ Team and at least request they provide some guidance.  Would be nice to have something definite either way.

I see this sentiment quite frequently here: "Wait and see what the FAQ team says". I understand the desire for validation from the official source, but you'd be better off coming to a gentleman's agreement with your local playgroup. When is the last time GW actually answered any relevant player questions in an FAQ? Over a year ago, right?

 

If your opponents are game, then let the Thunderhammers fly! Why wait for something that might never come?

[Valerian]

 

I agree that it is ambiguous enough to warrant an email to the FAQ Team and at least request they provide some guidance.  Would be nice to have something definite either way.

I see this sentiment quite frequently here: "Wait and see what the FAQ team says". I understand the desire for validation from the official source, but you'd be better off coming to a gentleman's agreement with your local playgroup. When is the last time GW actually answered any relevant player questions in an FAQ? Over a year ago, right?

 

If your opponents are game, then let the Thunderhammers fly! Why wait for something that might never come?

 

 

That's certainly a good way to handle it (and any issue, for that matter) locally, but doesn't help answer the question globally - and this forum is a global resource for Space Wolves players.  So, when it comes to issues that we can't come to a clear consensus on, we at least have a list compiled of issues/questions that we know need to be resolved.  Whether the FAQ Team addresses them or not is often a frustration, but at least we're doing our part.

[Freman Bloodglaive]

I have a pile of terminators, including five modelled with lightning claws. It's good that there are so many more uses for them now.

[frostclaw222]

If you attach an IC in terminator armor, or Asvald's Armor, for that matter, the IC has Deep Strike, too. Ergo, it shouldn't impact their deployment. Ergo, they can attach. 

 

Now, you want to attach an IC without Deep Strike to the Void Claws, then I can see where there might be a few raised eyebrows, but from where I'm sitting, attaching Njal, Logan, or Arjac, or even a WGBL with Morkai's Claws and Asvald's Armor works just fine with the formation, as no rules conflict exists for the unit to lose/gain.

[skeletoro]

a bit of a necro, but what about deploying the void claws in a drop pod? Is that allowed?

[Sarchas]

Im not the best at building my army lists yet so sorry if this is a daft question. But if you take voidclaws as a formation do they count as one of the elite choices within the CotGW detatchment? meaning you would only have to take and HQ and one more elite choice to make it legal?